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Pre or Post Season Grind??

post #1 of 20
Thread Starter 
Do you guys like to get base grinds at the end of the season before storage, after the first few months of skiing in the early season, or right before the season starts?

I am thinking of getting all my good skis done now so they are ready for next year. Last year when I wanted SkiDoc to tune my 1080s he was too busy so I may get all my grinds in the offseason.

If you live in Mass I think Mike is running a grind and storage service which is good for people with small apartments and no storage like me. I think he is also offering free return shipping too for you out of staters. You should definately check out one of his tunes if you have been unhappy with other places and appreciate detailed work.

http://www.precisiontuningcenter.com/
post #2 of 20
My only concern with a post-season grind is that the ski may change shape (ever so slightly) during storage/resting. My practice has always been to just lay on a thick coat of storage wax for the off-season and then have them ground right before the season starts.
post #3 of 20
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Noodler
My only concern with a post-season grind is that the ski may change shape (ever so slightly) during storage/resting.
Could you elaborate on what in the ski construction causes this and what impact it will have on the base?

Are you speaking about camber or something else.

Thanks
post #4 of 20
I only get a grind when I need a lot of p-tex repair because they usually grind after that or if my skis are not flat. In general I only grind when necessary because to avoid running out of ptex. Running out of ptex is more of a concern for me with fat skis because I hit more rocks on powder days but still, why grind unless you really need it.

dt
post #5 of 20
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by dtraub1
why grind unless you really need it.

dt

My 1080s still have the factory tune and they are alittle base high with bevels in excess of 2 degrees.

My wife also took a chunk out of her bases on her Atomics.

I like to get my skis ground so I have fresh ptex that is not abraded and will absorb wax more easily. Also the base bevel will gradually increase over the course of the season due to wear and maintenance.
post #6 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scalce
Also the base bevel will gradually increase over the course of the season due to wear and maintenance.
I rarely touch the bottoms of the edges but I deburr the sides after every day on firm snow. It seems to keep them nice and sharp and this is part of my conservation of bases.

dt
post #7 of 20
One advantage of a post season grind is that you can use the summer months to hot scrape, brush and wax for the upcoming season. All that activity will help remove the P-Tex micro hairs left behind by the stone grind and give you something do during the dog days of summer.
post #8 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lostboy
One advantage of a post season grind is that you can use the summer months to hot scrape, brush and wax for the upcoming season. All that activity will help remove the P-Tex micro hairs left behind by the stone grind and give you something do during the dog days of summer.
I hadn't considered this idea and it is an interesting one.

Regarding my comment about a ski changing "shape" - I have absolutely no proof of this in real world experience since I have never done a post-season grind and then re-checked them after Summer storage. My theory is that is MAY be possible for a ski base to become somewhat less level/flat during a long period of inactivity in warmer temperatures. I have absolutely no scientific basis for this and I may be way off base here. I only posted the idea to see if someone else would chime in on it.
post #9 of 20
I've been told that base deformation sometimes occurs with new skis since they're ground at the factory before the ski has completely cured and settled. Beyond that, I don't think it's an issue with modern skis just like summer camber loss which isn't a big concern these days.

-T
post #10 of 20
Don't stone grind unless you need to. Wait until after you have skied them during the early season next Nov. Unless there is big damage, don't worry. Put a little wax on the metal edges and just dream about next season.

Hey BTW I'll have 68 days this coming Sunday when Okemo closes April 10th. See you and the Misses next season. Take care of that leg.
post #11 of 20
I only grind when absolutely necessary - too much time and effort in the base prep and waxing to re-do it often. The better and more frequently you maintain during the season, the less the need for a base grind.

I tend to get a needed grind before I put them away for the season, but there is a downside: Come next year and all the new toys, I have given in all too often and ended up either not using a skis I had freshly ground at the end of the season, or selling them...
post #12 of 20
I try to get them ground as little as possible. To that end I try and stay away from the baseedge so my bevel won't grow. I just polish the side edges.
post #13 of 20
That's right! Only stone grind when necessary.

Some people need to start off the season with a brand new finish and some don't.

No deformation of base occurs over the off-season months. Do not store in areas that undergo extreme temperature fluctuation. Skis should be strapped at the tip and tail and stand upright, not hang from the tips, as this may distort the natural camber line. One may also lay them on their side.

If skis are wiped thoroughly at the end of the season, and kept in a reasonably stable atmosphere, such as a utility room or closet, then no rusting should occur.
If one plans on stone grinding next fall instead of this summer, it would be silly to waste the wax and the energy if the skis are going to be stone ground anyway.

Wax left on edges of skis that are subjected to moisture will actually trap it and begin to rust. This is a fact as most skis are shipped over the ocean to get here. They come fully waxed and shrink wrapped from the factory in a climate controlled environment. In my experience as PM for Volkl, many skis come repleat with brown edge segments before they ever hit the shelves. Not that this is a perfromance issue, it's just a reality. Just wipe those baby's and wipe'em some more before you put them away, especially if they've traveled on the outside of the car for the winter.

Proper stone grinding leaves a virtually hairless finish on the base. Beating the snot out of it over the summer will surely degrade a great finish and actually create base hairs before it ever hits the slopes. An occasional hot wax with Dominator graphite Base Renew is all that's necessary. It's extremely soft for max penetration. Too much hot waxing and aggressive brushing always has a diminishing return over time, as it will eventually narrow the range of base glide over varying snow temps, so one must be prudent. Heat is what builds skis and it will also destroy them.

Skidoc
post #14 of 20
So you are saying that if they are clean and dry, I shoul;dn't wax them? You could save me some time here. Usually, I give them a liberal coat of CH7 at the end of the season. I figure that's a reasonable wax for the next time I want them.
post #15 of 20
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by epic
So you are saying that if they are clean and dry, I shouldn't wax them? You could save me some time here. Usually, I give them a liberal coat of CH7 at the end of the season. I figure that's a reasonable wax for the next time I want them.
I have spoken to SkiDoc about this in the past.

He made the point that the ptex base is essentially a form of plastic so it does not oxidize.

So a base shouldn't dry out anymore then how they were when you first stored them.
post #16 of 20
I totally agree with some of the posters above. Grind only when necessary.

Check the bases with a true bar (or some other flat piece of metal), you can use a flashlight to help.

Pay attention to the area under the boot. If you have been waxing frequently you probably won't need a grind.
post #17 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scalce
I have spoken to SkiDoc about this in the past.

He made the point that the ptex base is essentially a form of plastic so it does not oxidize.

So a base shouldn't dry out anymore then how they were when you first stored them.
I find that interesting. Some years I have forgotten to put on the suggested summer storage coat of wax and have never noticed and change over the summer. If they were skiing well in the spring they are still good in the fall.

I often side file my skis during the winter, so I don't need many tunes. I do have a diamond whetstone, but if I have dulled the edges it doesn't do what the file does. Most experinced tuners here use just the diamond stone. What is the brand of choice, as I am due for a new one? Lew
post #18 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yuki
I totally agree with some of the posters above. Grind only when necessary.

Check the bases with a true bar (or some other flat piece of metal), you can use a flashlight to help.

Pay attention to the area under the boot. If you have been waxing frequently you probably won't need a grind.
Even a base that has been waxed frequently may still become worn away by a lack of stone grinding and skiing on relatively hard snow, particularly under the foot. The base edge angle may still be at 1 degree, but the base itself is convex.

Skis that are evaluated then stone ground properly, given that they are not excessively damaged before grinding, can be serviced for a very long time.

I have customers that beat their equipment every weekend, I try to explain how life expectancy is going to be an issue. However, they don't care as they place "having fun" over worrying about hitting the next rock. Typically, with constant servicing, these individuals new skis last 1 year, from say December 1st to December 31st the following year. Not too bad.

However one maximizes the "fun factor" out there on skis is what's most important!

Skidoc
post #19 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by LewBob
I find that interesting. Some years I have forgotten to put on the suggested summer storage coat of wax and have never noticed and change over the summer. If they were skiing well in the spring they are still good in the fall.

I often side file my skis during the winter, so I don't need many tunes. I do have a diamond whetstone, but if I have dulled the edges it doesn't do what the file does. Most experinced tuners here use just the diamond stone. What is the brand of choice, as I am due for a new one? Lew

We use the Moonflex stones daily to touch up our edges. I only file when I feel the need to. I only touch the base bevel prior to waxing. I only knock off any high spots so they don't scratch the iron.
post #20 of 20
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Max Capacity
We use the Moonflex stones daily to touch up our edges. I only file when I feel the need to. I only touch the base bevel prior to waxing. I only knock off any high spots so they don't scratch the iron.
I agree 100%

I love my moonflex stones and I don't like scratchng my iron.
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