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GS Ski Inquiry

post #1 of 94
Thread Starter 
I'd be interested to see what racers are using for their GS races. If you are willing please provide:

1) Your height, weight and age.
2) Your GS Ski Model
3) Your GS Ski Size
4) Races you enter (Nastar, Masters, FIS, etc...)
post #2 of 94
What? Something besides the B5 Metron?!!!

If I wasn't required to use the +21m ski I'd go with more sidecut, though I'll bet some people here will disagree.
post #3 of 94
5'8" and a half. 172 lbs.

I ski a 180 cm Atomic SX:11 skiercross ski for GS in club races and NASTAR(not FIS-legal, it has an 18 meter sidecut.) It's plenty fast. (My only good race last year was the one where we had open GS set, where I won the second run in my division by four seconds--against guys who stomped me to jelly in other races.)

I also have two pairs Atomic GS:11s in 181 cm (the correct length for me) and 186 cm which are fun skis to ski fast on (21 meter sidecut would be FIS-legal, I think, until next year unless I'm one rule change behind.)

The GS:11 isn't turny enough for most of our club racing course sets (and, frankly, isn't as good a ski for my skill level for optimum speeds in most GS courses--the extra sidecut in the SX makes it an easier ski to ski well with.) I was going to use the 186s in the one Super-G club race we have every year, but instead I talked myself into buying a pair of Atomic SG skis (195 cm) which I'm hoping to use in some Masters speed events this year.

(To the tune of an old Beach Boys song: "And he'll have fun, fun, fun till a caught edge took his kneecap away...")
post #4 of 94
I'm 21 years old, 5'8" and 165 lbs. I'm a coach but I also train with my university team. This year, I'll be on Rossignol 9X's in 189 and last year I was on Volkl P60's in 185, but didn't like them.
post #5 of 94
Cool, Max, I'm glad to hear you're considering a GS ski. Free skiing on SL skis is for girly men.

What are you going to be using it for? Racing? Free skiing? If racing, consider the type of course sets you're going to be encountering. >21m is faster if the course is steep and open enough, but if you get into some of the super SL sets on the flats you see in NASTAR and some adult beer leagues a cheater GS of <21m can actually be faster. Which manufacturer is not so crucial, they all make pretty good skis. It's really sidecut and length that make the biggest difference.

For free skiing, definately go with a >21m ski. Learn how to ski a full blown GS race machine at speed can be a hoot. You can lay them over at 40mph like you just can't do on a whimpy little SL ski. Someday everyone putting around on their little 11m clown feet may finally figure out what they've been missing the last few years. Till then, enjoy, you've got the place to yourself.
post #6 of 94
Thread Starter 
Rick, what are you skiing?
post #7 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick View Post
Cool, Max, I'm glad to hear you're considering a GS ski. Free skiing on SL skis is for girly men.
Ouch.

Max, my new setup is the following:
5'7" 160lbs
Nordica Dobermann GSR
186cm
Raced college (USCSA = USSA-like sets, sometimes easier though), will probably race some Masters or possibly some USSA end of season points races if I have the time/money.

That said, get a real GS ski if you are serious about learning to really ski GS. Cheater skis, while fun, don't really teach you anything. If you can really ski GS you can probably take a ski like a Fischer WC RC and ski a slalom course with it and defintiely free ski some slalom-like arcs. Anything else and you are just riding the sidecut.

For you though, I think that skiing GS (predominantly for some time) would give you a slightly different outlook on skiing than what you currently have, so I think it would be good for you. GS will be a new feel for you and may require some new skills or movements to be adapted.

Personally, I love to freeski on GS skis. Often when there are crowds it just does not make sense because it can be dangerous going that fast around other people. When you have a trail to yourself and know the terrain on it well enough to open them up, they are worth it. When choosing a length go at least to a 180. A softer ski manufacturer like Rossignol (great GS ski for mortals BTW) builds GS skis that are very user friendly - even in the longest lengths. I skied a 185 a few seasons back and found that I wanted more ski when the terrain was rough or I was going fast. A ski like that would work very well for free skiing because they can handle not being pushed all the time. My older 182cm Elans and older 182cm Salomon LABs are like that as well. These Nordicas however... I think they are going to be an early morning and training ski...

Later

GREG
post #8 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by Max_501 View Post
Rick, what are you skiing?
I actually have 3 pair I use as a race course or my free skiing taste for the day dictates.

Rossy 181 9X >21

Rossy 190 9X >21 (very race stock)

Elan 182 GSX >21


The Rossy 181 provides a little tighter turn, but doesn't hold like the 190. The 190 holds like you're on rails. The Elan is a very easy, forgiving ski that enters the turn very effortlessly. I think it would be a nice ski for the new GS ski skier. I don't have a GS cheater ski right now.

I'm 6 foot, about 200 lbs
post #9 of 94
I'm 5'10" and 160lbs

This year i'm racing on race stock 180cm head iGS skis. I havn't gotten them mounted yet but i'm excited to see how they perform. I race on my college team.
post #10 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by sir jman View Post
but i'm excited to see how they perform.
Me too. CU or IC?
post #11 of 94
5'11", 193lbs. Race USSA, Masters, and various NASTAR-like leagues.

I just picked up some '04-'05 181cm Rossignol 9Xs for next to nothing, so for the early season I'll be on those and see where I go from there.

For race carvers to use in beer league glalom sets, I have 180cm Atomic GS:Rs and 181cm Dynamic VR27 Geants.

I'm also looking at 21M GS skis from Elan, Nordica, Head, and Blizzard. I've been on Atomic and Fischer for years, and I'd like to see what the other guys are doing these days. I've never been fond of Dynastar, although I'll probably try those sometime or another.
post #12 of 94
Age:19

Weight:165-170 (I dont religiously keep track)

Height:195cm (6'4" ish)

I used to have a 191 Atomic GS11m but after a discussion with the coaches I'm going down 186 with my new GS12

I race ACA(Very little) and FIS is my main circuit.
post #13 of 94
It has been years since I hane been on a true GS ski. I should get on one this season.
post #14 of 94
Rick: Free skiing on SL skis is for girly men.

Heh, heh, I guess it is one way to stay in touch with our feminin side.
post #15 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil Pugliese View Post
It has been years since I hane been on a true GS ski. I should get on one this season.
Well, that explains why you think Metrons are good.
post #16 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by U.P. Racer View Post
Well, that explains why you think Metrons are good.
LOL, I used to ski GS skis exclusively back in 80's-90's. I loved my Salomon 1S's and Dynastar G9's and Volant G-Max's but once skis got more shape and shorter, I went the way of a PowerKarve then to more all-mountain gear.
post #17 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by HeluvaSkier View Post
Me too. CU or IC?
Go Big Red!
post #18 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick View Post
Free skiing on SL skis is for girly men.

You can lay them over at 40mph like you just can't do on a whimpy little SL ski. Someday everyone putting around on their little 11m clown feet may finally figure out what they've been missing the last few years. .
Max-I guess that's one way to look at it, though if you've ever tried to chase Bob H around Bachelor on his SL skis you wouldn't call it putting around. He was a pro racer and Spyder Sabich's training partner 'til Spyder had an "accident" and Bob went off to med school. Bob still beats Nastar pace setters on 160 sl's. (now way is that a real GS but 160 sl's do seem a bit petite) Anyway, his logic is that he can have as big a hoot at slower speeds.

Same goes for JW (sorry some people don't want their names over googled)...he is the worst speed freak I know, but feels his 193 US Ski team Atomics just don't give you much action without pointing them straight down. He's got some SL and cross skis now. I think he likes the feeling that catching an edge at 50 mph will launch him into the woods. You need to go 65 on gs skis to be in same peril.

I'll be in Bend most of January and we'll take out those 193's. I last used them to trounce the field in the PPP race. They are fun, smooth and secure but I'll bet in the end you'll prefer the skis with more sidecut.

I've heard that manufacturers were giving world cup racers illegal skis for testing when they compare brands because they were faster on the tighter radius. I kind of think thats a nasty rumour, because I've also heard that many of the skis used on the world cup are 24-26m. I'll ask JW about that one.
post #19 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick View Post
I actually have 3 pair I use as a race course or my free skiing taste for the day dictates.
Rossy 181 9X >21
Rossy 190 9X >21 (very race stock)
Elan 182 GSX >21
Rick, just curious. What type of terrain do you normally tend to ski? "free skiing" for some may mean simply "not on a race course". for others it may mean hiking a ridge to get some goods or hitting endless bumps. I'd really like to hear how these race skiis handle themselves in extreme conditions such as deep pow, crud and bumps.
post #20 of 94
I also want to add to the comments made by some others that I think a GS sidecut is definitely the way to go for general purpose expert skiing. If not GS sidecut, then definitely close to it. Me personally, I think slalom sidecuts are good for only two things:

1 - Actual slalom racing

2 - Beginning and intermediate skiers that want to be able to turn back across the fall line as quickly and easily as possible using a nice deep side cut while simultaneously ruining any possibility of good mogul lines for other skiers.

An expert can make a >20m ski turn plenty tight for most situations and will give much more stability and just a feeling of smoothness when letting them loose to open up the turns. Generally speaking, when free skiing, if you need to make a tighter turn its probably because you want to control your speed, which means some skidding is not going to hurt you. Most of the time when I'm free skiing, I'm not even close to trying to make arc-to-arc turns unless I am in fact opening it up to GS sized turns. Otherwise, there is constant feathering and speed control happening as the terrain dictates. (its usually steep :-). Having a temperamental SL sidecut is not desirable in that situation. In my experience, when you put a SL on edge it wants to hook up and turn. A GS ski can be feathered with a lot more finesse.
post #21 of 94
Those are a couple of good posts, borntoski... I agree with your comments on SL skis. Alot of fun, not very versatile or useful most of the time. As for the question about "free skiing", ... among racers freeskiing is, in fact, simply skiing without gates present. ie. not training.

I like GS skis for skiing Groomed runs only. ANY time I ski out west in the mountains, I use Volkl Mantra's. 95mm waist, 26M turning radius. I have found those to be very versatile. Great on steeps, easy to smear into short turns, they crush crud, and float in pow. The thing that surprised me most was how they rail on (western) hardpack. Even in gates.

Really GS and SL race skis are to the point that they are BOTH specifically for racing only. I couldn't imagine spending a day at Jackson Hole on a pair of race skis... just couldn't see it.

In the Midwest, (Michigan), I use race skis exclusively.

To answer the original post:

I'm 5'10" 180, 37, Volkl Racetiger GS 180.
post #22 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by borntoski683 View Post
I'd really like to hear how these race skiis handle themselves in extreme conditions such as deep pow, crud and bumps.
USELESS.

That is a bit of an exaggeration, but with so many great choices out there now, I would consider it a wasted day if I had to spend it on race skis in the conditions you mentioned.

Any good skier can make race skis work in any condition. We used to use 200+ skinny straight skis for everything. BUT, there are better tools available now.
post #23 of 94
6 ft, 190 lb, former USSA/USCSA racer

Volkl Racetiger Race Stock GS, 180 cm
Volkl P60 SL Race Stock, 165 cm

Both skis are great fun on the Maine hardpack, Racetiger much more fun when the crowds are minimal, P60 great for threading through people.

Neither is worth a dam when there is anything soft, would never bring them for any trip to the Rockies or west....bring my 186 cm Stockli Stormrider DP for those trips
post #24 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by borntoski683 View Post
Rick, just curious. What type of terrain do you normally tend to ski? "free skiing" for some may mean simply "not on a race course". for others it may mean hiking a ridge to get some goods or hitting endless bumps. I'd really like to hear how these race skiis handle themselves in extreme conditions such as deep pow, crud and bumps.
I'm one of those guys addicted to the feel of a high speed arc, so when I go free skiing this is where I derive my greatest pleasure. I free ski all types of terrain, but when I venture off of arcing terrain, it's just on whatever happens to be on my feet that day. What U.P. Racer says is I'm sure true, but so far I'm blissfully ignorant to it because I haven't yet tried the specialty skis he's referring to. One of these soon to come days, I'm sure. Until then, Borntoski, sorry I can't provide comparisons for you. All I know is I think my race skis work fine everywhere! Better to read what UP says about it.
post #25 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by borntoski683 View Post
I'd really like to hear how these race skiis handle themselves in extreme conditions such as deep pow, crud and bumps.
Wonderful. Well, if race skis are what you like. Anything else is just a toy.

(more the crud and bump, powder of some types can be more fun on something else)
post #26 of 94

Salomon GS LAB vs. Nordica Dobermann GSR

Hi,
I have a painful dilemma:
This winter I can ski on either the Salomon GS LABs 187cm or the Dobies GSR 181cm, both 2005/2006 models (I'd love to keep 'em both but I guess I'll give one pair to my brother).
I am 6'0, 180lbs, used to be quite good, ski in the Dobie 150 WC boots. I no longer race but for my freeskiing I still like to go fast, long, carved turns (I still sometimes try the gates...), mainly on hardpack. Over the past 3 years, I skied on stock Rossi 9x, Atomic GS 11.21 and Salomon 10 2V GS LAB (all around 181cm). I liked them all in different ways (stiff Atomics, nimble Rossi, smooth Salomons). I know that the Dobies and Sollys are different build, maybe a different philosophy but I think I would like both.
Right now, I'm not sure, which pair to keep, Solly or Dobie?:
post #27 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by newfydog View Post
Wonderful. Well, if race skis are what you like. Anything else is just a toy.

(more the crud and bump, powder of some types can be more fun on something else)
Ah, yet another one who is blissfully ignorant!

I'm telling you guys... if you haven't tried a stiff, fat ski in crud, powder, etc... you're missing out. Try one of the following skis:

Volkl Mantra, Dynastar legend pro, Head IM88, Stockli Stormrider DP, or Rossignol B-Squad.

Report back. I was as big a hard core race ski guy as you can get. I've been converted.
post #28 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by U.P. Racer View Post
Ah, yet another one who is blissfully ignorant!

I'm telling you guys... if you haven't tried a stiff, fat ski in crud, powder, etc... you're missing out. Try one of the following skis:

Volkl Mantra, Dynastar legend pro, Head IM88, Stockli Stormrider DP, or Rossignol B-Squad.

Report back. I was as big a hard core race ski guy as you can get. I've been converted.

I've got a big Dynastar Nobis and borrow a friends Sugar Daddies often. Heck, I have some 200cm sno rangers. I've got a free Head 88 rental coupon. I'll give them a try and report back.

Now, everyone, back to Max's question: What GS ski do you use?
post #29 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by newfydog View Post
Now, everyone, back to Max's question: What GS ski do you use?
HA! Yeah, we did get a little off track, eh?
post #30 of 94
6’0”, 210, 52 (well almost 53)


’07 Rossi Radical WC RX RKi 191 (I assume this is still the Y51)
’06 Rossi 9Xti 184 with “Speed Plate” (VIST, not RKi hinged) (Y51)
’05 Rossi 9X 185 w/ RKi plate (Y51)


USSA Masters, NASTAR


I put the “Speed Plate” on my ’06 9Xti’s to get a bit more “beef” under foot (what’s on the Rossi speed skis). This season, however, I am sporting at least 25 less pounds going into the season and haven’t been on skis yet. Things may feel totally different, don’t know. I got the 191 for Master races as I felt I need a bit more “ski” under foot on the big hills. My ’05 9X are a bit stiffer than my ’06 Snub nose. The ’05 is a little more stable, the ’06 initiates very easily. The ’07 191 has both quickness and stability – best of all worlds for me.


Oh yeah, U.P. Racer’s right. The B-Squad (Rossi’s offering for the 104 under foot off piste ski) is basically the same construction as the race ski. It carves like a B^tch and is WAY more fun than the skinny sticks in the pow and crude (on the 194 and have the 188 B3, also a fun ski). Skied the deep and steep at the Bird for the first time in a long time this last spring. Mind blowing how easy they make it and yes, you can arc ‘em on the groomers – just shocking :
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