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Gates on lifts?

post #1 of 44
Thread Starter 
Ok help needed please...

Checkracer, Nobody, Dangerous Brian...

can you tell us at the resorts you ski at the proportions of the lifts that are gated versus not?

Please include all T-bars, pomas, gondolos etc as we are after the proportion of lifts not chairs (long story)
post #2 of 44
Detachable 6 chairs have gates / the others do not?

MTT
post #3 of 44
Thread Starter 
Thanks MTT....

Just someone is trying to tell me MOST lifts (note the lifts not chairs) these days have gates... (o that people can count to 2 or 4 more easily....& know when to load)

My experience does not back this up - but I thought i should research a little....

I was trying to explain to them that it is hardly the lift companies fault if people just cannot learn how to load/unload/ride a lift.... they seem to feel the lift companies should be sued for failing to install gates as a safety feature... (I have no problem with it being the lift companies problem if the lifty is not paying attention & fails to STOP a lift but you cannot expect them to have to keep adding safety features for every single person that is incapable of loading/unloading)
post #4 of 44
This thread should have been called, "Make it idiot-proof and someone will design a better idiot." Although I'm sympathetic to people forced to load 6 packs w/ small children...You've got a better chance of flapping your arms and flying up the mountain than getting 3 or 4 kids to pay attention long enough to successfully load one of those things!
post #5 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by iskitoofast4u
This thread should have been called, "Make it idiot-proof and someone will design a better idiot." Although I'm sympathetic to people forced to load 6 packs w/ small children...You've got a better chance of flapping your arms and flying up the mountain than getting 3 or 4 kids to pay attention long enough to successfully load one of those things!
Actually, Breck has this one figured out. They have two lines and each line loads every-other chair (this in the beginner/Peak 9 area). It works really well, actually.
post #6 of 44
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by iskitoofast4u
This thread should have been called, "Make it idiot-proof and someone will design a better idiot." Although I'm sympathetic to people forced to load 6 packs w/ small children...You've got a better chance of flapping your arms and flying up the mountain than getting 3 or 4 kids to pay attention long enough to successfully load one of those things!

AFAIK Oz has only 4's - and ONE eight pack... the eight is in a beginner area & everytime i have ridden it it loads so badly it is not funny.... It has gates & a carpet to put them in the right place etc tec & it is still a shocker!
Unloading is just a doozy!
post #7 of 44
they only mess up once, in my experience. Empirical learning... when the chair wipes you onto the ground, you pay attention next time.
post #8 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by ant
they only mess up once, in my experience. Empirical learning... when the chair wipes you onto the ground, you pay attention next time.
Interesting, now that you mention it. At Breck, there is quite a drop from the loading area, I assume to help the chairs miss the kids if they don't get on?
post #9 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by ssh
Actually, Breck has this one figured out. They have two lines and each line loads every-other chair (this in the beginner/Peak 9 area). It works really well, actually.
Well USUALLY it does. :

I've had beginners get really freaked because all the gates don't open at the same time. That timing makes sense because it's a right-angle load, the chair is coming around a corner down the hill, swinging 90 degrees left to line up across the hill for loading, and then swinging another 90 left to head uphill. But because it does the turn right in front of the gates, the leftmost person has the least amount of time to slide out in front for loading, while the rightmost has the most time. But if Suzy is looking at Judi and Harry, she either waits too long or tries to go before it's open. I make a point of explaining "go when YOUR gate opens, don't look at the people next to you" whenever I have a class going up there the first few times. Still see people getting flustered.
post #10 of 44
Well this really makes me feel out of the loop, because I've never even seen a gated lift, couldn't even tell what you were talking about at first. My local hill has 45 year old double lifts. Then again, when I skied at Timberline (Mt. Hood) this summer, they had high speed quads, and there were no gates on them.
post #11 of 44
The Breck ones were funny, actually I seem to remember Copper having an artful load for their big lifts, too. Keystone just had staggered gates for their 6 packs, I think that's the norm. The right-angled approach adds an extra degree of difficulty.

You'd want a dip or something, so people don't get smeared all over the ground by the chair! It's not just kids who mess up... they just get more traumatised by it. It's amazing to watch parents doing silly things, and the kids end up hanging by an arm or dropping off the sides. Not nice to watch.
post #12 of 44
Actually this reminds me of a friend here in Oz who fell afoul of the wooden flap gates for a 4 seater, the flaps knocked him over about 3 times and then a chair got him. We and the lifties were in pain from laughing so much... he was just totally out of synch so every time the gates flapped, they got him and knocked him down, and as he got up, they'd flap the other way and get him again. God it was funny! Especially as he's a really good technical skiier. It was most unlike him.
post #13 of 44
Many euro lifts are gated. This can actually mean dual gates, because there will be one set of gates for the lift pass readers (electronic), and then one at the loader.
post #14 of 44
And here I thought gates in skiing were bamboo or breakaway...
post #15 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by ssh
Actually, Breck has this one figured out. They have two lines and each line loads every-other chair (this in the beginner/Peak 9 area). It works really well, actually.
My small ski experience in High school was limited to double chairs with no bars back in the 70's in PA. So Breck was a revelation this past December. I think I was on the skis for less than 10 minutes before I was in the loading line for that Peak 9 Lift. Louie was like .." stop at the gate and when it opens, go". I was thinking "Gate? What Gate? Why is there a gate?" - I hadn't ever seen a chair that big in my life before, so I had no idea. Once I got up to the front of the line though, then it made sense.... crowd/herd control.

The tricky part for me - even with a season's worth of practice - is with the angled ones if I am on the end - inside seat - making sure my butt is lined up so I actually get ON and not get the chair arm in the butt.:
post #16 of 44
I'm with you nolo. I was thinking, well, I carry the bundle across my knees when I ride the chair...

We don't have any lift corral gates here yet. That would cost money.
post #17 of 44
To the person who only skis one week a year, they are a good idea. But for those us of us who ski/skied alomost every day, the gates can be a pain.
If your watching the next chair come around the bullwheel(the corner) and you follow it as soon as it passes, there shouldn't be a problem.
On 6 paks, since there are 6 people trying to get onto te ramp they are good. Cause every one isn't watching whats going on.
On fixed grip chairs you gotta be on top of the game or you will get tagged, and it doesnt feel good.
gates on a lift other than a 6pak, are a extra cost to the resort
post #18 of 44
Gates on lifts are just like safety bars on the chairs. The manufacturer charges extra for them and resorts will only install them when it is either the law or neccessary due to safety or capacity concerns. You won't see gated lifts proliferate unless there is a financial gain, since no states have laws that require them.
post #19 of 44
My memory's not perfect, but I think I've only seen them on 6-packs, not on anything smaller.

They make sense on the six, I think. Aside from the timing aspect, it's helpful in getting straight exactly how many people are loading and assembling groups of six (or at least close). This can be legitimately confusing: since people typically don't ski in groups of exactly six, there are a fair number of permutations.

They're actually kind of tricky with the smallest kids: they make it harder to push or pull the kid next to you while going through the gate yourself, and if the kid doesn't start moving forward with sufficient alacrity, the closing gate will pop 'em in the snout.

On a quad it seems unnecessary.
post #20 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by Powdr
Gates on lifts are just like safety bars on the chairs. The manufacturer charges extra for them and resorts will only install them when it is either the law or neccessary due to safety or capacity concerns. You won't see gated lifts proliferate unless there is a financial gain, since no states have laws that require them.
So: why do many lifts have safety bars in states that don't require them?
post #21 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by sjjohnston
So: why do many lifts have safety bars in states that don't require them?
It is my opinion that state statute is NOT the driving force , it is the areas insurer.

I have no real evidence---thats just a hunch.

That, however, doesn't explain all instances tho---take Alta/Snowbird---no idea if they have a common insurer, but there are opposites in terms of safety bars---even on Alta's detachable quads---which are relatively new.
post #22 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by sjjohnston
So: why do many lifts have safety bars in states that don't require them?
Because there is a percieved value that the bar provides. Deer Valley puts them on all their lifts because their guests expect them. Alta does not. DV charges $73/ticket, Alta charges almost half that.

Powdr
post #23 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by sjjohnston
My memory's not perfect, but I think I've only seen them on 6-packs, not on anything smaller.
I know Breck has them on the mid-point load of the interconnect quad (which certainly makes sense). Actually, a friend saved a little girl from falling off after she, her sister, and mom loaded at the midpoint last year...

But, I think that Breck has them on all the HS chairs, don't they?
post #24 of 44
Gates, IMO a pain, except as disski said on the PB Village 8 - which I always try to avoid.



Now safety bars, that’s another thing. After being stranded on for 10 minutes on Sunday on the MountP triple, 3/4 of the way up, 20 metres off the ground, lift on wind hold (gusts up to 100 kph) and being bounced around like a yo-yo........... safety bars are my friend :
post #25 of 44
You're lucky you weren't on the Mt P Double (AKA The Death Chair). It has been known to derail in high winds.
post #26 of 44
Only the trams I ride. IMHO, gates are for gapers. They rate right up there with "safety" bars.
post #27 of 44
You know, in reviewing this thread, I didn't even know that Bill and his family skied...
post #28 of 44
Yeah, I was thinking "Bill Gates", then maybe it was another name for "the bar" to keep you on the chair. Finally figured out it was those things they have at places where people line up like cattle.

I hate them.

We never had them at my home mountain back East and we don't have them where I am now. I really don't see what value they add, they're just another thing to accidentally straddle on the way to the chair.

Like I said, I've only seen them at places where there are lots of skiers and not even all of those places. Since I've never been on a six pack, that means I've only been subjected to them when getting on a quad.
post #29 of 44
You asked for my European experience.

No gates at T-bars. No use, on the contrary: you have to line up as fast as possible, there´s little time between the T-bars coming. Two skiers are a "team" which can organize well. If not, the worst to happen is either just one or none going up.
Lifts: most new quads (Doppelmayr, Leitner, Poma) have them. It seems to me that they are part of the installation. They are a must when the lift has non-detachable seats and that moving carpet (or how you call it in English exactly).
In quads with detachable seats (they slow down before boarding them) the gates seem to be unnecessary for experienced skiers but they are probably of some help for novices. A quad at my home hill used to let them open permanently but there were even more confusions in the high season with lots of inexperienced skiers.
The gates seem to be a necessary organization tool in 6- or even 8-packs.

Haven´t seen them in gondolas - again, no use, counterproductive.

A lot of - probably most or even almost all (I never paid a special attention) older lifts don´t have them. They are not quads, though.

If you have a liftee standing at the right point and organizing people you probably don´t need the gate so much in a typical quad. If the line is completely self-organized, it seems to be better to have them.
post #30 of 44
checkracer you hit the nail on the head,
So true , if the lifite is at thier post , watching people come out to the load board. If they are on top of thier game, they won't have to stop the lift, yet can get 4/6 butts lined up for the next chair.
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