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Diversity in skiing - Page 3

post #61 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by bklyntrayc View Post
I hate to say, you've got it all wrong. But I must.

Your theory falls to pieces when you look at Sherpas on Everest, darker than most of the Europeans they drag up the mountain.

Melanin is not a reaction to average temperatures, but rather sun exposure. Very cold climates can be found in Africa, India, Pakistan, and "Latin" America.

Sports you qualify as "summer" activities have a very low cost of entry. That's the biggest difference between "winter" sports and "summer" ones. To attain an elite level at ice skating requires extensive practice hours that must be paid for at a rink. There is no cost to play soccer in the park.

Countdown before this thread is moved or deleted has officially begun....
Your point regarding melanin is correct. However, I wasn't equating melanin to skiing. Melanin is simply an example of how Nature equips people to their environment (including the Himalayas and Andes).

Where I was born, in Scandinavia, sunlight is elusive, hence we're extremely pale. That's all melanin has to do with this topic.

I agree that finances are a factor in many sports, including skiing, polo and golf.

Hockey, however: not as much. I grew up on Canada, where every truck-driver's kid could play hockey. It's a national entitlement.

Yet, even in areas where the population is highly diverse (Toronto), you mostly only see Caucasian kids on the ice, regardless of income.

Any white kid can play basketball, and they outnumber blacks 9 or 10 to 1. Yet how many whites make it to the NBA, or even their varsity team? The Black kids, as a group, are better.

You may be completely correct. Skiing may only be a function of money and opportunity.

A couple of years ago I saw a club of black skiers at Vail. It felt right to see the slopes shared.

As the income gap between races is gradually ameliorated, it'll be interesting to observe the effect upon skiing diversity.
post #62 of 89
Final Point: Diversity means: Differences!

Diversity is a healthy thing, so are differences.

In the world today, there's an urgent, strained reflex to quell any acknowledgment of differences.

Certainly, any diminution of a person, country or race is evil, and shouldn't be tolerated.

Differences, however, are a rich and positive influence upon life. Isn't that why males and females seek each other?

Who wants to live in a world where everyone is the same?
post #63 of 89
if the nut of your question is "how to expand the skiing market" i would think the general answer from serious ski-minded individuals would be: "why?" or even "WTF?"

as a long time weekend warrior, it already seems like resorts such as Heavenly and Squaw are way overcrowded with long lift lines, people fighting for space on the runs, etc.

why would any hardcore skier wish to see the skiing market expanded, regardless of race, religion or creed? i don't work for a resort or a ski manufacturer. I'm a consumer. if i'm paying $70 for a day on the slopes, then i want to get as many runs in as possible. outreaching to bring more people to the slopes would, in my eyes, make the value of going skiing less alluring. why do i want to pay $70 to deal with unweildy crowds, long lift lines, and too many people on the runs? hell, i might as well take up x-country skiing (that's what my cousin and aunt and uncle have done) or BC (that's what a number of my friends have done). i'm not even going to get into the traffic that is caused by an influx of skiers (anybody who commutes from SF to Tahoe or Denver to Summit County can relay the nightmares that ensue from overcrowding).

personally, i'd rather see fewer skiers on the slopes.

and i'd be willing to bet that there's a sizable cadre of "locals" who would rather that I and all of my city dwelling, weekend warrior cousins stayed put in the asphalt jungle.

in terms of diversity, heck, i'll ski with whomever will ski with me, as long as they aren't psychotic.
post #64 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by dookey67 View Post
if the nut of your question is "how to expand the skiing market" i would think the general answer from serious ski-minded individuals would be: "why?" or even "WTF?".
Skiing isn't a zero-sum game. The boundaries aren't rigid.

Skier visits have largely remained static over the past decade. Hence, there's been little expansion of ski areas (more have closed than opened).

However, if we encounter another surge of growth as we did in the 70's and 80's, do you think that ski areas wouldn't expand and multiply?

Resort owners are businessman. If they see increased opportunities for growth and profits, they'll respond.

To you: this means more places to ski, and more choices per resort. Similarly, with more traffic, infrastructure expands. Check-out the 4-lane highway now being constructed between Vancouver and Whistler in anticipation of Olymic crowds.

The system can expand to fill the need.
post #65 of 89

Number of skiers v. diversity of skiers

I don't care if the number of skiers goes up (although those in the biz might). I would like to see a greater diversity of people who do ski. For instance, I'm sure that a number of folks would like to see more women skiers. I'm sure the single guys would echo that sentiment. Frankly, I'd like to find more women with whom my wife could ski as well.

It also appears that relatively affluent white folks comprise the overwhelming majority of skiers in the US. I didn't notice a lot of "ethnic" people at Vail; I saw mostly affluent white folks from the midwest (mebbe I was missing something). However, when I go to Canada, I notice more Japanese skiers, and it's always nice to see/hear them (pretty enthusiatic people when I've seen them).

As a hypothetical aside, if there were more Brazilian women skiing, then we'd have a lot more guys of any color wanting to ski. I don't think the guys would complain about rude S. Americans if the Brazilian women showed up...

[FWIW, I disagree with the white skier/ethnic rider theory. I'm Filipino American and a skier (and so are my many cousins, sister, etc). The Bay Area generates a lot of ethnic/mixed ethnicity skiers/rider, i.e. all types, all mixes/ratios. That said, I don't see a lot of different ethnicities when I ski in Colorado or Utah v. Tahoe or Whistler.]
post #66 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain_Strato View Post
Your point regarding melanin is correct. However, I wasn't equating melanin to skiing. Melanin is simply an example of how Nature equips people to their environment (including the Himalayas and Andes).

Where I was born, in Scandinavia, sunlight is elusive, hence we're extremely pale. That's all melanin has to do with this topic.

I agree that finances are a factor in many sports, including skiing, polo and golf.

Hockey, however: not as much. I grew up on Canada, where every truck-driver's kid could play hockey. It's a national entitlement.

Yet, even in areas where the population is highly diverse (Toronto), you mostly only see Caucasian kids on the ice, regardless of income.

Any white kid can play basketball, and they outnumber blacks 9 or 10 to 1. Yet how many whites make it to the NBA, or even their varsity team? The Black kids, as a group, are better.

You may be completely correct. Skiing may only be a function of money and opportunity.

A couple of years ago I saw a club of black skiers at Vail. It felt right to see the slopes shared.

As the income gap between races is gradually ameliorated, it'll be interesting to observe the effect upon skiing diversity.

Ah..but actually-it's about who is playing the sports more.

If you've really been paying attention to Basketball you'll certainly have noticed that American NBA players are no longer among the top international players-

Steve Nash-winner of last TWO MVP's

And More and more NBA GM's are by-passing American College players for Euro and now Latin American stars-the balance of race has dramatically changed in the NBA over the last ten years-and if international results continue as they've been they'll continue to change in the same direction.

Bottom line-the rest of the world starting playing Basketball enthusiasticcally-built up tthere own credible professional leagues and Voila! in a few decades began producing players of NBA (and frankly better) quality-all IRRESPECTIVE of race.

Similar thing has happened in baseball as Latin and now increasingly Asian players have risen to predominance it's a;ll about who is playinng and foocusing on a sport--not the color or the distant past evolution and climatology of race (which-if you were up to date on coontemporary genetics you'd realize is all wrong and invalid anyway).

It seems that racial origins are not the predeterminator of success-furthering my point that connecting diversity to color is small-minded and wrong headed from the get go-

Oh, and on what planet is Football a Summer Sport?
post #67 of 89
I'm with Dino on the women front! although I don't have a wife, so I would just appreciate more attractive single women on the slopes! that's another area of diversity that is sorely out of whack.



When you say Canada, are you referring to Whistler? I know that Vancouver has long been a magnet for Asian influx. Lots of Hong Kong film productions have been filming there for almost 2 decades and counting.
post #68 of 89
I noticed quite a few female Brazilian skiers at Portillo. Whitetail has actually imported Brazilian lifties.

Part of the trick to attracting more diverse populations into the sport is to learn more about their culture and make changes to the sport to make it more attractive to them. There are lots of simple things that can be done (e.g. the food options that are available at the mountain).
post #69 of 89
Thread Starter 
I guess diversity also includes gender- so- How do we get more women to ski?
post #70 of 89

Nobody ever went broke overestimating racism in America

Quote:
Originally Posted by bklyntrayc View Post
Are you saying people actually ski to escape minorities? :

To hear the ski areas tell it, they're hurting for skier visits. Maybe that's why they've been chasing the 'diversity' market so hard lately.

I hear the Yellowstone Club offers the ultimate ability to escape the unwashed masses.

If only that were a completely farfetched idea...don't know about skiing, but an economist from the University of Chicago has argued that something similar applies to golf. He says that a lot of people who don't play golf buy homes in developments where they have to pay big premiums and fess to support the attached golf courses--and that its actually a deliberate strategy on the part of developers and buyers to evade anti-discrimination laws. The paper is available here: http://ssrn.com/abstract=757388
post #71 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by Liam View Post
it's a;ll about who is playinng and foocusing on a sport--not the color or the distant past evolution and climatology of race (which-if you were up to date on coontemporary genetics you'd realize is all wrong and invalid anyway).
You're up-to-date on contemporary genetics?
post #72 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by Liam View Post
furthering my point that connecting diversity to color is small-minded and wrong headed from the get go-
So, you're saying that diversity and color are NOT connected - unless one is small-minded and wrong-headed?

How many people of color have you suggested this notion to?
post #73 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by dookey67 View Post
if the nut of your question is "how to expand the skiing market" i would think the general answer from serious ski-minded individuals would be: "why?" or even "WTF?"

as a long time weekend warrior, it already seems like resorts such as Heavenly and Squaw are way overcrowded with long lift lines, people fighting for space on the runs, etc.

why would any hardcore skier wish to see the skiing market expanded, regardless of race, religion or creed? i don't work for a resort or a ski manufacturer. I'm a consumer. if i'm paying $70 for a day on the slopes, then i want to get as many runs in as possible. outreaching to bring more people to the slopes would, in my eyes, make the value of going skiing less alluring. why do i want to pay $70 to deal with unweildy crowds, long lift lines, and too many people on the runs? hell, i might as well take up x-country skiing (that's what my cousin and aunt and uncle have done) or BC (that's what a number of my friends have done). i'm not even going to get into the traffic that is caused by an influx of skiers (anybody who commutes from SF to Tahoe or Denver to Summit County can relay the nightmares that ensue from overcrowding).

personally, i'd rather see fewer skiers on the slopes.

and i'd be willing to bet that there's a sizable cadre of "locals" who would rather that I and all of my city dwelling, weekend warrior cousins stayed put in the asphalt jungle.

in terms of diversity, heck, i'll ski with whomever will ski with me, as long as they aren't psychotic.
Dookey,

You obviously do not understand the economics of the ski industry. The only reason you're paying $70 dollars a day and not $100+ is because of the massive revenues being generated by real estate sales. Unfortunately, real estate is a finite resource subject to occasionally fickle market forces. The only other ways to make up that revenue are to A) Increase ticket prices; or B) Increase the # of skiers. Which would you prefer?

If you're interested in gaining a better understanding of how the industry operates, you should check out the book, Downhill Slide by Hal Clifford.
post #74 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by FOG View Post
I guess diversity also includes gender- so- How do we get more women to ski?
The answer to this question is to simply flood the market with discounted mens ski pants made with red spandex. Hey - if it works for cycling?
post #75 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by FOG View Post
I guess diversity also includes gender- so- How do we get more women to ski?
Ladies' night.
post #76 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain_Strato View Post
So, you're saying that diversity and color are NOT connected - unless one is small-minded and wrong-headed?

How many people of color have you suggested this notion to?
That is exactly what I'm saying-and as a professor in what is statistically one of the 'most diverse' student bodies in America (says so proudly in our student handbook!) I challenge my students and my colleagues on a fairly regular basis to reconsider what actually makes any community 'diverse'. I've long put forth in public and private arenas that a University would create a far more dynamically and meaningfully diverse community by creating and funding a fine arts department rather than simply manipulating admissions to admit 100 more minority business students in an arena where business management is an already bloated undergraduate field.
Yes-connecting 'diversity' and race is the smallest, laziest and most pedantic approach to achieving a vibrant diverse community (whatever that community may be).

I've recently argued for a broadening of supposed 'diversity in academics' way beyond the meagre concepts of melanin concentrations at an open public forum on affirmative action and public policy in Springfield, MA. The racially diverse crowd had mixed reactions, though, pleasantly from my point of view-there was no racial consistency among how each individual felt. But to the point-"People of Color"-I term I detest-and by which I believe you mean American born Black and possibly Hispanics-have a delightfully mixed response to the notion that diversity might mean more than counting the dark faces-at any rate, most folks seem able to handle the conversation. The most strident responses lately in these public forums are among the growing number of African Immmigrants (and West Indian Immigrants) in Springfield who are generally openly hostile to the whole notion of diversity, entitlement based solely on race and much of the high-handed, paternalistic self-congratulatory Academic and Public Policy approaches to race presently en vogue here in massachusetts. In a lively post lecture conversation a recent Nigerian immigrant-after talking to me and a good colleague for a while pointed out that he felt there was a greater difference between an Ibo countryman and Himself (he is Yoruba) in terms of cultural attitudes, beliefs, mannerisms, expectations than exist between me (and yes, I'm a white American) and him. Now of course, such subjections are hard to qualify or even quantifty, certainly much harder to craft a strategy for diversity from than say the easy (and as I said lazy) approach of merely counting the perceptibly different racial phenotypes in a group. Yet still, though harder to fashion, I contend that they are very much worth the hard work and extra effort to incorporate in any attempt to synthesize this dream of diversity if indeed, one believes that true diversity is a communual virtue worth possessing..

Oh, and to your final question in a previous post-yes, I am up to date and not a layman in field. Generally-when I blow off some computer-time steam in recreationally focused forums I try to keep Professional stuff completely out of the picture--looks like I'm slipping here so-I'll desist and go check out another forum thread and see whether I want a detuned slalom ski or an all-purpose cross ski as my Hard/ irregular snow tool--or maybe finally try one of those Metrons my friends all love.

Any snow in the Wasatch yet?
post #77 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by faisasy View Post
Back on topic...why are there so few minority skiers?

Here are some thoughts on the one particular minority ethnic group I have most experience with: Indians (as in, from the Indian subcontinent -- meant to include Indians, Pakistanis, Bangladeshis). Note that these mostly pertain to immigrants and not to US-born Indians.
  • Indians are generally pretty comfort-loving. A day spent lounging around, hanging out with friends, watching TV, or just even going for a drive are much more enjoyable ventures when compared to going out in the cold, struggling in ill-fitting boots and slipping and sliding on snow.
  • Since Indians, for the most part, come from a pretty warm climate, the cold is hard to take. Lack of knowledge on how to keep warm is the main culprit here.
  • Indians are also very social beings. It would be hard to get an Indian couple to spend a weekend in the mountains skiing or learning to ski by themselves. However, getting 10 or 20 friends/families to go up and spend the weekend together may be a more attractive option. Having non-skiing options will attract non-skiers in the bunch.
  • Athletics and sports aren't a big part of the Indian culture once you "grow up". Sure there are a lot of kids playing football and cricket in the streets and fields, but once you're out of high school, participation in sports drops drastically. When Indians therefore come to the US they don't bring a huge past experience of physical activity. It'd be hard to get excited with the idea of yo-yoing up and down the mountain all day.
  • Cost, as always, is a big barrier to entry.
As I mentioned, these apply mostly to those who have immigrated to the US. Indians who are born here in the US don't necessarily match all these stereotypes -- however, living in the immigrant culture, it'll probably take a generation or two for distinctly non-Indian activities like skiing to take hold.

It would be interesting to hear from instructors about what kind of return visits they've had from minority students.
I beg to differ on some of your points from a personal perspective....
1) I am a cold hog, winter beats summer hands down....
2)I spend 60-70% of my free skiing time alone, it gives me the chance to push myself a little beyond my comfort zone, allows me to progress technique which would not be done had I been in a large group


I speak from the perspective of a large number of sides being discussed here...

I am,
-an immigrant
-a US citizen
-never saw real snow until about 8 years ago
-Grew up in E-africa
-Hadn't skied until 2001
-Am of southasian (indian)
-(Almost) full time ski instructor PSIA L1

Here;s what I see amongst south asian students and friends who don;t really ski...

I've had numerous south asian students who are never evers, and have returned for a second/third lesson later on in the season. This is everyone from the US born indian kid whose parents don;t/never will ski or the ones whose parents DO ski and are getting their kids to learn. I've also had numerous comments from these groups about the first time they've seen a brown dude instructing (positive remarks that is). In regards to the type of skiing, I've never seen an indian racer, or someone with a high level of technical ability i.e. PSIA L8 or above, mostly the return/ regular indian skiers relegate themselves to the green/blue plateau.
Why? This has to do a lot with the indian mentality of cautiousness; i.e. fear of injury, which in my opinion is due to the general indian mentality of living life on the tamer realm of things. This is true amongst my non skiing friends who have come out on the once- a year excursions, I see the same level of cautiousness on the slope.
Another thing I've noticed is the growing number of parents who push skiing on their younger kids in an effort to 'add to the resume' which is a very common theme amongst imigrant indian parents and their first generation US born kids. I've had mixed results with these kids, some seem to pick up the basics right away and keep on track with the normal progressions while others lets say take a while and don't have the urge/drive to learn to ski.

The south asian market is a huge untapped income earner for resorts, especially in the NE. There is a large proportion of south asians who can afford(monetarily) to ski but don't because of the lack of exposure. I think as time progresses, there will be this shift and you'll see the brown folk RETURNING to the slopes in larger numbers

Also, YUKI mentioned resorts hiring the barely ski proficient minority instructor to overcome language barriers, I think I may know who she is reffering to; didn't see her get too many lessons though, sometimes, at a place like __ ____, it becomes a necessary evil in order to satisfy the customer....
post #78 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by makwendo99 View Post
I speak from the perspective of a large number of sides being discussed here...
And I am speaking from the perspective of being a member of the Indian subcontinent population -- one who is addicted to skiing, and one who loves winer now more than summer as well. I don't think we're much in disagreement though.

Quote:
Originally Posted by makwendo99
This has to do a lot with the indian mentality of cautiousness; i.e. fear of injury, which in my opinion is due to the general indian mentality of living life on the tamer realm of things.
Not much different from what I touched on when I mentioned "comfort loving". Given the choice between a potentially dangerous and physically tiring activity and just hanging out, most Indians will usually choose the latter. In the India/India-American students you teach, do you see any difference in this comfort-loving, fear-avoiding, mentality in Indian kids who were born and brought up in the US, and are therefore perhaps more assimilated into US culture?

Quote:
Originally Posted by makwendo99
The south asian market is a huge untapped income earner for resorts, especially in the NE. There is a large proportion of south asians who can afford(monetarily) to ski but don't because of the lack of exposure. I think as time progresses, there will be this shift and you'll see the brown folk RETURNING to the slopes in larger numbers
Do you think this will happen on its own as the Indian-American population discovers skiing? Do resorts need to do something to actively attract them (or speed up the process)? Should they?
post #79 of 89

Diversity

Diversity when skiing. Now theres something I really have never thought about - until now. I taught two brother from India last year. Nice guys, great sense of humor and absolutely the worst prospective skiers I have ever seen. No muscle tone at all, couldn't ever stand up after falling. Did I b lame this on where they're from, NO but I've never seen a 25yr odl male this pathetic.

Also I want to thank some of you for putting/labeling me into the
White Fright category. Yes I moved 1100 miles and why? 1. almost no crime 2. almost no people 3. almost no traffic 4. lower taxes 5. lower fees on everything 6. cheaper lift tickets 7. no lift lines 8. less people in the entire State than the Sacramento Meto area 9.friendly people 10. a whole lot less politically correct babble AND for sake of brevity I won't even mention all the other reasons.
post #80 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by makwendo99 View Post
In regards to the type of skiing, I've never seen an indian racer, or someone with a high level of technical ability i.e. PSIA L8 or above, mostly the return/ regular indian skiers relegate themselves to the green/blue plateau.
Agreed -- most Indians are generally terminal green/blue skiers/riders. But you should come out and ski with Team UPS -- there are good Indian skiers and riders.
post #81 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by faisasy View Post
And I am speaking from the perspective of being a member of the Indian subcontinent population -- one who is addicted to skiing, and one who loves winer now more than summer as well. I don't think we're much in disagreement though.

Not much different from what I touched on when I mentioned "comfort loving". Given the choice between a potentially dangerous and physically tiring activity and just hanging out, most Indians will usually choose the latter. In the India/India-American students you teach, do you see any difference in this comfort-loving, fear-avoiding, mentality in Indian kids who were born and brought up in the US, and are therefore perhaps more assimilated into US culture?

Do you think this will happen on its own as the Indian-American population discovers skiing? Do resorts need to do something to actively attract them (or speed up the process)? Should they?

Actually, from what I've seen, just from a physical perspective, both immigrant and US born indian kids that I've taught do in fact have a defensive mindset when it comes to athletic endeavors i.e. sitting back on the skis/ fear of exploring terrain even a little outside their comfort zone and aversion to falling, all of which I see as extensions of the 'take care' mentality. Its pretty amazing, I have friends who have no problems driving at 70mph on a 40mph road but look like deer in your headlights typeps when they are pointed downhill on a pair of boards on the learning slopes!!

As to the question of resorts targeting south asians, I don't see that as a commercially viable thing at the moment...just not enought of a return market; sure you'll get a ton of people out on a promotional day but just like the rest of the newbie skiing population, you really have to want to learn to ski to come back, which is unfortunately not representative of the mindset of the indian population.
Sure...the market is there, like I said but it is gonna take some serious convincing to get people to get out. A more viable option might be community ski clubs. I know a lot of religious/community groups do regular trips and I've had plenty students come out, but a lot of these are also once a season deals. Maybe a more regular club type offering where 4-6 trips a season might entice the crowd a little more.
post #82 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by Liam View Post
That is exactly what I'm saying-and as a professor in what is statistically one of the 'most diverse' student bodies in America (says so proudly in our student handbook!)
Springfield, Ma., eh? Interesting place. I was there last week.

Almost got T-Boned at a suicidal intersection you have there call the "X" (Dickinson, Belmont and Sumner).
post #83 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by faisasy View Post
Agreed -- most Indians are generally terminal green/blue skiers/riders. But you should come out and ski with Team UPS -- there are good Indian skiers and riders.
One of my good ski buddies is Indian. He's only skied for a few years, but he's a total Kamikaze - no fear whatsoever.

He doesn't get many point for style, but he'll tackle terrain mountain goats avoid.

I read that the Hare Krishna grandson of Ford (yes, that Ford), is the major investor in a new $300 million ski resort planned for the Himalayas.

Only a fraction of India is in the Himalayas, so it'll be interesting to see how the populace responds. India has over a billion population, so the hit percentage doesn't have to be big for a solid success.

I wonder how the snow is.
post #84 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by Latchigo View Post
As for driving, my only experience is San Francisco to Lake Tahoe and on that basis I thought American drivers were very easy going. Try driving in Paris or Rome. Maybe New York is different. It always seems so when you see it on the telly. I have been there but never driven there.

On the illegal immigration issue, the Greeks just sling them overboard as close as possible to the Turkish coastline. That way it is a double whammy. You get rid of illegals and dump the problem on your old enemy at the same time. Of course the Turks do the same in reverse. I do feel sorry for poor old Malta and the Canary Islands though.
Yeah, most US drivers are courteous and skilled compared with Australians. I exempt New York drivers from that though.

We put our illegal immigrants on Nauru! Know what Nauru's made of? Bird poo!
post #85 of 89
News item on Denver's 9News this morning: Alpino wants to bring more minorities to mountains.
post #86 of 89

Diversity

LIAM and STRATO, Informative and refreshing to read your posts/views. For what its worth you both said it well! I couldn't have said it any better-so I won't.
post #87 of 89
fully admitting that I am taking the following quote slightly out of context, but this comes from the second paragraph on the Loveland homepage:

"It’s an elite club that makes you a cherished member the moment you arrive."

The fact that they refer to skiing as an "elite" activity more or less sums up the "lack of diversity" i would say. the very word "elite" always seems at odds with the word/concept of "diversity". At least in my humble (and often skewed) world vision.

or maybe not.

post #88 of 89
So will Alpino be the Hispanic equivalent of the National Brotherhood of Skiers? I was pretty impressed by the NBS skills when they were up at Sunshine last year.

It strikes me that the key factors in hitting the slopes relate more to income, free time, attitudes to outdoor recreation, and peer group instead of ethnic origin. Over the weekend I was touring my daughter through a couple of Vancouver universities and we noticed the ski club at SFU had a booth promoting their first ski trip to Big White. Interestingly enough, based on this thread, the four students staffing the booth were all Asian (they may have been volunteers from one of the campus ethnic associations, but it still illustrates the point). An Asian or Indo-Canadian wouldn't stand out at all on the slopes at Sunshine or Louise, and I suspect Whistler would have the same demographic (not having skied there I couldn't vouch but I'm sure other folks can).

I also took a gondola ride up Grouse Mtn. while we were in Vancouver. The crowd at the top was fully as diverse as the crowd on any of Vancouver's streets. I may have to check it out during ski season and see if the same holds true then. Or maybe I'll wait until my daughter can enjoy the under $400 Whistler season pass and the $20 nights at the UBC hostel next year, and join her there (strictly out of a sense of scientific curiousity to study this issue).
post #89 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by gnjantzie View Post
I also took a gondola ride up Grouse Mtn. while we were in Vancouver. The crowd at the top was fully as diverse as the crowd on any of Vancouver's streets. I may have to check it out during ski season and see if the same holds true then. Or maybe I'll wait until my daughter can enjoy the under $400 Whistler season pass and the $20 nights at the UBC hostel next year, and join her there (strictly out of a sense of scientific curiousity to study this issue).
During the winter, the crowds at Grouse change a bit. Not as diverse. In the summer, the Grouse Nest and Tram are tourist attractions, like the Capilino Suspension Bridge. Everyone goes.

In the winter, it's more for skiers and boarders.

Still good diversity, but mostly Asians and Whites.

The Asian influx in Vancouver is amazing. When I grew up in Vancouver (60's), one occasionally saw an Asian, and almost never a Black or Hispanic. In those days, Vancouver was all flavors of Caucasian, from varied European backgrounds.

Now, parts of Vancouver (especially the south and Delta) are almost 100% Chinese. In some Delta shopping centers, you won't find one English sign, or one person who isn't Chinese. It's not just a "China Town" (Vancouver has one of those), it's a major area of the region.

I've always got on well with the Chinese. I respect them, their courtesy, and their work ethic.

However, I now feel out of place when going to those areas. The intense, local racial concentration is something I've never seen elsewhere in the US or Canada.

Most are first-generation immigrants from Hong Kong.

As time goes on, I wonder if these extreme racial concentrations will assimilate, and diversify.

Is that a good thing?
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