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Skiing in France

post #1 of 15
Thread Starter 
I'm contemplating a trip to France this year and was wondering how others feel about the subject given how politicized that country has become. I understand that many of the participants on this forum are not from the U.S. or even North America for that matter. However, we all probably have an opinion on this issue. PEACE! [img]smile.gif[/img]

[ June 19, 2003, 05:21 AM: Message edited by: West Virginia Skier ]
post #2 of 15
Sorry, I wouldn't let a political difference of opinion prevent me from going to a country.


P.S. We had a similar thread to this one a few months back, and the guy who started it never bothered to come back and tell us what he found.
post #3 of 15
Originally posted by West Virginia Skier:
...given how politicized that country has become.
Sorry, meant to add this in - I disagree with you - they haven't become politicized.
The French are well known for having their own opinions about things, and not concerned what others think of them.
During the Iraq war there was a spiral of hatred generated by a few ON BOTH SIDES, but, apart from extremists, the French have moved on. You will be treated with the same contempt that all tourists receive in France [img]smile.gif[/img] , my experience of French people is that they treat individuals as such, and not as representatives of nations, unless the tourists decide to act as representatives. Someone may ask you for your opinion on something that your country does, and may want to discuss it with you, but they are an open minded people who like to discuss things.
I'm off to France later this month for a holiday, so I'll update you after my vacation.

post #4 of 15
OK but bearing in mind that they did what they thought at the time was the right thing to do (and it could be shown today that it was the right thing to do). The US did what they thought was right and France did what they thought was right.

Without agreeing with them perhaps you could give them some credit for standing up for their beliefs against a much larger nation in every sense. At least they didn't lie to their people and at least they're constituents didn't fall for the lies hook, line and sinker like the US and UK.

If you want to go then go, if you don't then don't. They won't give you any abuse if you do or don't but if you don't you'll miss out on some great skiing and they'll miss out on a few of your sheckles.
post #5 of 15
Originally posted by Wear the fox hat:
Sorry, I wouldn't let a political difference of opinion prevent me from going to a country.


P.S. We had a similar thread to this one a few months back, and the guy who started it never bothered to come back and tell us what he found.
Y'know, that's just a silly statement.

In this instance, I wouldn't fear for my personal safety in France, simply for my comfort and enjoyment. A valid concern, I feel.

But would it be wise for me as an American to visit, say, Colombia? After all, we just have a minor difference in political opinion with regard to drug trafficking. It just so happens that they are fond of kidnapping people to express this difference.

Or how 'bout a group of orthodox jews heading from Israel over to Iraq for a little fun in the sun? Nah.

One must always consider the political climate of a country they are considering visiting, whether simply as a matter of convenience, or as seriously as a matter of personal safety.

I too would love to visit Trois Vallees, and Chamonix. But this year, I think I'll spend my money elsewhere. I won't visit France until such a time that the smoke has cleared between us.

Have you considered Switzerland? What about Austria?
post #6 of 15
I have skied throughout Europe, and will continue to with the exception that I am removing any resort in France from my list of potential destinations, totally based on their spit in our face attitude over Iraq.

Their decision had nothing to do with what the deemed to be right, it was based on what they deemed to be in their best financial interest, on their hatred of us, and on the fear of our gaining a stronger presence in the middle east and how that might jeopardize future business contracts with Saddam's evil regime. Their position was formulated with total disregard to the human atrocities being perpetrated by Saddam and his sadistic sons, and the evidence of the Hitler like evil that existed in Iraq prior to our removal of Saddam only serves to highlight how self centered and anti-humanitarian their pathetic position was.

I will not be spending any of my skiing dollars in France anymore and I'm only one of many who have chosen this course of action. I have a friend who runs guided ski trips to France and his business in now on the ropes. There is plenty of comparable skiing in Austria and Switzerland and that is where I and many others are now headed when we cross the pond.

I also don't buy any products in general that are produced in France, and I have a list! I am gaining a great appreciation for Australian wine!! Their financial based decision might prove to have been a bad one in the long run.

[ June 19, 2003, 07:46 AM: Message edited by: FastMan ]
post #7 of 15
Does it really matter why they had a different opinion? Or is it just that they had a different opinion?

Funny how that within the US everyone is entitled to say what they think and not expect reprisals yet for any other country to have a different opinion than the US it is absolute treason.

post #8 of 15
Thread Starter 
When you live in DC, you MUST get away from the Mid-Atlantic at least once a year to experience skiing on a grand scale. VT and ME are always options, but many of us tend to go West or to Europe at least once a year. I can be at St. Anton faster than it takes me to drive to Sunday River. One can get to Vail even faster.

In the past, Mid-Atlantic skiers could go to Europe for just a little bit more money than a trip to Aspen. The exchange rates this year have changed things, but given the low cost of lift tickets in Europe and the expansive terrain many tickets serve, it’s still an OK deal to ski in Europe. I saved money on my last trip by occasionally buying food at the local grocery store rather than eating out all the time.

One of the reasons, I posted this poll is to see how the exchange rate is effecting things. France is one of the most expensive places to ski in Europe, and so I thought it would be a good barometer on the impact of the high Euro for skiers. I’m also interested to see if anti-French sentiment exists within the ski public. I guess from the sound of some of these posts and the poll, it still does. The travel agents I have spoken with are very concerned about this issue. I am no fan of the French government, but I am not going to punish Courchevel for Chirac’s foreign policy. I’d just be punishing myself anyway. I don’t think anyone from the UK or Australia will stop skiing in France because of its government. Why should Americans be any different?
post #9 of 15
Mr. T got no problem with France....but I heard the names been changed to Freedomland.
post #10 of 15
Originally posted by West Virginia Skier:

I’d just be punishing myself anyway. I don’t think anyone from the UK or Australia will stop skiing in France because of its government. Why should Americans be any different?
Your probably right, not many will. They didn't have 3000 dead friends, neighbors and countrymen lieing under a millon tons of rubble because of terrorist hate. They have nothing to take personally when another country actively thwarts our efforts to defend ourself. That's why we should be different.

Stands of principle gain credibility if personal sacrifices are necessary to maintain that stand. We have now close to 200 lives lost on the sands of Iraq, sacrificed by people who believed so in their cause they were willing to make the ultimate gift toward the preservation of freedom. I would be ashamed of myself if I were to deviate from my acknowledgment of the worthiness of their sacrifice simply because I wanted to ski a particular resort. What a SMALL, SMALL sacrifice to make.
post #11 of 15
Thread Starter 
Hey Fastman:

Trying to link skiing in France to 9-11 is quite a stretch. Last time I checked, France did not attack this country on that day (nor did Iraq for that matter). France also contributed combat forces during the Afghanistan War and is still an ally in the Global War on Terror.

I work in DC and bike by the Pentagon every day. You don’t have to remind me about 9-11 and the losses this country suffered that day. Many of my friends were in the building that day and some have the scars to prove it.

However, linking 9-11 to skiing in France is ridiculous and absurd. As I said, I don’t particularly like the Chirac government or agree with some of its policies, but I also feel that it insane to punish the French ski industry because of Chirac. That’s the equivalent of not going to ski in Utah because you don’t like Oren Hatch.
post #12 of 15
I'm tired of hearing the pompous remarks of arrogant imperialistic Americans!

If you want to get a biased viewpoint that really counts right now, try asking the families of the tens of thousands of Iraqis we have slaughtered in their own country. I think they will think France the greater nation, and have little remaining empathy for what happened on 9-11.

We should all ski where we want to because of our own personal circumstances, and leave the political issues to the power bosses!

post #13 of 15
Originally posted by Xdog:
Y'know, that's just a silly statement.
Re-reading it, yeah, I could see how it could be read that way. What I meant was if the only reason was because of a difference in political opinion between the government of my country and the government of theirs, then I wouldn't let it stop me.


For those who believe France always was, and always will be the most evil country in the world, could you please return to them the statue they gave you, and enclose with it the poem found at the statue's base, which, while it may not be French, certainly doesn't echo the sentiments reflected here.

post #14 of 15
France, an ally in the Global War On Terror? And you call me ridiculous and absurd! We can only speculate how many more lives will be lost because of the extra time France's political gamesmanship gave Saddam to get the W.O.M.D. out of the country and into most likely Syria to be used another day. That Global War on Terrorism you refer to has few devoted participants, and France is light years away from being a legitimate member of that effort.

Boycotting of the products of corporations associated with an offending entity is far from unprecedented. Ask McDonalds and other US companies operating abroad, who are experiencing it in Europe because of Anti American feelings can attest. There is good reason for it. France is not Iraq, the populus there has the power to remove a leadership that creates policy they do not agree with and which brings negative repercussions down upon them. If you truly are not happy with the policy of Chirac then sending that message to his supporters (the citizenship, and corporate backbone) in a manner that gets their attention in a meaningful way is a very effective means of encouraging his removal, or at least a change in policy.

Or you can just be willy nilly about it and prance over there and have a wonder time while pumping your American dollars into their Anti American pockets. Have a real nice time.
post #15 of 15
Ok enough politics,

I'm shutting this one down (moving it acutally). and back to skiing please.

If you are a supporting member of this site, you can take the politics into the "supporter lounge" otherwise let's keep to skiing.
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