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How bad are Markers?

post #1 of 152
Thread Starter 
I have read alot of bad things on this site about Marker bindings. I have been using Tyrolia/Fischer for the past 6 years and never had problems but due to circumstances beyond my control I have to switch. I will be skiing Volkl so obviously have to use Markers, and I am worried about the reputation for premature release. The only times I have been injured skiing and racing has been from binding release when they arent supposed to, never from not releasing even though I crank them up. So how bad are they?
post #2 of 152
The only thing to do is box em up and send them to me for proper --ah, disposal.

BTW, I'll need the surface they were mounted on for testing ---so send them along as well. Any box under 170 cm (hint, hint) should hold everything quite nicely.
post #3 of 152
I wouldn't worry about it being a major issue.

I've had 2 pairs of Marker binding with no release issues at all. If I've got one gripe, it's that I seem to have a heck of a time getting back into them in deeper snow, compared to my Look/Rossi bindings.
post #4 of 152
I Have Two pairs of ski's with marker bindings ,NO PROBLEMS EVER!!!

The old markers had no return to center the new ones do. Why would it be that some of the best ski's made today use them?

Hey Coach; On a marker binding, there is a easy on in any snow, deep or not.
push down on the rear lever before pushing your foot down you can use either a pole or your hand just like the look. then push your foot down. There will be no resistance.
post #5 of 152
I've used Markers for a while and have NEVER had a problem with them.

I've had similar results with Solomon and I have also seen them trashed...including the model I currently have on my Rossi's
post #6 of 152
I've had Markers for years. I've never had an issue with them.
I do agree with the comment that their design makes putting them on after a digger in deep snow a bit difficult as compared with Salomans...but I've never had a release issue.
post #7 of 152
Markers are as bad as the user is ignorant. The same goes for all binding companies.
Later
GREG
post #8 of 152
I have a pair of Elan S12 Fusions. They have Markers. The new ones have Tyrolias, but originally they used Marker. I'm not sure why they switched. This made me wonder, but I have to admit that I have never had any pre-release problems.
post #9 of 152
If you think there are a lot of negative comments about Markers on this site, try the TGR forums. While there are always people around who have never had any bad experiences with them, Markers seem to generate way more stories of horror pre-releases than all other brands combined.

I think Markers are fine for about 90% of the people out there. It is just the top 10% of skiers who push their gear who pre-release at their recommended setting. The usual fix seems to be crank up the DIN setting by a few notches but this increases your risk of injury from the binding failing to release when you need it to. In my mind the safest binding is one which allows you to ski at the lowest DIN setting without pre-releasing. Even with the bindings cranked up I just wouldn't have complete confidence that Markers wouldn't pre-release at the worst possible time.

Can you get flat versions of the skis you want and put other bindings on them?

As long as you are gentle with them you will probably be fine with the Markers. But if it was me I wouldn't want to use a binding that I worried about all the time. And if you do get them you will want to check the forward pressure is set correctly on a regular basis.
post #10 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by booch
So how bad are they?
They are so bad they released when i needed it most and not when i didn't.
So my advice is do not get them I remember i had two falls some time ago and in both cases binding release was critical. Anyway, if you do a little search you will see that there are threads dealing with this subject. I did not join the previous discussions but i want to say that there is nothing wrong with these bindings, at least the ones i am using (Comp 14.0 EPS).

Soo, if you (any of you) do not like Markers, do not buy them!
post #11 of 152
ive raced on markers for several years and never had any problems
post #12 of 152
If I told you, you wouldn't believe me
post #13 of 152

Markers? Hell yeah

I have skiied Markers for 12 years. I have heard the phrase "Markering out" as it applies to pre-release. My feeling is that it relates to the Germanic precision with which the binding responds in a release situation. Once the release force is met, the binding will not re-center, so, "goodbye ski". I don't find this to be a threat, just an understandable idiosyncracy of the bindings' "feel". I have come to prefer Salomon for their apparently more "elastic" toe mechanism, but I find the Markers ultimately comforting in their precision.
post #14 of 152
I had a nasty release from Marker bindings on two occasions. I always crank my bindings down about 2 steps so they should not have released under the conditions. One time I came through fine but the second time I dislocated my shoulder. No more Marker bindings for me.
post #15 of 152
Markers were redesigned a few year back with a re-center toe piece. The old markers did snap out and not recenter.
post #16 of 152
I had nothing but Marker bindings for years after Geze went out of business. Several prereleases while skiing moguls and deep powder. Last one resulted in surgery on my right shoulder. Switched to Rossi bindings and have never had an issue. Believe what you wish but for everyone who says they have never had a problem there is one that has had a problem. Some people don't ski as hard as others.
post #17 of 152
I have also experienced pre-ejeculation with Markers.
post #18 of 152
I have never experienced pre-release with my all-metal Tyrolia 490s. I did experience pre-release with markers, but they were garage-sale antiques (M46 twincams I think), that I only skied twice (once after a shop "tune" and once after I fixed them) to see if the skis were worth putting a binding on. I'm so happy that my new Fischer bindings are basically Tyrolias. I've had good fortune with Solomon too, and not enough experience with Looks.
post #19 of 152
Markers are fine. Most people crank up their bindings cause they think it will help. They key is forward pressure. If you have that set correctly, you should not come out when you do not need to. Honestly most good to expert skiers, including many freeride athletes use markers and do not have any problem.

Oh by the way, Marker is the most technologically advanced binding out there, and one of the safest. So when you come out of a marker, it might save your knees.
post #20 of 152
Had two knee injuries--both in the moguls. Not going fast, but each fall should have released my boot from binding. I am not blaming the bindings--I would blame my skiing first and foremost. That said,,, I try to set my DIN 1 under what the calculation reports. Both injuries, MARKER. Two differerent models. I switched skis and had to go with Look. I am a P12 FAN. Just purchased a new pair of skis and got the P14s, not because of the DIN, its just the binding that came premounted on my deal of the decade. The "clicking in thing" doesnt bother me, I just check it if I dont hear the positive "click" P12/14s are known for not making a click sound.
post #21 of 152
I walked out of a Marker once last season (2004 model), and found the forward pressure to be set ever so slightly less than the other ski...made the adjustment and that was the end of the problem. I also ski at my prescribed din setting.

I still like my Tyrolia (Fischer) bindings better....
post #22 of 152
I've skied mostly Markers since the 80's, Looks before that. Even have an old MRR 14 around somewhere. Never had any problems, but if you don't trust them, I've heard a lot of good things lately about Tyrolia, and Looks remain the standard for handling shocks full out if you can still find the classic rotary heel. Salomons may be TOO bombproof; tore a knee on them cuz they didn't release.
post #23 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coach13
I wouldn't worry about it being a major issue.
I would.
Mine preleased and I will not purchase Markers again. I have them on two pair of skis and had to up the DIN.

I've not had the problem with the Looks on my other two pair of skis.
post #24 of 152
I have pre-released from every set of Markers I've had. Didn't get them for years, and then a couple of years ago was assured the problem was fixed, so got some. Quite low-end ones, but I was skiing on a DIN of 6-ish, so didn't need high end ones, right? Second run on them, I was airborne with one ski still on, and the other sitting right where I'd been turning. Cost me a LOT of beers as it was right next to the t-bar.

Never again. No more Markers. And yes, the forward pressure was set right, I took special trouble with that.
I like Salomons, they do the job with no fuss.
post #25 of 152
At this point in the thread most people are already tired of reading about Marker bindings being infamous for pre-release issues, but please stay with me and read these comments.

I've used Markers for 30+ years - they were my binding of choice up until a couple years ago. Just this past season I figured out that both the heel and toe have a serious design flaw involving their ability to tightly couple a skier to their skis.

First the toe piece. This design allows way too much "play" between the boot and binding when a ski is put on edge. This problem is exacerbated by today's wider skis. To test this put a ski with Marker on a hard flat floor, put a boot in the binding, and then stand on the ski outside the heel and toe of the binding to "lock" the ski to the floor. Then push the boot side-to-side as if a skier was edging a ski. You'll notice up to 3mm of "play" for each side of the toe piece.

Now the heel. If you must ski on Markers I strongly recommend that you do not "oversize" the bindings for your typical DIN setting. Why? Because a Marker heel that is not set near the top end of its adjustment range will allow a huge amount of vertical travel. This isn't the "good" travel that you get with high elasticity bindings like a Look. This is travel that literally increases your delta angle if your weight gets set too far forward while skiing. It's just absolute sloppiness in the heel mechanism. If the heel is cranked up this sloppiness is significantly reduced, but for me on my DIN 14 (Comp 14.0 Piston Control Turbo) the heel needs to be on 12 to completely eliminate this unwanted travel.

Add in what many consider pre-release issues and the fact that the heel cannot be manually operated to get your skis on in deep snow and I can't see why anyone who has been educated on these facts would choose Marker over other brands that are available.

Do you really want that integrated Marker ski system binding? Buy that ski flat if you can and never look back.
post #26 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by skifordad
Honestly most good to expert skiers, including many freeride athletes use markers and do not have any problem.
That's a pretty ridiculous statement. Hardly any big-mountain guys, and even fewer jibbers use Marker bindings.
post #27 of 152
Honestly, there is/was a large crowd of top alpine racers on Markers. From about 90% of 1956 Olympians including Sailer, Klammer, Stenmark, Mahres, most German champions like Seizinger, MvG (Grunigen), Meissnitzer, Koznick to Poutiainen.
Sure, Klammer´s and Stenmark´s M4/Rotamat FD is no help for today´s skiers and the racers use the 1800/18.0 or 3000/30.0 which is not what you buy.

I had been on Markers from the late 60s to the 90s. Almost everybody here was because Czechoslovakia was the only other place than Eschenlohe/Germany where the production was running since the early 70s. I remember having "markered out" prematurely on 5 consecutive races back in 1972. When they finally brought the stiffer (black) springs for the heel and the M4-S toe all problems with the Rotamat disappeared.

Just a side remark: to marker out doesn´t mean prelease here and in some other European countries: it´s just "to release". "Marker" is used because it became a synonym for a safety release binding here.

I would agree with skifordad that Markers are extremely technologically loaded (cf. the Biometric toe vs. Salomon or old Ess/Atomic). Which probably doesn´t have to be an advantage in all situations and for everybody. (???)

I´m not using Markers anymore (paradoxically because the main shareholder/boss of the company now producing all Markers except Motions lives around the corner) but it´s because I got most of my current bindings free. If they were Markers I would be on Markers.
post #28 of 152
i have never had a problem with my marker 1200s. actually, i recently mounted a pair of look p12s to a ski (a binding and company most people swear by) and actually like the marker a little better. go figure.
post #29 of 152
This thread is great we have people that don't like Markers because they pre-release AND people that don't like them because they don't release easily enough. Whta binding was it that Bode Miller had trouble with a few years ago? Didn't he ski a DH (or was it a Guper-G?) on one ski? I don't think it was a Marker...
post #30 of 152
I've preferred Markers over any other brand for as long as I can remember.

Have I popped out of them in pow when I wasn't expecting to? Yep, I've also done it in my Rossi and Sally bindings. Are they unsafe? No. The "good for 90% of skiers" comment is crap as is the "if you baby them, they'll be fine" comment. Where does this garbage come from?

I've never "babied" a ski or binding in my life.
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