or Connect
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Ryder Cup

post #1 of 24
Thread Starter 
Why did the US not do better ?

They have the top three ranked players.

If McGinley's match had not been interrupted by a streaker it would probably have been a record score.
post #2 of 24
They got smoked!!! Tiger and Verplank were the only ones that really did anything with an honorable mention to Zach Johnson.

I will say that Euro's played REALLY well and 12 Tiger's is about the only way we could have made it close this year. Hats off to the European team.
post #3 of 24
Well deserved and I'm glad the Euro's won. I would much rather throw down a few pints with that bunch than the stuffy American team.
post #4 of 24
The comment was made over here about the US team not smiling - it was very noticeable - even when they won holes, or rounds, there wasn't even a glimmer on their faces.
post #5 of 24
Should it now go back to pre-1979 days of being GB & Ire against the US?
post #6 of 24
I don't think there's a simple answer to why the US plays so poorly in Ryder Cups lately. Other than Tiger, I don't think anyone else gets fired up enough to play to win. I also think the US team feels the pressure and doesn't know how to stay loose. There's more too it than that, but that is one of the main things.

Golf is a funny game in that it's generally perferable to play as though the outcome doesn't matter than to care too much about the outcome. Like it or not, I think the US team gets too caught up in the result and forgets the process.
post #7 of 24
I watched a little obit of it. Yeah, they got whooped handily.

One thing I noticed was that Tiger's recod was something like 9-13-2 in Ryder cup matches. He won a few this week, but I think he got hammered on the first day(??). He basically sucks at match play, when compared to his normal success at stroke play. He's been beat by some pretty low level players. I wonder why that happens?
post #8 of 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by SrMike View Post
I don't think there's a simple answer to why the US plays so poorly in Ryder Cups lately. Other than Tiger, I don't think anyone else gets fired up enough to play to win. I also think the US team feels the pressure and doesn't know how to stay loose. There's more too it than that, but that is one of the main things.
Zach Johnson in team play impressed me.

I think the emphasis on "team" during the Ryder Cup for the Americans comes off as phoney or forced. The pre-round press conferences showed that they were making an effort at being a team, but how can you really be a team just a week before the event. The Europeans interact on their tour (stay in the same hotels, eat together etc) and really get to know and enjoy each other. Our guys do not, but you know, that might be OK.

Americans really are more individual minded, so why not just go with it? They were totally out of their element when conferring on every shot with their team mate. If they can't work as a team, I would rather they just go out and embrace who they are talk to their caddies about club selection and concentrate the way they always do.

Or the PGA should make some changes and make the Ryder Cup a real priority and do things more like the Europoean tour.
post #9 of 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnH View Post
I think he got hammered on the first day(??). He basically sucks at match play, when compared to his normal success at stroke play. He's been beat by some pretty low level players. I wonder why that happens?
He doesn't seem to be a team player - no, don't read too much into that - but when he plays his own game on his own terms, he does well. When he has to play with someone else, it doesn't work as well.

(some cynics have said that the problem is that there isn't prize money involved, and so some players aren't motivated enough to play - I doubt it, but if that is the case then it's sad)
post #10 of 24
How bout making it North America vs Europe...would it be more even?
Lets see....Mexico?...no help there I don't think
Canada?...I'd take Mike Weir but that's probably it
post #11 of 24
Who said they played poorly? I thought the level of play was impressive on either side. I'd call it an example of great sports entertainment, but not a definitive contest, which I would call the money rankings on the Pro Tour.
post #12 of 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnH View Post
I watched a little obit of it. Yeah, they got whooped handily.

One thing I noticed was that Tiger's recod was something like 9-13-2 in Ryder cup matches. He won a few this week, but I think he got hammered on the first day(??). He basically sucks at match play, when compared to his normal success at stroke play. He's been beat by some pretty low level players. I wonder why that happens?
Tiger Woods in no way sucks at match play, in fact he may be one of the best at match play we've ever seen. His 3 straight junior amateurs followed by 3 straight us amateurs puts him in the match play statosphere.

Tiger loses in the Ryder Cup because he has to play with someone else, simple as that. He has lost one singles match in Ryder cup play and 12 matches where he had a teamate. I dont know whether the teamate throws him off or whether the teamate just isnt used to pairing with someone like tiger. Either way He's 3-1-1 in the singles matches and 6-12-1 in the foursomes and four-ball. Solve the pairing problem and you help the Americans immensely.

Europe always has complimentary pairs and the us just seems to throw them together. Perhaps Tiger should be paired with a rookie that he can take under his wing and have a little influence over, lord knows nothing else has worked.
post #13 of 24
Thread Starter 
I just do not understand 'the US are not team players' explanation.

I am told US club and university golf (which is insignificant in the UK ) have a team emphasis. Fourballs and foursomes should not be a completely alien concept.
post #14 of 24
Don't need to tell you guys that the Ryder Cup matches were ignored for years between '50 and '85. 1979 would be the first year in which the Ryder Cup would pit the U.S. against the best from all of Europe. The matches soon became very competitive and interest from the public shot way up. Some of the current Euro dominance may come from playing on links courses that Americans are not as comfortable with. Some of it comes with the camaraderie and (former) underdog attitude the Euros have going for them. Some of it is also just who has the hot putter this week. But golf is like basketball, the US isn't the only dog in the show anymore. The Americans may get more competitive if/when their new crop of competitors get more seasoned.
post #15 of 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by BradMaier View Post
Tiger Woods in no way sucks at match play, in fact he may be one of the best at match play we've ever seen. His 3 straight junior amateurs followed by 3 straight us amateurs puts him in the match play statosphere.

Tiger loses in the Ryder Cup because he has to play with someone else, simple as that. He has lost one singles match in Ryder cup play and 12 matches where he had a teamate. I dont know whether the teamate throws him off or whether the teamate just isnt used to pairing with someone like tiger. Either way He's 3-1-1 in the singles matches and 6-12-1 in the foursomes and four-ball. Solve the pairing problem and you help the Americans immensely.

Europe always has complimentary pairs and the us just seems to throw them together. Perhaps Tiger should be paired with a rookie that he can take under his wing and have a little influence over, lord knows nothing else has worked.
Thanks for the edumakation.

So, do the boys from down under (to include anyone south of the border) not get to play in the Ryder Cup? Aren't there enough to make up a team?
post #16 of 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnH View Post
So, do the boys from down under (to include anyone south of the border) not get to play in the Ryder Cup? Aren't there enough to make up a team?
...that was the Dunhill Cup...

The 16 countries represented:
  • Argentina
  • Australia (Aussie, Aussie, Aussie)
  • China
  • France
  • Germany
  • Ireland
  • Japan
  • New Zealand
  • Scotland
  • South Africa
  • Spain
  • Sweden
  • United States
  • Wales
  • Zimbabwe
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunhill_Cup
post #17 of 24
One of the big reasons for Tiger's success is his ability to scramble. How many times has he saved par or made birdie after a tee shot into the woods? If he is playing with a partner that cannot save him when he makes a mistake, they lose a hole. A few times in a round and it is over. That does not make him a bad team player.
post #18 of 24
I don't think that's the whole story - because Seve was like that, and his results in the Ryder Cup weren't bad.
post #19 of 24
Tiger is 156th in fairways hit. He is in the fairway 59% of the time. It is amazing that he as successful as he is with that stat. Even if his partner is not in the trees, the rough can cost a stroke.
post #20 of 24
I am not saying that it is 100% of the problem, but I think it is definitely part of the problem.
post #21 of 24
FWIW, Lefty isn't impressive either. His is 160th with 58% of fairways hit. That may explain his poor RC performance.
post #22 of 24
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnH View Post
So, do the boys from down under (to include anyone south of the border) not get to play in the Ryder Cup? Aren't there enough to make up a team?
No. Strictly GB and Ireland.

Sergi O'Garcia and Joe O'Lazabal played well
post #23 of 24
"Ole...ole, ole, ole...Ole, ole."
post #24 of 24
There are various factors to take into account, including the fact that mentally the US golfers (and Eldrick in particular) are in a completely different place to the European version. For them, it really is a job and it really is all about me, me, me.

The European boys at the moment - and there is no guarantee it will continue - still benefit from the fact that their tour is, by comparison with the big show in the US, smaller, friendlier, more rough and ready. 15 to 20 years ago, your average Euro player (ie, largely GB & I, as even with the rise of Seve and Bernhard and co the European element was still minor) would play his round, try to beat his oppo's brains out ... and then get bladdered with him in the bar. And was as likely to do that on Saturday night as before Wednesday practice. They were mates. Ian Woosnam used to drive to tournaments in a 20yo VW Kombi, surviving on baked beans and toast and six packs of beer.

Nowadays they tend to go to bed early, or at least earlier - but the attitude remains.

After the final putt dropped, David Toms was asked what the US team would do. He said they'd spend some time together as a team, think about what they'd done right and wrong, and travel tomorrow.

Pardon?

If Woosie's boys had lost, they would have headed for the bar to drown their sorrows, and tried to drag the winners in to help. They would have insulted and abused each other and laughed till they cried, because they are a team. They're mates. Padraig Harrington got half a point from five matches; he got the biggest cheer from his mates.

You can't talk about the courses, as such. The K Club was designed by an American, for American tourists. The US are unlikely to ever have such a good opportunity again in Europe - I certainly hope not; the Cup should be held on links over here, I think.

So much of it is intangible. Yes, the US had the (deservedly) top three in the world. But Europe had nine of the top 25; that's depth. And everyone in the team wanted to be in the team. Did you see Bjorn's anger at not being picked? But Woosie was right; if he had DC in the team, he had to have Lee Westwood to play with him.

But despite the glum faces of the US team, let's not forget their demeanour; I have rarely seen such grace in defeat, and their attitude and sportsmanship was a joy to watch. McGinley's gesture in offering a half to a rookie who had a 20ft putt was simply recognition of an individual opponent who had given his all, and a team which had brought nothing but credit on themselves.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: General Sports