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putting pistons on karmas

post #1 of 6
Thread Starter 
is putting a piston on my karmas an unrealistic idea? They will be used for mostly eastern groomers and occasional dumps. I cant seem to get away from a twin so im looking to make these a NY ice/crud/hardpact eater despite the fatness.
Also what would be the difernce(performance wise) between the 12.0 pc turbo or the regular 12.0 PC
post #2 of 6
looks? Seriously, I have had nothing but bad experiences with markers once you take them off the groomers. Markers: fine with clean boots and no snow, unreliable once you're in deep snow situations.

EDIT: took out mantras, me no read good.
post #3 of 6
I had Karmas with the Marker Free Ti's, shock pad. Great, versatile ski. So disagree that all Markers don't work in pow, although if you take any backside air, I'd probably opt for a Look or Rossignol cuz of their greater elasticity. On the other hand, Pistons are a really bad idea for the Karma. Why? a) Karmas carve surprisingly well on their own through 3/4 the turn, even on NE hardpack, and anyway pistons still can't get a twin tip's tail to finish, b) Pistons iron out a lot of the front end liveliness that's one of the signature things about the Karmas - it allows them to even handle bumps decently, and c) the extra lift puts that much more strain on your knees in deeper pow every time you turn. Markers, perhaps, but lose the pistons...
post #4 of 6
Sorry - didn't answer the rest of your question. Non-system Turbo pistons have a longer metal strip in front compared to the plain vanilla piston motion control which is mid-binding. Practical effect is to stiffen and quiet the front end considerably more. Marker/Volkl site has more info on this. I've skied turbos, regular pistons, pistonless Markers for a long time. Only prefer any piston on hard conditions at higher speeds. And if you're looking for that, you have the wrong ski, brother.
post #5 of 6
1. The Piston does NOT stiffen skis at all (the piston pushes in VERY easily, but pulls out slowly - this has the effect of quieting the REBOUND of the ski after it has been bent into a turn)

2. If you plan on running the Karmas on the East coast then the Piston might have some advantages if you'll spend more than 50% of your time on the groomers skiing the front-side.

3. Markers cannot be put back on without standing up (by pulling up on the heel lever) so they have a bit of a disadvantage when used in deep snow if you plan on losing a ski here or there.

4. The coupling (not retention stuff) at the toe piece is not as strong laterally as other bindings and therefore may introduce some "torsional" slop when used on wider skis.

You might consider looking into some Tyrolia Free Flex Plus bindings that provide some of the advantages of the Marker Piston without introducing the negatives of Marker bindings in general.
post #6 of 6
I have run Marker pistons on Karma's for 2 years now. There great. Better edge grip on the harder snow and no loss of versitility. For the sking you sound like you are going to do, they make sence.
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