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K2 Mod-x vs. ice vs. bindings

post #1 of 12
Thread Starter 
Just spent 5 days skiing at Whistler/Blackcomb, and all was awesome, still very cold and dry with blue skies 3+ days. I'm 5'8" and 158 lbs, and demo'd both the Vertigo G31 in 178 and Mod-x in 181. Vertigos very smooth, but too much work on bump runs. Mod-x's were great- Cranked out short turns, long turns, bumps, and shallow powder like butter( no deep powder available)
When i hit some ice later in the week a few times, the mod-x's had no edgehold. Is it me or is it typical for this ski? If i were to buy these, would putting a binding with a lifter of some sort make a difference, how high should it be, and any recommendations
on bindings? I really love these skis.

post #2 of 12
No not really. I skied a lot of ice on mine. While not great like my 9.20 Beta Race. You could manage. The tune is the most important. I use Sallie 912ti poweraxe.


post #3 of 12
I'm 6'4" about 200 - 205 pounds and ski the 195 Mod X. I've noticed that hardpack/ice is definitely its weak spot. The Mods handle the ice ok, but don't inspire a great deal of confidence (for me anyway). I agree that they are great in every other type of condition. You might want to check the Mod X Pro - I'm very interested in demoing a pair, but sprained my ankle a few weeks ago - so haven't been able to ski recently.
post #4 of 12
I demoed a ModX pro earlier this year at Whistler with some fairly hard ice at the bottom of the mountain. Although none of the skies(5)I used were great on the stuff, the pros were just about as good as any of them. Lots of slippery hard stuff on the final run into the village off of the Whistler side.
post #5 of 12
The only drawback to a shaped ski is ice on a hill steeper than 45° angle. mid ski doesn't seem to hold as wel as tip and tail. A ski with less side cut would do better. I once had a pair dynamic VR21's- incredible on ice!
However, there must be a way to compensate for this. Does anyone have any ideas on how to do this? Would I concentrate more on mid edge pressure with balance between both skis?
A lifter would help I imagine. My M51 Turbo SC's have a lift of 13mm. When I had them on my old skis they seemed to help me on ice very well. Now that they are on my Mod X's I have yet to try ice. haven't found any yet. I usaully had to go home before the sluch turned to ice for the evening. Bob

Life's a pain... then you nap. Cat philosphy
post #6 of 12
"The only drawback to a shaped ski is ice on a hill steeper than 45° angle." - Jyarddog, where did you come up with that? Nonsense. Shaped skis will hold better on ice than any long straight ski. When you put a shaped ski on edge, the wider tips and tails create more force against the snow at the ends of the skis, making them more stable and holding their edge better. That's why we ski them at shorter lengths. The best edge grip I've ever gotten is on my 150cm carving skis (I'm 6'2", 200#). Granted, those skis are too short for any real speed, but they hold like a pitbull. I also don't understand how the "over 45 degrees" comes into play.

As for Paulie's situation, a lifter could help a little bit, to get the pressure a little more on top of the edge, but it won't make up for any deficiencies in tuning or technique. If the ski is a mid fat (I don't remember the waist measurement of the Mod X), then a lifter might not be much of an advantage. On a very narrow waisted ski, a lifter will also keep you from booting out when laying them way over and carving.
post #7 of 12
Ht - 5'8"; Wt - 170
188 Mod X Pro w/Marker 9.1 Ti SC

I ski these as my everyday sticks. Here in SoCal, we get to do a lot of night skiing, which usually means getting our fair share of hard-pack and ice. I would give them an A-/B+ on ice. There are definitely better skis for those conditions, such as a G31 or 10.20. I do notice that the 3 setting on the SC bindings does seem to help a little, although most of that is translated into smoothness at speed on hard snow versus edge grip. I have a 193-cm G30, which, when compared to the Mod, is an ice skate.
post #8 of 12
jyarddog - I hope you don't ski on ice on a hill steeper than 45 degrees too often. That's really asking for it.


"I also don't understand how the "over 45 degrees" comes into play."

Actually, if you start spending alot of time on anything steeper than 40 degrees - in harder snow, wind packed snow, styro-snow, dense crust, or hard crust - you'll soon realise exactly why "shaped" skis are not only less effective, but somewhat of a handicap.

It's called BRIDGING and is quite a shock the first time you experience it, especially if you're in an area of exposure. Essentially the tips and tails touch the mountain at one level while the center touches much further downhill. The 'shape' exagerates the bend of the ski (even at a standstill) to a point where:
1. you can not traverse in a straight line unless you force the tips and tails to break free of their edge - this isn't good in exposed areas.
2. at the bottom of the turn where the skis receive the most pressure in steep situations, they suddenly and dramatically increase bend and lock-in trying to loop back up the mountain - this means the ski is decreasing it's turn radius quickly and if you're not ready for it you'll go over the handle bars.
3. even if you are ready for it, it creates a non-linear flow to the turns - read as: jerky - and this is hardly the characteristic you want when starting into the top of something three ski lengths in width labelled as a "No fall gully".
post #9 of 12
John H- I got that 45° angle thing from an article by Todd Murcheson at www.snotech.com called 10 myths about shaped skis.
One item in the list of myths is the shaped ski's ability of floatation. He says they don't float any better than the straight skis. He cites that the shaped ski has the same sq cm's ove the base as its equivalent 15 cm longer straight ski, therefore same floatation. I would argue, whereas this may be true, I would think that the floatation ability of a shaped ski comes from its sq cm's in width rather than length. This would give the shaped ski floatation in powder at slower speeds than the straight ski before it would start to sink. To make a point, consider an exagerated example- Build a 3 cm wide ski and stretch it out long enough to equal the sq cm of a decent floating or powder ski. How fast or how slow could one go on this ski before it would float or sink? A bare-footed water skier can ski at higher speeds but when the speed drops he becomes a bare-footed diver!
The above is just a thought for discussion. According to the laws of physics I'm probably all wet. ANyway, whatcha all think about dis anywho?

Life's a pain... then you nap. Cat philosphy
post #10 of 12
This isn't the Paulie at Hillcrest Ski & Snowboard in Oregon City is it?

Life's a pain... then you nap. Cat philosphy
post #11 of 12
Getting back to the orginal post question. Iam about the same as you Paul as iam 5'8" 150lbs, i have Look Pivot 7 bindings on mine, Mod X 181, anyway i didnt have any problem with ice edge hold as you are saying. I also skied Atomic Beta/carv X 9.18 this past year and Mods held ice almost as well as 9.18's did. Now For next year i got at end of season Atomic beta Race 9.20 for icey days, but i did ski Gore Mountain with the Mod X on a real icey day after the had a small ice storm which covered all the streets and hills with ice. I skied the double black Rumor there, dont have a clue how steep it is but its pretty steep. I did fine, i know i would have rather had the Race 9.20's but the Mod X did fine. I have demoed all the other mid fat ski's (Atomic 10.20, 922SL,Volkl Vertido30,Salomon Extreme Series, Pilot 10's(they sucked), Ross Bandits and thought the Mod X were best, Atomic 10.20 best on hard pack but Mod X still very good but better in moguls. Only thing about Mod X and most mid fats is they arent real fast edge to edge. Get your's tuned for next season and try demoing some other types, to see if you still think they dont hold on ice for you. I dont think another binding or lifter will make much differnce.
post #12 of 12
Thread Starter 
Yeah, I'm pretty sure most of the problem was the tune. I think I may buy the Axis X
next year, I loved 'em. Anyway, I'm still primed for skiing this year, goin' to Whistler again on May 4-5, and again on May18-19. I even talked my wife into having our summer vacation at Whistler( heh-heh)
There's a mogul camp I want to do that should be pretty sweet late July on the glacier.

And no I'm not that Paulie. I'm a 43 y.o. reborn ski fanatic who gave it up for 15 years( don't even ask me why) except that my priorities were all screwed up.
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