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P-tex Base repair

post #1 of 19
Thread Starter 
I need to fill a couple of divots with P-tex. I bought the candles. I'm OK with edge tuning and waxing, but I have not used P-tex before. I also don't have a torch to melt it. Is it OK to use the corner of the iron? Any tips on how to handle it, time to wait before sanding, etc?
Thx
post #2 of 19
Nando - do yourself a big favor and spend the $35 for the Tognar Base Repair Iron (http://www.tognar.com/base_repair_to...es_damage.html). It's well worth the investment even if you don't use it much (I haven't had to do a single fill this season!).

Typically you would burn P-tex candles just by lighting them, but that method allows the burnt carbon to become part of the repair and weaken it (no matter how careful you are - there are lots of technique recommendations to help you avoid the carbon, but it's really inevitable).

The Baser Repair Iron can be used very simply and it just melts the P-tex into the gouges without any carbon. While you're at it you may as well buy some P-Tex ribbon (instead of using the candles) since it produces a harder longer lasting repair. The candles include paraffin to allow the candle itself to burn and you don't need that when using the base repair iron.
post #3 of 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by Noodler
Nando - do yourself a big favor and spend the $35 for the Tognar Base Repair Iron (http://www.tognar.com/base_repair_to...es_damage.html). It's well worth the investment even if you don't use it much (I haven't had to do a single fill this season!).

Typically you would burn P-tex candles just by lighting them, but that method allows the burnt carbon to become part of the repair and weaken it (no matter how careful you are - there are lots of technique recommendations to help you avoid the carbon, but it's really inevitable).

The Baser Repair Iron can be used very simply and it just melts the P-tex into the gouges without any carbon. While you're at it you may as well buy some P-Tex ribbon (instead of using the candles) since it produces a harder longer lasting repair. The candles include paraffin to allow the candle itself to burn and you don't need that when using the base repair iron.
Ditto.
post #4 of 19
I might actually get good at base repairs this year. The soft base on the Mantra + sharks teeth at Kirkwood = lots of practice for me.
post #5 of 19
I agree that the ribbon works better than the candles, and they are best for major repair areas.

If you only have a small scratch or nick that needs repair you can cut the p-tex sticks in half.....the LONG way. I place the stick between two small pieces of wood and secure them to the bench, then cut it down the middle with a sharp utility knife.

They burn much cooler that way and there is far less carbon. Let the first few drips go somewhere other than your skis bottom.

I scrape down fairly quickly before the stuff fully cools. Some may argue this point but I've found that once the stuff completely cools it is far more brittle and more inclined to fail.
post #6 of 19
that "special" iron they sell is a joke. They claim soldering and wood burning irorns get to 1000* F, and theirs gets to 550... this is simply not true. Vitually all plug in type soldering irons you get from a hardware store or radioshack heat to that point. Get any 20-40 watt soldering iron and you will be set to melt any of that base filler.
post #7 of 19
I use the $135 base repair pistol at work and I HATE it! I much rather just use standard p-tex and drip repair them. When I use the actual p-tex candle it hardens much faster then when using the pistol. I literally wouldn't use the pistol if it was given to me.
post #8 of 19
I used to use just a butane lighter...now I have this pocket blowtorch that i got at Home Depot a year or so ago. Works real well, and I think it was around ten bucks!
-JMK
post #9 of 19
Here's some instructions for P-Tex:
http://www.racewax.com/tunebaserepair.html

.
post #10 of 19
with some practice and guidance, carbon is easy enough to avoid with P-Tex Candles. I just use a regular lighter when lighting P-Tex, but a lot of people prefer torches (like the Home Depot ones are the best bargain). In terms of preventing carbon, get it lit, and rolls the flaming candle over a metal scraper to drip the carbon off. When the candle's ready, hold it very close to the repair area and don't drip it in, but get a stream going using the flame on the candle to pre-heat the base allowing the repair to hold better.

If you are like me and wear your P-Tex repairs like badges of honor (as well as create a unique identity for your skis - easier to locate if some jackass desides to walk off and attempt to steal your skis) use multiple colors of P-Tex in your repairs, afterall, its not looks that make the skis slide well.
post #11 of 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by Noodler
Nando - do yourself a big favor and spend the $35 for the Tognar Base Repair Iron (http://www.tognar.com/base_repair_to...es_damage.html). It's well worth the investment even if you don't use it much (I haven't had to do a single fill this season!).

Typically you would burn P-tex candles just by lighting them, but that method allows the burnt carbon to become part of the repair and weaken it (no matter how careful you are - there are lots of technique recommendations to help you avoid the carbon, but it's really inevitable).

The Baser Repair Iron can be used very simply and it just melts the P-tex into the gouges without any carbon. While you're at it you may as well buy some P-Tex ribbon (instead of using the candles) since it produces a harder longer lasting repair. The candles include paraffin to allow the candle itself to burn and you don't need that when using the base repair iron.
I followed this advice and I have been unable to get satisfying results - It's discouraging.

I bought this iron, and ptex ribbon (as opposed to using candles, or the ptex cord from tognar). But when I try to fill cuts, I either can't keep the stuff in there; or the repair is very rough and unsatisfying; or, in an attempt to get beyond these problems, I heat-scratch the base slightly.

I don't know, maybe the bases need to be stone ground before the repairs actually look correct. Or maybe the ribbon is too advanced for me and I should get some of the cord. I don't want to use ptex candles, since half the point is to avoid the parafin. Anyway.. :
post #12 of 19
The ribbon takes some practice with. If the scratches are fairly superficial Toko repair powder works well. Otherwise, rough up the inside of the ding a little and be very patient in applying the ribbon. Apply, let cool, apply another layer, let cool etc., until you have built up the repair slightly above the base. Then take down even with he base with either a sharp steel scraper (very carefully) or sureform tool or sandpaper. This approach seems to work well. If you get a stonegrind afterwords the repair should be completely undetectable.
post #13 of 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lostboy
The ribbon takes some practice with. If the scratches are fairly superficial Toko repair powder works well. Otherwise, rough up the inside of the ding a little and be very patient in applying the ribbon. Apply, let cool, apply another layer, let cool etc., until you have built up the repair slightly above the base. Then take down even with he base with either a sharp steel scraper (very carefully) or sureform tool or sandpaper. This approach seems to work well. If you get a stonegrind afterwords the repair should be completely undetectable.
Okay, thanks, I'll try not to lose hope.

How do you rough up the inside of a ding? Most of my dings are too small to fit anything but, say, a dental explorer into? I noticed last night that the tognar site says the ribbon works better for deep cuts. Maybe I need to be more violent with my skis.
post #14 of 19
Depending on the size of the ding or gouge, anything from a safety pin to sandpaper will work. If you have a dental explorer tool or something similar that would likely work very well. The object is for the molten P-Tex to have as many anchor points as possible to flow into to better secure the P-Tex repair material to the surrounding ski base. Make sure that the ding is clean-that's one of the few legitimate reasons to have wax cleaner around that I can think of.

The ribbon is the hardest P-Tex repair material sold at retail that I'm aware of which may explain why it works well for deep gouges. It can also be the hardest to work with.

For minor dings and scratches you may want to try Toko repair powder or try cutting the repair ribbon into thinner slices before applying. Another option is to try a repair string. It's harder than a candle but not as hard as the ribbon and a little easier to work with.
post #15 of 19
 ok....im wondering the same as  nando....do you just melt it in as wax and then scrape it off
post #16 of 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by Noodler View Post

Nando - do yourself a big favor and spend the $35 for the Tognar Base Repair Iron (http://www.tognar.com/base_repair_to...es_damage.html). It's well worth the investment even if you don't use it much (I haven't had to do a single fill this season!).

Typically you would burn P-tex candles just by lighting them, but that method allows the burnt carbon to become part of the repair and weaken it (no matter how careful you are - there are lots of technique recommendations to help you avoid the carbon, but it's really inevitable).

The Baser Repair Iron can be used very simply and it just melts the P-tex into the gouges without any carbon. While you're at it you may as well buy some P-Tex ribbon (instead of using the candles) since it produces a harder longer lasting repair. The candles include paraffin to allow the candle itself to burn and you don't need that when using the base repair iron.


I just got the iron and some ribbon (and a few tools from Tognar)......My Fischers had a good gouge to the wood core thanks to a day at Wildcat this spring. I cut the ribbon into very thin strips and used to the iron to melt the ribbon into the hole. Put two layers....it really worked great. Although you can barely see where the gouge was, I suspect it will be un-noticable after a good tune....

Final test will be how long the ribbon holds after skiing next year......based on how hard the patch feels, I am hopefull this will be a complete success....
post #17 of 19

I do a lot of base repair and strongly agree with Noodler's suggestions.  A base repair iron is easy to use and will allow you to fix major base damage.  I use it with the p-tex ribbons for shallow, and spaghetti string for deep gouges.  A sharks tooth file will plane it smooth when you are done.

With the right stuff it is pretty simple.  The price of the gear is about as much as two good base repairs by a shop.

Tognar has great products, but so does our supporter Alpinord.  Check out his site at   http://www.slidewright.com/

post #18 of 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by sir jman View Post

that "special" iron they sell is a joke. They claim soldering and wood burning irorns get to 1000* F, and theirs gets to 550... this is simply not true. Vitually all plug in type soldering irons you get from a hardware store or radioshack heat to that point. Get any 20-40 watt soldering iron and you will be set to melt any of that base filler.

I disagree vehemently with this. 

I did a series of experiments with a PTex repair iron sold by Alpinord (I agree with Mudfoot who suggests you go to http://www.slidewright.com and look at their 'How to ' files - though www.tognar.com is also good).  My results (see www.epicski.com/forum/thread/87820/solding-questions ) show that unless the iron is the correct temperature you get inadequate results - too low a temp & the stuff doesn't flow or stick properly, too high and the stuff burns & discolors (though I don't know about how burning it affects the adhesion)

My experience has been that with the Slidewright iron and careful procedure I get excellent repairs, including coreshots- far better appearance and durability than I ever got with drip candles, though the quality is dependent upon both procedure and the materials used.
post #19 of 19




 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Manus View Post

with some practice and guidance, carbon is easy enough to avoid with P-Tex Candles. I just use a regular lighter when lighting P-Tex, but a lot of people prefer torches (like the Home Depot ones are the best bargain). In terms of preventing carbon, get it lit, and rolls the flaming candle over a metal scraper to drip the carbon off. When the candle's ready, hold it very close to the repair area and don't drip it in, but get a stream going using the flame on the candle to pre-heat the base allowing the repair to hold better.
 


Hey Manus, if you read this, try a tea light - type  candle to light your P-tex one.    

 

You can keep the tea light lit during the entire repair, the outer case stays cool so you can slide it along the ski right next to the repair, and the long-lasting flame lets you shape the P-tex drip better (down to a ~2 mm wide Ptex flame if you taper down the first-lighting blob.)

 

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