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New FIS race gear regulations

post #1 of 22
Thread Starter 
I just read on skiracing.com that the FIS is altering the regulations for standheight GS sidecut and the minimum width for all boards... Is it just me or do they do this on purpose sectionally to get peoples to change over their gear :... Damn ski constructors... Although I dont see the Slalom lenght alterations they were supposed to impose...

this is only for the 07-08 season
post #2 of 22
"Giant slalom ski radiuses will be regulated as well. For men, the GS ski minimum radius will be 27 m and the women's 23 m."

I guess it's time to throw out all those 23m GS skis. Nobody will want them, I guess 'cause 23 is too much for most recreational skiers and not enough for the FIS racers. You can always give your old GS11s to me though
post #3 of 22
27m is big... The width shouldn't be an issue as most skis these days are over those dimensions... but the radii... That is a tough one to call. I don't think they are making the skis any safer by going to larger radii. In fact because racers will now need more rotary to bring the skis around in tight spots where they used to still be able to carve cleanly, they might be hurting racers even more. I would be curious to see their data... Hopefully USSA will not adopt these rules verbatim or a lot of smaller/less skilled racers are going to be hurt I think. We shall see I guess.
Later
GREG
post #4 of 22
I can't wait to ski the fat 67mm waisted DH boards. They are going to be sick in the pow! Did anyone ever see the stickers Trevor Wagner made that said "FIS?"
Have fun
post #5 of 22
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by HeluvaSkier
27m is big... The width shouldn't be an issue as most skis these days are over those dimensions... but the radii... That is a tough one to call. I don't think they are making the skis any safer by going to larger radii. In fact because racers will now need more rotary to bring the skis around in tight spots where they used to still be able to carve cleanly, they might be hurting racers even more. I would be curious to see their data... Hopefully USSA will not adopt these rules verbatim or a lot of smaller/less skilled racers are going to be hurt I think. We shall see I guess.
Later
GREG
I agree. I myself run on a 191 GS ski but im quite the tall fella and it works quite alright. But some younger FIS runners will have a hell of a time in some death FIS courses As for the standheight I dont think ts going to be so much of a difference... I mean with the plate and the boot it adds to less than a centimeter... but if they say it will reduce knee injuries well I am all for it. Width? Probably to have a lesser death wobble factor maybe.
post #6 of 22
I agree with Helluvaskier. The height and width changes are not too drastic, but going from 21m to 27m minimum radius is a massive change. Guess we'll see more of this: http://www.ronlemaster.com/images/20...e-pc-gs-1.html
post #7 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by HeluvaSkier
27m is big... The width shouldn't be an issue as most skis these days are over those dimensions... but the radii... That is a tough one to call. I don't think they are making the skis any safer by going to larger radii. In fact because racers will now need more rotary to bring the skis around in tight spots where they used to still be able to carve cleanly, they might be hurting racers even more. I would be curious to see their data... Hopefully USSA will not adopt these rules verbatim or a lot of smaller/less skilled racers are going to be hurt I think. We shall see I guess.
Later
GREG
I think the point of longer radius is to require some rotation and skidding in the course. When racers can carve too easily, the range of finish times tends to get real small. Nobody wants a race where the top 20 guys finish with a couple of tenths. In race like that, start order and wax is more important than the athletes' skill.
I also think that the safety issue is misunderstood, I don't think long radius skis are intrinsicly safer than short radius skis, but to get a course that can't be too easily carved with short skis you need to increase the gate offset, and that brings the course too close to the trees. I think FIS believes that they have gone as far as than can to increase gate offset, so the only other choice is longer skis.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HeluvaSkier
Hopefully USSA will not adopt these rules verbatim or a lot of smaller/less skilled racers are going to be hurt I think. We shall see I guess.
Later
GREG
Actually, if the rules hurt the less skilled racers that's only fair, but the smaller kids have been complaining and they have a point. USSA hasn't been very helpful about this issue.

BK
post #8 of 22
Predictions for next year, Chose LPs, Super Mojos, Big Stix or Bros and GS is moved to backcountry.
post #9 of 22
Ski racing is regressing. Straight skis are coming back. By 2010, we'll be racing all events on 200+ skis with massive pivots on every turn and the step will return to slalom.
post #10 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by real9999
Ski racing is regressing.
WTF? a 21 meter ski sucks to freeski, no one will want GS skis now!
post #11 of 22
Thread Starter 
I figures that they will still have the non stock customer friendly <21 skis out there though
post #12 of 22
27 is huge, wow. A 21 or 23 can get nasty in a tight course, I wouldn't be incedibly interested in wrestling with a 27.
post #13 of 22
most mens GS skis in ~185 are 24m plus already, but as a rule???
post #14 of 22
What was the radius of a GS or SL ski in the late 80's? Can anyone enlighten us?

Less than 8 years ago, if you had asked, it woulda been "Radius? Wha's that?"

Racing on 205-210cm's with 'straight cuts' - it was skiing - it was fun - it necessitated a full skill set -

As an upcoming jr, getting big skis was a right of passage, not a submission to failure.

Are we spoled?

Safety is good.
post #15 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by whygimf
Are we spoled?

Safety is good.

yes, but how to 2 mm lower boots and skis that are wider by a few mm make skiing safer? I was coaching when all this regulating started, there was always that racer who tried to run a 50 mph GS on SL skis with 80 mm of lift or the kid who was racing a DH on 10 year old GS skis. Then it made some things safer.

Yet a 27 meter ski for a 16 year-old in a 185 cm??? As a reference: Rossi's 188/196 SG boards are 28/30 meter skis. How does struggling to turn a ski make it safer? I raced on 207-210 GS skis & they sucked, thats why you don't see them around any more.

This is one more move that pushes "skiers" away from "racing". How many average skiers or even good skiers here (yeah there are some racers on this board who own race skis or some powder skiers w/ min sidecut) reach into the quiver & pull out a 27-ish meter ski for a regular day of free skiing?
post #16 of 22
It may also have the effect of accelerating the trend discussed here:
http://forums.epicski.com/showthread.php?t=40685
post #17 of 22
The GS radius seems rediculous to me everywhere outside of the world cup circut. Juniors and young light weight skiers are going to get killed by this, especially the guys (23m for women is not that much of a jump). this may open the courses up a little bit though. If you watched ski races this year, the GS gates were very close to each other vertically and very horizontally offset. If they go to having fewer gates in the race, it may keep the skiers in the turn for slightly longer.

For reference though, I have a video in the instruction section of me skiing on my GS skis (Elan GSX Race Stock). They have a 22.9m radius and I was carving very tight turns on them (smaller than most FIS GS courses) and using a lot of offset... Carving a larger radius ski will not be that much more difficult; unless the couse sets are kept the same. Hopefully those who are setting courses from FIS down to USSA will realize that they are going to have to adapt their sets to the new skis. Whether that is a good thing or not is up for debate...

Later

GREG
post #18 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by whygimf
What was the radius of a GS or SL ski in the late 80's?
c. 50 meters.
post #19 of 22
A slight elaboration:

Rossignol 7GK (1991): 85-65-74 (my measurement) = 56m @ 204
Kneissl White Star (1998!): 85-65-74 (eBay listing) = 59m @ 210
K2 710 slalom ski (c. 1976): 84-65-75 (my measurement) = 51m @ 195
"Typical SL ski" (1970): 88-67-78 (Encyclopedia of Skiing) = 53m @ 210

Remember also that there was a brief period when slalom skis might have less sidecut than GS skis, before what were originally called "shorty" slalom skis took over.
post #20 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by sjjohnston
Remember also that there was a brief period when slalom skis might have less sidecut than GS skis, before what were originally called "shorty" slalom skis took over.
I remember that when SL skis and mogul skis were considered the final holdout for straight skis. Funny how they went on to be the two extremes with SL skis having the deepest sidecuts and moguls skis are pretty much still straight and skinny.
post #21 of 22
well theres a reason not to invest heavily in a pair of race stock boots next year!! i guess unless you plan ahead and drop to the new boot height sooner than required
post #22 of 22
Sjjohnston..Isn't the "White Star" Y FAR! the longest running ski model?..I think so..1962 or so..the first of the "epoxy/laminate" skis..to 1998 I think was it.The Dynamic VR27's had a real long run too..I have a pair of the yellow/black Killy ones..208's as well as a 1997/8 pair.I think the Killy ones are early 70's that I have.Fischer RC4's got started in the late 70's early 80's I think..their predecessor the C4 got goin' I think in the late 60's.Actually I think that Kneisll had a year or twooff and then started making shaped skis..back to the early red and white star series..in 2001 or 2..
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