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Xc Dh Brakes

post #1 of 21
Thread Starter 
any suggestions? looking at juicy 7's the new shimano's and the hayes hx9's. need a new rear derauiller to. sram x7's? i am a new(ish) xc rider who downhills about half the time. ride a 05 specialized stumpjumper fsr, stock everything. want to upgrade brakes and fork, need new rear derauiller/shifters.
post #2 of 21
Have you tried mtbr.com?
http://forums.mtbr.com/

That's an XC bike (I have an earlier version) am I right in assuming you are not doing true Downhilling (e.g. large fork travel, body armour, big drops etc)? It's just that if you use the term Downhill people might direct you to heavy duty (and heavyweight) components when you are looking for XC bit's and pieces.

I do XC stuff with steep downhills but no big jumps and put Juicy 7's on mine. The 185mm discs were the same price as the 165mm so I went for the 185mm and they have more than enough power for me (I'm 72kg) with good modulation. Was advised at the time that 205mm would be overkill.

The Stumpy front wheel has a tendency lift up on really steep climbs. If I replaced the fork on mine (Fox RL) I'd go for one with a lock down feature. It's the most common bike in our XC mountain bike club and some firends have already made this fork upgrade and are very pleased with it.


The ski season is drawing to a close but it'll be that time again soon
post #3 of 21
Juicy 7?

at full price?

****** no. waaaaaaayyyyyy too expensive. Juicy 5 does the same job, if you really want Avid brakes.

besides, an "XC/DH" brake? WTF is that?

there's more to it than brand and model. you also have to decide rotor size and that makes adaptors necessary.

more info needed.

go to MTBR.com if you want to research this. they have a brakes forum.
post #4 of 21
post #5 of 21
Thread Starter 

More info

Thanks peoples,
I ride XC trails when I don't feel like driving a half hour to the slopes to ride the trails at Keystone, Winter Park, or possibly Vail. I do not know if all these trails are considered true DH trails, but they are pretty steep, fast, and sketchy. Im not bombing off cliffs or bridges, but do anything that is not manmade off of the lifts. Im still a beginner I guess, since i definately use my brakes way way to much and still have little confidence in my tires. Im a wuss at climbing still, but since this is my first year living back out west (from Chitown) I plan on working on that alot this season. Weight isnt a huge issue for me in components, but my V-brakes are dead. I want to get into downhill, but do not have the money to buy a new bike, or a bike on ebay for that matter. I would like my Stumpy to be able to climb and cruise around, but also help me improve my "downhill" technique. The fork is sufficient, will probably upgrade that next year.
On the brakes issue, it seems that every bike shop gives me different, personal preference advice. All i think i know is that i should definately go with hydraulic above mechanical, and use a 8" as opposed to 6" rotor up front. I look at mtbr but there are soo many components on there that i do not know where to begin. I didnt know they had a forum though, so i guess ill check that out. Anyways, hopefully I can make up my mind soon, so I can start riding again. I would still prefer snow right now though.
Brannen
post #6 of 21
I'm a fan of the Shimano XT hyrdros. They have more power and better modulation than the juicy 7s, at least on the bikes that we sell. I've tried the juicy 5's on the manager's ziggurat, and they are not nearly as good as the 7s. I don't like hayes discs, they are often like hair triggers, no modulation.

Get an X9 drivetrain and a TALAS fork, it will kick ass.
post #7 of 21
brannen,

There doesn't seem to be one outright winner with brakes. When I bought discs last year the more I read the more I got confused. Some brakes seem to perform really well but have maintenance problems. In the end I found a pair of discs which at the time were considered to be in the top few at a really cheap price (40% discount) so I went for them.

You could try here, they have a beginners section.

http://www.bikemagic.com/Forum/forum.asp?SP=&V=
post #8 of 21
brannen you should try some other folks' bikes.

here's a quick synopsis of mfrs and their (+) and (-) features:

Avid
-easiest to install, best mounting system
-their mechanical brakes are the best in the biz
-their hydro brakes are very good, but very expensive
-good modulation
-great power

Magura
-least well known in the USA
-best customer support
-best value
-great modulation
-great power

Hayes
-most power
-WORST modulation
-most common repair parts
-pretty darned expensive

Hope
-best machine work/engineering
-very finicky setup
-excellent power & modulation
-sometimes noisy (squeal)
post #9 of 21
I'll essentially agree with Crud's list with a few comments.

Hope has now gone with a post mount adaptor system ala Avid and setup is a breeze provided the disc tabs are faced.

Formula.....even less well known than Magura but putting out great stuff.

I own both Magura Louise FR and Avid Juicy 7's and like both but prefer the Avids for ease of setup, better lever ergonomics and easier line bleeding. Modulation & power are comparable. Some same Avids squeal in the wet but I haven't had that problem. Hayes have always felt grabby to me although I haven't tried the newest generation like El Camino.
post #10 of 21
Thread Starter 
nice,
i see nothing mentioned about shimano or sram. these seem cheaper in price, same with quality? and there is no way i am installing these brakes, but i guess i can learn how to maintain and fix them, replace pads, bleed lines, etc...
thanks for the input, im purchasing some this weekend
post #11 of 21
SRAM = Avid

Avid formerly was independent but was purchased by SRAM a few years ago. There are no discos under the SRAM name.

Shimanos are also nice. They're all pretty nice actually.
post #12 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by brannen
nice,
i see nothing mentioned about shimano or sram. these seem cheaper in price, same with quality? and there is no way i am installing these brakes, but i guess i can learn how to maintain and fix them, replace pads, bleed lines, etc...
thanks for the input, im purchasing some this weekend
Bleeding them is easy compared to aligning them. It is the most frustrating part of building any bike, as getting it to not rub while keeping the cable tight is a difficult operation. Most brake systems come pre-bled, so I wouldn't worry too much about that. Aligning them is a PITA though, I suggest putting a thin piece of paper on each side of the disc, squeezing the brakes, then SLOWLY tightening the bolts. If this doesn't work you'll need to do it freehand. Have fun!
post #13 of 21
I find aligning discos to be a snap. Both hydros & cable acctuated.

If using a shim sytem brake like magura or shimano then be sure the frame & fork tabs are properly faced with a magura gnann-o-matt or similar tool.

If using a system like Avids or Formulas then loosed the fitting bolts, move the caliper so that the rotor is equidistant between the pads and while holding it there squeeze the lever. Then tighten the bolts while squeezing. Piece of cake.
post #14 of 21
I haven't installed Shimanos or Maguras, but the Avids aren't always that easy. Maybe I'm a lousy mechanic, who knows...
post #15 of 21
I've learned a few tricks which might help you:

- make sure the pads are fully retracted before you begin. Take a clean flat blade screwdriver, clean it with rubbing alcohol, and gently pry those pads back.

- once you've done that and set the pads, you may find that the rotor still rubs closer to one side. take a clean rag and push the rotor towards the pad that is closest. This will force that pad away from the rotor. While holding the rotor against that pad, reach with your other hand and squeeze the lever which will redistribute the brake fluid across both sides of the caliper
post #16 of 21
Thread Starter 
I found some Juicy 7's for $175. Should I close the deal? Install will be free, and professionaly done. Oh yeah, they had no more 8" rotors, will the 6's be fine for my front wheel?
post #17 of 21
It's a decent price. Not jaw dropping, but good.
Optimal front rotor size is dependent on the type of riding you do. I'm 160 lbs and ride very aggressively and use a 7" in the front. If using a local shop then talk with them about swapping the front rotor & adaptor if you think you need more. Otherwise a new rotor & adaptor can be purchased cheaply.
If you are in CO then give Larry at Mtn High Cyclery a call before doing anything: 970-669-7960 or sales@mtnhighcyclery.com
post #18 of 21
Thread Starter 
I am in Colorado, Denver to be exact. Ill try and look him up later on today. Thanks
post #19 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Squeaky Wheel
It's a decent price. Not jaw dropping, but good.
Optimal front rotor size is dependent on the type of riding you do. I'm 160 lbs and ride very aggressively and use a 7" in the front. If using a local shop then talk with them about swapping the front rotor & adaptor if you think you need more. Otherwise a new rotor & adaptor can be purchased cheaply.
If you are in CO then give Larry at Mtn High Cyclery a call before doing anything: 970-669-7960 or sales@mtnhighcyclery.com
Larry Mettler / Mtn High Cyclery is a fine shop. I've bought many things from Larry. His prices always are competitive, he knows his stuff, and he has a lackey named The Squeaky Wheel who helps him test stuff. what else can you ask for?

go Larry, go Mtn High.
post #20 of 21
brannen,
Notice that you want to improve your skills, have you considered joining an MTB club or going on an MTB training course? Like skiing, buying the right tools doesn't mean you get the talent as part of the deal.
post #21 of 21
Thread Starter 
true that,
i know absolutely nothing about mtn bike clubs, and even less about lessons or whatnot. its looking like i will have less time to bike this summer then i thought, that is if i get this rafting job that will take up 6 days of my week. can you still join a club if you cant dedicate alot of time? i live in denver right now, but will probably move to idaho springs in a month or two. any good places near there?
brannen
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