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Bindings forward + Volkl 4* = yardsale + powder hell?

post #1 of 11
Thread Starter 
Hi everyone. I'm a level 7 skier, 31 years old, 5'8", 165# on a pair of Volkl Supersport Four Stars (4*), 161cm. In retrospect, I really should have invested in a pair of Five Stars (5*), but these were bought at a great deal before I made a lot of progress this season.

On a particularly icy run earlier in the season, I lamented that the skis were not holding a carve with any aggression, as the rear end was releasing into a skid with anything more than a gingerly-applied looooong-radius turn. (Being off-tune probably wasn't the issue as I regularly tune the edges myself to factory angles with minimal detuning on either end.) I also have a set of Salomon Scramber 7's (bought way too early in my progress) and have always noticed that the 4*s factory-recommended binding location was quite far aft in comparison. So I got the idea that the 4*s simply needed to have edge length shifted from the head to the tail. I moved my bindings forward by 5mm. Fourtunately/unfortunately, icy conditions didn't recur for me to test the effectiveness of this adjustment.

Maybe it was the perfect conditions, but the next time out the skis were nothing less than heroic on corduroy, and was carving great on packed powder... that is, discounting the mild whiplash I suffered from yardsaling. (My helmet protected me from a possible concussion.) That fall involved getting out of shape enough for the binding to pre-release, and not having enough talent/stamina left to retain control on one ski. Pre-release aside, my question revolves around how I got out of shape, which is that I was caught backseating. To be honest, it happens occasionally. But rarely did such a lapse in technique ever bite me this hard. Word on the grapevine is that Volkl's feature stiff tails and should be skied fairly aggressively, which meant to me that I had to drive the skis and maintain a forward-weighted stance. Do y'all think that moving the bindings forward reduced the forgiveness of the tails of these skis?

Later on the very same day, my cousin dragged me onto a single-black with heavy crud. This was pure hell, as the ski tips would dive at every chance they got. Trying to keep them elevated was about as bad, as anything less than forward-weighting just made the skis not want to turn whatsoever. I'm figuring that moving the bindings forward reduced the head length to the point where the shovels did not want to float anymore.

Do my rationalizations make any sense, or am I missing some obvious things? Or do I just need something like an Atomic Metron B5?

I guess it might be too much to pursue the combination of boilerplate grip, forgiveness, and floation. (Or is it?)
post #2 of 11
I moved the railflex bindings on my RX-8 to their forward position (+15mm) to experiment, and hated it. The tips were too grabby and I found myself leaning back to keep the ski neutral. When carving they hooked up sensationally, but I just did not like the general overall feel. In the center position, the skis are much more to my liking.

I have heard here several times that moving the bindings forward can be a band-aid for a backseat skier. At the center position, I have a nice neutral stance, so I guess it is not surprising that the forward position might be overkill for me.

When you do move forward relative to the sidecut curve, you end up driving the tips more but the tails gain more leverage to bite you. I think that's exactly what you noticed.
post #3 of 11
The tip dive in crud is definitly a result in some part to moving them forward. If they are center mounted or close to it you would need to be way back to move through snow like that. If you don't ski deep snow alot don't worry about it. Buy a powder ski and life will be good. Otherwise think about moving them back a bit. You can overcome mounting issues with various techniques but riding powder in the back seat is torture on the legs.
post #4 of 11
Disagree with the above posters. 5 mm shouldn't make that much of a difference, except in your head (It's roughly 1/4 of an inch). Your own posture or changing conditions will contribute much more variance to performance. And the vaunted "tip dive" mentioned is more likely due to abruptly pressuring the tips than having your CG too far forward. Try skiing from a more neutral stance and concentrate on tipping your skis instead of pressing the tips. Incidentally, a lesson will cost about twice what you'll pay to remount, but will return about 100X more performance.
post #5 of 11
^ ohh my bad I thought it said 5 cm I think beyond hit it right on the head. Lesons would help
post #6 of 11
Originally Posted by DtEW
I moved my bindings forward by 5mm.
Are your sure it was just 5mm? That very close to the size of the binding screw.
post #7 of 11
I would definately notice a 5 mm forward move in my bindings, but I will agree with beyond that the main reason for you trouble is an abrupt tip pressuring.

I would put the bindings back to neutral. You need to learn to pressure the whole edge, and not push out the heels. If you find your losing the whole edge, and a lesson doesn't help then you need to move up to 5* or all star. If you want more grip, you will have to live with less forgiveness. A ski that does what you tell it to will do what it's told, so you can't have it both ways.
post #8 of 11
Didn't say it's not noticeable. Just wondering how the screws would hold so close to the previous hole.

What's the minimum safe repositioning you can do when remounting?
post #9 of 11
Originally Posted by BigE
Didn't say it's not noticeable. Just wondering how the screws would hold so close to the previous hole.
he could be on a rail system
post #10 of 11
On a 4 star?
post #11 of 11
Motion (TM) rails with perhaps a new slot cut?

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