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Squats

post #1 of 28
Thread Starter 
Do you do em?
lots of reps? heavy weight & low reps? or a mix of both?
I find a big difference skiing when I do them religiously.
what rep/weight combos do you use?
post #2 of 28
Yes, any type help my sking. A few years ago I was really into lifting and would do freeweight squats with 225# up to 10 reps, more reps with lighter weights. I didn't like the thought of that much weight pressing the bar on my upper back/shoulder area so I went to hack squats. They also really helped my core strenght, but, quads, etc.
post #3 of 28

Mixing it up

I like doing squats and on heavy days will do 20 rep sets (x3) with as much weight as i think I can handle for 10 reps. On other days I go heavier in weight but do 4-6 reps and then on some other days I do 4 sets of 10-12 but supperset either wall squats or deep tucks on an upside down bosu (hold 60-90 seconds). And then on other days I do explosive exercises along with squat workouts. I also like doing deadlifts and weighted lunges, farmer walks with heavy heavy dumbbells. etc. One of the fun things about training is the creativity you can bring to it.
post #4 of 28
I do a pretty big leg work out for skiing. Squats are the #1 exercise.

Here it is:

Squats: 5 sets; 8 - 10 reps each (full rage of motion on all of them... not the cheap squats that you see people that can't squat doing)
(1 light, 135)
(2 medium)
(2 heavy 315+)

Leg Press: 3 Sets; 10 Reps each

Leg Extensions: 3 Sets; 10 Reps each
(hold extended for 1 minute, then w/o setting the stack down rep it 10 times... more than 10 plates on the machine can hurt your knees)

Leg Curls: 3 Sets; 10 Reps each

Calf Raise: 3 Sets; 15-20+ Reps
(Leg press machine)

When I am done I run all of the stairs in our arena on campus... sometimes twice. If I can still walk I do a 1 lap cool down around our track (slightly less than 1/4 mile).

So the answer is yes, do squats.

Later

GREG
post #5 of 28
i have spent the past two off seasons doing a fairly traditional powerlifting routine (squats, deadlifting, bench). the only thing i would suggest is that you take a look at deadlifting as a part of your training.

i urge you to spend a long time working on technique. i see a lot of folks in the gym attempting squats and what they are doing is risking injury. like any sport seek the guidance of someone you trust.

i'm going to do something a little different this summer. i spend a lot of time skiing bumps and found several areas of my body that are weak as well as needing increased flexibility.

i'm not quite sure what i'm going to do, however, it's time for a routine change.

so.....are squats the answer? i don't know!
post #6 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rusty Guy
i have spent the past two off seasons doing a fairly traditional powerlifting routine (squats, deadlifting, bench). the only thing i would suggest is that you take a look at deadlifting as a part of your training.

i urge you to spend a long time working on technique. i see a lot of folks in the gym attempting squats and what they are doing is risking injury. like any sport seek the guidance of someone you trust.

i'm going to do something a little different this summer. i spend a lot of time skiing bumps and found several areas of my body that are weak as well as needing increased flexibility.

i'm not quite sure what i'm going to do, however, it's time for a routine change.

so.....are squats the answer? i don't know!
Keep doing your squats and deadlifting,two of the best overall lifts you can do.
For bumps ,as you say ,flexibilty is needed but also agility , quickness,lateral movement & strength & core strength.
side lunges,lateral box jumps,side planks,just to name a few.
Another area that is over looked is your hip flexors.As you absorb & extend in the bumps they get worked a lot.
post #7 of 28
Thread Starter 
it's often said that you should work from the biggest muscles of each group down to the smallest, so I was wondering if most of you do all of your agility stuff after your weights, or before, or on a completely different day?

yes i have found deadlifts to increase overall strength - and after a little while they increase all of your other lifts...
post #8 of 28
I no longer do squats as I have had too many back injuries. I used to do real heavy stuff when competing in bodybuilding (squats up to 350lbs and deadlifts up to 440lbs) and now I am paying for it. I work on hamstrings religiously however.

For thighs I rely on road running, trail running and mountain biking. I also have a single speed mountain bike, which will work you thighs to death.
post #9 of 28
Has anyone read the article in the April issue of Outside Magazine on the 'Sprint 8' workout?
I've tried it for a few times ,it's a killer.
post #10 of 28
squats on balance board: 135lbs 3 sets of 10 reps
squats regular: 225lbs 3 sets of 5 reps
post #11 of 28
post #12 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by TomB
I no longer do squats as I have had too many back injuries. I used to do real heavy stuff when competing in bodybuilding (squats up to 350lbs and deadlifts up to 440lbs) and now I am paying for it. I work on hamstrings religiously however.

For thighs I rely on road running, trail running and mountain biking. I also have a single speed mountain bike, which will work you thighs to death.
I no longer squat because 20 rep squats @ only 230 and a very dehydrating keto diet ruined my knees. I'm lucky to ski at all....

counting the years till full-on arthritis sets it.
post #13 of 28
Higher reps are far better 20+. When squatting real heavy weight you end up using leverage to move the weight. Pick a weight that you can do 15 reps with right now and work up to 35-40 reps with that weight. You'll be strong as an ox and needing new jeans quickly. Try to add weight every other week and I'll see you in my PT clinic. Someone mentioned sprinting. Sprinting is probablt the single best exercise you can do for explosive strength and overall conditioning. Everything will get stronger from your legs to your back to your neck. Trust me. Sprinters look like and are as strong as linebackers!
post #14 of 28
I did a USSA clinic last fall, and their emphasis was on core strength and endurance, not maximum strength. They different excercises in a balance ball, as well as did squats, and side squats with low weights. They did a squat where you stayed low, moving up and down only an inch or two, for as long as you could maintain perfect form. They also did an excercise on a balance ball to develop strenght in the hamstrings.
Most gym machines are a complete waste of effort. All they do is isolate the leg muscles, and prevent you from developing core core strength and balance skills.
Quad strength is way over rated for skiing, especially for recreational skiing. Core strength, flexibility, a healthy back and good posture are all far more important.

BK
post #15 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by ski=free
Higher reps are far better 20+. When squatting real heavy weight you end up using leverage to move the weight. Pick a weight that you can do 15 reps with right now and work up to 35-40 reps with that weight. You'll be strong as an ox and needing new jeans quickly. Try to add weight every other week and I'll see you in my PT clinic. Someone mentioned sprinting. Sprinting is probablt the single best exercise you can do for explosive strength and overall conditioning. Everything will get stronger from your legs to your back to your neck. Trust me. Sprinters look like and are as strong as linebackers!
Unless you are a well trained athlete, sprinting is too likely to cause injury for thr mount of bnfit you get. Sprinters look like linebackers because they spend as much time in the gym as they do on the track. They are very careful about how much actual sprinting they do.

BK
post #16 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bode Klammer
Unless you are a well trained athlete, sprinting is too likely to cause injury for thr mount of bnfit you get. Sprinters look like linebackers because they spend as much time in the gym as they do on the track. They are very careful about how much actual sprinting they do.

BK
I think that is our goal, to be a well trained athlete.
Iif you read about the new reserch on sprinting,Sprinters get big because of sprinting more than pushing big weight. But 3x a week is probably max. Just like plyos,don't overdo.
post #17 of 28

how strong do you think you need to be

I'm going to agree with TomB on back injuries from squats. Maybe sets of 20 would be safer in the long run. Or do lunges and side lunges instead.
If I had to do my racing career over again I would work more on aerobic base, agility, balance and flexibility.
The core strengthening I did for back stabilization (PT for Herniated disc) made a dramatic improvement in my skiing ability and technique. I can now easily stay in balanced in rutted slaloms and chopped up crud.

Heluva
I think your should probably focus on something other than squats. Because your plenty strong if your sets of 8-10 at 315lbs. I have an article that quotes Hans Knauss saying he could deep squat 310lbs for 10 reps. So you are as strong as world cup speed skier. Is your balance, agility, flexibility and endurance up to world cup standards?
I'm not trying to pick on you. I just have seen a lot of racers who think they need to be big muscle men in order to ski fast. They would have done a lot better with a more well rounded training program.
post #18 of 28
I skied went alpine skiing with a pretty good cross country skier last week (fifteen world cup podiums, two Olympic medals). She weighs 135, squats 325. She has done virtually no alpine skiing, and said her quads were burning after one run. I guess world class power and endurance is no subsitute for relaxed technique. Of course, she went from beginner to stong intermediate in half a day.
post #19 of 28

Frogsquats

Try the smith machine for some frog squats. Step forward so it feels like you're leaning into the bar behind you, keep your legs at least shoulder width apart. Warm up with only the bar, then start with a much lighter weight than you normally squat with and go deep. Do at least 15-20 reps for 4 sets.
Your quads will curse at you!
This feels a bit awkward at first, but it made a huge difference in my leg development.
post #20 of 28
The smith machine is not what I'd recommend. And those frog squats sound like they will put a lot of shear force on the knee joint.

I suggest to do leg presses instead.
post #21 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by Traverser
Try the smith machine for some frog squats. Step forward so it feels like you're leaning into the bar behind you, keep your legs at least shoulder width apart. Warm up with only the bar, then start with a much lighter weight than you normally squat with and go deep. Do at least 15-20 reps for 4 sets.
Your quads will curse at you!
This feels a bit awkward at first, but it made a huge difference in my leg development.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big E
The smith machine is not what I'd recommend. And those frog squats sound like they will put a lot of shear force on the knee joint.

I suggest to do leg presses instead.
All machines are a waste of effort. Even a simple machine like a Smith Machine prevents you from developing the balancing skills that you need. Commercial gyms all love machines, because you can't have them all at home and because they are safer to use, but free weights, used properly, provide far more benefit from the same effort. Or at least that's what the Olympic training Center coaches tell me.

BK
post #22 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bode Klammer
All machines are a waste of effort. Even a simple machine like a Smith Machine prevents you from developing the balancing skills that you need. Commercial gyms all love machines, because you can't have them all at home and because they are safer to use, but free weights, used properly, provide far more benefit from the same effort. Or at least that's what the Olympic training Center coaches tell me.

BK
Thats a fact.
You can use even less weight free squating than with a machine and get more benifit. Even if your just starting .squat with no weight as you gain strength add an empty bar (45 lbs) or some light dumbbells if thats to much.But the bottom line is you work all those little support ,balance and core muscles that you'll miss useing a machine.
Anyone try 'Tabata Squats' yet?
post #23 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by loboskis
Thats a fact.
But the bottom line is you work all those little support ,balance and core muscles that you'll miss useing a machine.
And if you don't work all those other muscles, due to the isolation a machine provides, you are setting yourself up for injury.
post #24 of 28
Machines were once sold to clubs as a way to move more people through the mill. 2 or three sets of 10 could be more quickly acheived on a machine by more people since you only need to pull the pins to change the weight. They were'nt marketed as "better" just "faster", so that the gym owner could make more bucks.
post #25 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigE
so that the gym owner could make more bucks.
Yes,our gym owner makes a ton. Its unreal the money to be made in the right area.
post #26 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by HeluvaSkier
I do a pretty big leg work out for skiing. Squats are the #1 exercise.

Here it is:

Squats: 5 sets; 8 - 10 reps each (full rage of motion on all of them... not the cheap squats that you see people that can't squat doing)
(1 light, 135)
(2 medium)
(2 heavy 315+)

Leg Press: 3 Sets; 10 Reps each

Leg Extensions: 3 Sets; 10 Reps each
(hold extended for 1 minute, then w/o setting the stack down rep it 10 times... more than 10 plates on the machine can hurt your knees)

Leg Curls: 3 Sets; 10 Reps each

Calf Raise: 3 Sets; 15-20+ Reps
(Leg press machine)

When I am done I run all of the stairs in our arena on campus... sometimes twice. If I can still walk I do a 1 lap cool down around our track (slightly less than 1/4 mile).

So the answer is yes, do squats.

Later

GREG
Greg,

You're wasting you time with all of that leg work in a single day. My strength coach in college had this workout for legs, only once a week, for our football team:

Heavy day

Squats: 5 work sets, 3 - 6 reps, at least 60 seconds between sets
Deadlifts: same as above


Light day

Squats: 3 work sets, 12 - 15 reps
lunges or single leg leg press: 3 work sets, 15 - 20 reps
Leg extensions, 3 work sets, 15 - 20 reps

If you're legs aren't dead after your work sets on squats and deads, you're not going heavy enough. All of that leg work you do in a single day is going to lead to patellar tendonitis, which is NO fun, or worse. If one leg day isn't enough, do plyometrics no fewer than 3 days after leg day, with no fewer than 3 days rest between you're next weight day.
post #27 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikey_10
it's often said that you should work from the biggest muscles of each group down to the smallest, so I was wondering if most of you do all of your agility stuff after your weights, or before, or on a completely different day?

yes i have found deadlifts to increase overall strength - and after a little while they increase all of your other lifts...
Completely different day. If you have enough energy to do plyos, cardio, or agility training on leg day, you're not being intense enough in your strength training. It isn't unusual for me to end up puking after a leg workout, but that's a bit extreme (former college f-ball player). And yes, if you don't have deadlifts on your routine now, add them. Much like squats, they tax a variety of muscle groups in one movement. Just adding deadlifts to my leg day has put close to 100 pounds on my sqaut (from maxing around 375 to 455 in about 2 months).
post #28 of 28
What's the point of the leg extensions? Those will hurt you, especially since you will be unable to align your knee joint with the hinge of the machine (unless you are very very lucky). According to my PT, leg extensions are useful only for PT, with less than 10 lbs resistance -- any more will cause damage.

I'd forget about them completely.
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