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Buying used K2s - help!

post #1 of 28
Thread Starter 
Hello, I'm seriously considering buying a pair of used skis from a friend of mine, a pair of K2s. Unfortunately, I do not know what the specific model is, but the skis are straight. They are about four years old, with an original price of about $200. The length is 170 (I'm short). Now, I haven't seen the skis yet, which I know is important. However, I am told they have been well taken care of. So, assuming skis that are a bit scuffed, maybe with edges that are a bit dull, but no real damage other than four years of wear, about how much should I be paying for used straight K2s? Obviously, damage will bring the price down.

The price my friend has thrown up in the air is about $50 dollars. Is this a good price? It sounds excellent to me, and my budget is around 60-70 dollars (what can I say, I'm 16). He doesn't want to rip me off, so he's trying to find out if this is fair. Otherwise, I would grab them right up. Should I? Thanks for whatever help can be provided!

Grolby
post #2 of 28
best advice I can give: Don't buy them at any price. Continue to rent. Save your money. Then buy a used pair of modern shaped skis. If you are starting to love this sport, don't buy the straight skis. Please. Keep in touch on this web site. It's the best you will find in every way. Ask questions. Report back. Tell us what's happ'n'n. We want to know you better and help you ski more and better, no joke.
post #3 of 28
Thread Starter 
That makes sense. Lemme explain my reasoning though, and you tell me if it makes sense: paying for lift tickets, rental, etc. is all pretty expensive and takes money. My thinking is that by getting skis now, I can save that rental money and in a year or two get better skis than I could this year, or next year with renting. I have to add the cost of boots into this mix of course; call it 50-70 bucks for a decent pair in the fall, right?

So, mathematically, does this equation work out? And if it does, how much gain am I training. I have only used shaped skis, so I don't know how much of a difference it will make to be on straight boards. I certainly only intend these to be interim.

In any case, I'd like to simply know if the price I'm given is fair from a sheerly economical perspective. I appreciate your advice, and will take into serious account - got to look at this from all angles.

For what it's worth about learning and level, my last instructor told me that I was at a "Level 5" for skiing instruction. This is after 3 hours of instruction, and about 11-12 hours of skiing/practicing on the slopes. I'm told this is pretty good for my first time... must be the X-country experience.

Thanks!
Grolby
post #4 of 28
The price is OK, but don't do it!!!
You say you've been learning on modern skis. To go back to straights will reduce your rate of improvement. You'd be better saving the money towards good boots first of all, then worry about skis when you can afford the modern shaped ones.

Just my 2 cents

S
post #5 of 28
Those skis are worthless, if your mate wants to be fair he should give them to you. A dozen beers would be about the right price as long as you arrange so that you get to drink half of them.
post #6 of 28
I agree with Ricardo. They are worthless. They are probably too big for you too. (Are they higher than your eyeballs?) Use them if you want but they are not a good ski to use to become a good skier, just to get you familiarized with gliding down a hill.
post #7 of 28
I agree with Ricardo. They are worthless. They are probably too big for you too. (Are they higher than your eyeballs?) Use them if you want but they are not a good ski to use to become a good skier, just to get you familiarized with gliding down a hill.
post #8 of 28
Ditto to all the above advice. The straight skis are worthless, and actually less than that if they set back your excellent progress. Stick to your current rental scheme, and just work on the money part. Hearing things like this make me wish I were a millionaire so I could give you the skis that you really need and deserve. Stick with us, now! Keep comoing back - we want to watch your progress.
post #9 of 28
You may want to look on e-bay or something similar to see if you can get a similar deal on a pair of used shaped skis. That being said, I would be a little surprised if the K2s didn't have some shape since they are only 4 years old. Ask your friend for the specific K2 brand, and we can let you know if it's worth getting.
post #10 of 28
Grolby certainly has his head screwed on right by seriously thinking about how to handle his money, and I commend him for this.

If he already had boots and poles AND the bindings on these skis were modern enough that a shop would be permitted to adjust them), he could regard the skis as his free rock skis after maybe 3 days of not having to rent.

However, it sounds like he does not already have boots, and this unfortunately opens up a can of worms. First, renting the boots will cost money, and this will move the pay-for-themselves time out substantially. Second, the bindings may not be indemnified. If they are not, he is stuck with spending around $100 more than he anticipated to buy modern bindings and have them mounted.

Even if the present bindings are indemnified, every time he goes skiing, he is going to have to go through the hassle of renting boots, and then convincing the shop to adjust his (not their) bindings to each pair of boots he rents. Most shops will balk at this. They commonly see customers walk in with their own boots and want to rent the shop's skis and bindings. However, the opposite (ie, what Grolby would need to do) is rare, in part because they may perceive this situation as carrying significant liability risk.

So, Grolby, unless I'm wrong and you already have a pair of boots and know for sure that a shop will adjust these particular bindings to your present boots, I am going to have to side with everyone else and recommend that you pass up this opportunity albeit for slightly different reasons than everyone else.

Save up, and as your finances permit, buy boots first, then skis.

OTOH - if my assumptions are wrong and you already own a pair of decent (modern) boots, and the bindings on the skis were still indemnified, I don't see anything wrong with buying these skis for temporary use, exactly as you suggested.

Straight skis are not going to be the death knell for his skiing. Far from it - every one of us old-timers learned on straight sticks, and much of that knowledge made the transition to shapes that much quicker / smoother. For someone at his level, learning to "slide on the snow" (as someone put it) should not be dismissed so lightly. Miles count a lot. If a cheap pair of skis allow him to get on the snow a bunch more times (especially in marginal, end of season conditions), he will probably benefit more than by waiting to buy a more modern ski.

Just my $0.02,

Tom / PM
post #11 of 28
Thread Starter 
Every bit of this makes sense, but I definitely have getting experience for less cost in mind right now. Physics Man, thanks for such a detailed analysis of the situation. That sort of describes my situation, because I actually would not even be able to use the skis until next season. I have one more day on the slopes with rented shaped boards to go, because of just what has been said - a lack of boots.

My intention has been to get the skis now. This allows me to save up for the next big expense, which are going to my boots. I plan to purchase those at the beginning of next season. First, of course, I am going to have to make sure that the bindings are modern enough to be compatible and adjustable to a good pair of new boots. I understand that they are from what I've been told, but naturally I'm going to get a look at them first! If they work, I can get boots in October or November and be able to save the rental money and get more sheer time on the slopes to practice.

I am aware that skiing on straight skis is not going to make me a better skier (one of the many shaped ski myths seems to be that they make you a poorer skier because they are easier!) than skiing on straight ones, and may well slow my learning. But with twice as much time on the mountain, and with how well I have been able to learn thus far, I feel confident that I will not regret the decision if it turns out to be the one I make.

I suppose there's a certain risk here, but there's always risk in trying something different or new, and skiing is relatively new to me. And if in a year or two I can afford 250 dollar shaped skis as opposed to 120 dollar shaped skis, I'll save a lot more than the sum of my investments, I think.

Physics Man, given the plans above and your advice - should I go for it? Or not? My inclination is yes... but it may well be better to wait and see.

Grolby
post #12 of 28
(a) Yes, boots first.

(b) Wait until ski swaps in the fall.

(c) Try to find someone in your area - coach, ski shop owner, resort operator, ski instructor - and share your story with them. They may be able to steer you right.

(d) If this is what you are loving now, BE PERSISTENT - stick with it. With luck, life is long enough to make some real progress. Those who persist are more likely to succeed, in anything.
post #13 of 28
Thread Starter 
Well, I am little by little getting a better of idea of what is needed here. I think that while I'm still going to consider these skis, I should look around a lot more and find out what I need. I'm going to start another post here and see what people can recommend for me before going out and buying new skis. Those skis are going to be there for a while.
post #14 of 28
two good words were used in the above posts, both "B" words.

BEER

and

BOOTS

these are both good things to spend your money on

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ February 27, 2002 02:30 PM: Message edited 1 time, by astrochimp ]</font>
post #15 of 28
Thread Starter 
Astrochimp, I'm only 16. Oh well, more money for boots .

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by astrochimp:
two good words were used in the above posts, both "B" words.

BEER

and

BOOTS

these are both good things to spend your money on
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ February 27, 2002 02:40 PM: Message edited 1 time, by Grolby ]</font>
post #16 of 28
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Grolby:
Every bit of this makes sense, but I definitely have getting experience for less cost in mind right now. Physics Man, thanks for such a detailed analysis of the situation. ... I am aware that skiing on straight skis is not going to make me a better skier ... But with twice as much time on the mountain ... Physics Man, given the plans above and your advice - should I go for it? Or not? My inclination is yes... but it may well be better to wait and see.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'm with oboe and the other people on this. There will always be plenty of $50 (and under) straight skis around. First, spend your money on really good boots. You probably won't know what "really good" feels like, but (as already suggested) get someone local & totally unbiased to help you select a pair. Continue to rent skis, save up some more, and at some point take the plunge and buy either (1) a really cheap pair of throwaway straight skis (they will allow you to accumulate miles and will eventually become your rock skis) or (2) wait till you have $250-$300 and buy a pair of year or two old, good quality shaped skis either in the off season or at a swap. Take someone really knowledgable about skis along with you to any swaps you go to - good equipment at a fair price goes fast.

BTW, I would strongly disagree with your comment that "skiing on straight skis is not going to make me a better skier". At the level you are at, skiing on any skis is going to make you a better skier. The trick is not to ingrain dead-end reflexes into your skill set by repetition of poor moves. The way to do this is to have a good instructor (yes, PSIA Level II or III) periodically critique your skiing and offer suggestions.

Hope this helps,

Tom / PM


PS - I noticed that you are in Mass. There are quite a few EpicSki members also in Mass. Maybe one lives near you and would be willing to mentor you. At minimum, I'm sure everyone on this board will be willing to give you all the tele-help you can use.

PS #2 - Just to make sure you understand the issue about bindings, realize that the fact that a boot can fit into a certain binding (with adjustment) does not make it an acceptable binding. There is a list of bindings that ski shops can legally work on. Ski techs will not even touch a binding not on that list - they probably won't even do a release check on it. Do a search on "indemnification" and you should turn up much discussion about this. The current list is at:
http://www.epicski.com/cgi-bin/ultim...c&f=1&t=001872
post #17 of 28
hey, if you are underage and can't buy beer then that leaves more money for boots!
post #18 of 28
Thread Starter 
Thanks Physics Man. I should have been more clear with my comment - what I meant is that skiing on straight skis will not make me a better skier than the same amount of time on shaped skis would. I know many people still on straight skis that hold that they are "better" because they learned on and continue to use equipment that is more difficult to use. They believe that straight skis give a better foundation of knowlege. I simply don't believe this. If not for shaped skis, I would not be at the level I am at now, and I am no worse than someone of the same level on straight skis, I believe.

Grolby
post #19 of 28
I completely support PhysicsMan's comments regarding learning on straight skis. You may not progress as quickly, but you will still be gaining valuable experience and having fun. Just try not to get frustrated if skiing is not as easy as you remember on shaped skis.
post #20 of 28
Yes and no.

If it is the K2's or no skiing then there is no choice. BUT... If the man has limited budget then I guess that means limited ski days too. On the K2's he will have to spend more time and money to get to the same level.

All time on the snow is fun but it is more fun when you are progressing quickly.
post #21 of 28
Grolby doesn't need to make this decision just yet. First, he needs to get that job to earn more money and talk to his parents about how much they might loan. Secondly, he needs to shop, shop, shop and learn what's hot/what's not, especially in BOOTS. Then, either after the season or in the fall when there are ski swaps, he needs to have a knowledgeable person help him get a decent fit in boots he can flex. Then, he's ready for serious consideration of skis. Straight skis [even new in the plastic] are a dime a dozen these days - they ALWAYS will be available to Grolby, so there's no rush. In the meantime, by learning, earning, and biding his time, he'll have a better chance to get equipment which suits him.
post #22 of 28
ditto- However, what model of K2 is it? Is it a K2 Two? That is an entery level ski. When you do get skis, get them a little higher level than where you are at. This way you have a ski you can "ski into" as you progress, and you won't have to go back to the store the very next year to buy skis again because your skiing ability is outskiing these.
At the store, price seems important. The wallet rules. Up on the hill, that all goes out the window. Those skis, boots, etc. better do what you tell them to do; otherwise you've bought a pig-in-a-poke regardless of whether you ski twice a year or 50 times a year.
post #23 of 28
Thread Starter 
The skis are K2 Select 7.9s, but as Oboe said, they're always there if I need cheap skis. My priorities have changed a bit - boots are number one, followed by skis that work for me. I've certainly got these skis on my mind, but there are other things to think about.
post #24 of 28
Grolby, welcome.
I've got two kids to take care of but,
when time comes to choose between boots and skis, I've always bought new boots for them
(nearly everey season).
Why? We ski very little (5-6 days a year, since the kids have entered our life, just to make it clear, multiply 5-6 dd by 4, and voilĂ , my before-marriage, before-kids avg days on skis are back), so we do not reach the threshold at which buying skis is more convenient than renting, neither for the boots but, I do want the boots to be their own, so that their feet/legs/muscles can get used to a given boot only (till the new one)
besides, I cringe at the idea of wearing boots that someone else just took off...
post #25 of 28
Used boots can be just fine. They usually have not just been taken off someone elses foot. The price differential between new and decent used is HUGE. I'd rather see Grolby in good used boots than not-so-hot new ones for the same amount of money.
post #26 of 28
with you there oboe! Hey Grolby - have you though about Ski Blades ? Some of the kids at Mt Hood Meadows are just ripping on them. Steeps, curd, bump and the park! They are cheaper than skis, most come with bindings and you learn to stay centered on them. I know a couple of PSIA level 3 instructors and they recommend blades to their younger students (we older guys tend to break too often when we fall and you spend a lot of time falling when you first learn this) as a learning device. What you learn on these will carry forward with you when go back to a more traditional ski. These are available in the used market as well.
post #27 of 28
Thread Starter 
How much cheaper, on average. I guess it's something else to think about, though I would greatly prefer to stick with skis for the time being.
post #28 of 28
Grolby- A while back I was lightly admonished concerning cost factors here. My apologies to you if my last post sounded as if I expected you to sell the farm to get new stuff.

Used boots may be a good idea. Push your fingernail into the side of the boot to see if the indent or mark stays there. I believe these are called the thermo-plastic boots. They weren't too hot. But then, there probably are not many of those around anymore.
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