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Race stock GS: Volkl vs. Atomic

post #1 of 23
Thread Starter 
Has anyone compared the Atomic GS11m race stock with the Volkl p50 or p60 GS race stocks? I am interested in how different they feel, relative strengths, etc.

Thanks

Wrxpilot
post #2 of 23
My understanding is that the Volkls are quite a light ski, easy to turn and not super powerful, while the Atomics are powerful, heavier and more set in thier tracks. I have not tried either though.
post #3 of 23
I wouldn't call the Volkls "light"..... They are fairly easy to turn for a race stock ski.
For me, the Atomic "locks in" to a turn shape a bit too much, making it difficult to adjust your line.
Both have incredible edge grip on hardpack and ice. The Volkls suck in soft snow. The Atomics may too, but I don't have as much experience on those.
post #4 of 23
Thread Starter 

GS11M flex numbers

Anyone what know what typical flex numbers are for GS11M race stocks in 186? Is 50/40 stiff, soft or average?

Thanks

Wrxpilot
post #5 of 23
I guess there are posts on the Atomic describing it into detail including the length, flex and radius differences.
I basically agree with D(C)´s general characteristics though I would be carefull with the "not super powerfull".

The Volkl I tested (190 cm, Marker WC plate, Marker binding, tune unknown but prepared for a race ski demo) was a soft and light ski that turned extremely easily. It´s different from other GS skis (with the exception of Salomon but the ski offered was the retail model, not the LAB GS) and it probably needs some adjustment, especially when compared with the narrowish Atomic which needs more input to initiate a turn.
For me, the Atomic (the AO4114 = 186 cm/26,1 m) and Head (190 cm/26,5 m) were exactly the opposite to the Volkl and the non-LAB Salomon mentioned.

As has also been stated repeatedly (and I don´t want to intrude the realm of both Atomic experts), the 181,186,191 cm/21,5 m (=AO4108) would surely feel different.
post #6 of 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by wrxpilot
Anyone what know what typical flex numbers are for GS11M race stocks in 186? Is 50/40 stiff, soft or average?
Somebody like Betaracer or Atomicman can tell you more and better than I can, but my understanding is that:

Bigger numbers = softer

Here are the numbers I've had the chance to note down (not many):
GS11 48/39
GS11 50/40
GS11 53/42
That would put yours pretty much in the middle of this limited data set.

It's not really relevant, but the race-stock SL11s seem to be around 37/26 in the 165 (men's) length and 41/29 in the 155 (women's) length.
post #7 of 23
I can't comment on the Volkl' s characteristics.

i have never had any situation where the Atomic locked me into any turn where it wouldn't release or aloow me to adjust turn shape. If that is an occurance, it is pilot error. Learn to ski.

The two numbers refer to tip and tail stiffness. 50/40 is a medium stiffness ski. 47/36 is very stiff, 53/42 is pretty soft. The 186cm is available in two shapes, a 21.5m (A041106 w/ Race 20mm chassis and A041108 w/ WC 14mm chassis) with rounded beta lobes and 26.1m (A041114 only with WC 20mm chassis) with squared beta lobes.
post #8 of 23
The codes Betaracer quotes for various GS:11 models are - as expected - correct.
I ommitted the "1" in the middle.
I´ll take glasses next time when reading and copying such small digits.
post #9 of 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by Betaracer
i have never had any situation where the Atomic locked me into any turn where it wouldn't release or aloow me to adjust turn shape. If that is an occurance, it is pilot error. Learn to ski.
Sorry, I'll work on it. I'm sure you are a much more accomplished skier than I am. The Atomic was probably just too much ski for me.
It was just a general feeling I got. Maybe you have some pointers for me to improve my skiing???
post #10 of 23
Thread Starter 
Thanks to all... this is good information. The 21 meter, medium flex seems like the best pick for my needs.

Wrxpilot
post #11 of 23
I have both skis, and would agree that the Atomic seems to like a specific turn radius, whereas the Volkl is more versatile. I would also give better edgehold to the Volkl. However, in the course, I'll take my lighter, quicker Atomics.

UP Racer - I guess neither of us can ski...
post #12 of 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by E. Nick
I would also give better edgehold to the Volkl.
??? :
post #13 of 23
Thread Starter 

GS11M codes

One more permutation in a Denver shop:

AO41114186
Symmetrical tips
48/39
105-65-95= 21 m (note, Betaracer indicated 26m for the 41114)
Square beta lobes
Black WC plate

Wow, they make a lot of variations.

Wrxpilot
post #14 of 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by wrxpilot
One more permutation in a Denver shop:
AO41114186
Symmetrical tips
48/39
105-65-95= 21 m (note, Betaracer indicated 26m for the 41114)
Square beta lobes
Black WC plate
The code seems to be that already mentioned + the length
The dimensions might be due to the retail topsheet used
105-65-95 are the dimensions of the retail GS:11m/186 cm which should mean 19.5 m radius
(Even if the tip was about 102 in the contact point I doubt the 95 mm tail would produce a 21 m radius)
post #15 of 23
I believe if you read the radius tag it says 'r > 21'. This is the FIS requirement stating the ski has a radius equal or greater than 21 meters. It does not mean the radius is 21 meters.

At the time of the Lake Louise Men's World Cups, there are 62 different GS shapes available to the athletes racing at that level from Atomic.
post #16 of 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by Betaracer
At the time of the Lake Louise Men's World Cups, there are 62 different GS shapes available to the athletes racing at that level from Atomic.
I don´t know the thread but I had copied your older post containing this info:

"The true Race skis are in more configurations than you'd think. At Lake Louise I had the chance to spend time with the boot and ski guys, and Rudi Huber, the man who runs the whole global race department for Atomic. As of now, there are 62 moulds for GS skis alone. After testing on the WC, these shapes are analysed and then used to make race product for the masses of racers. The Women's skis you see still make use of Powerchannel construction, but the reason they have a very shallow cleavage is because they are overall thinner to help make them softer. I had a chance to visit the race rooms for both the Austrian and Canadian teams. The shortest race GS ski was 190cm, with most still 193cm w/ 29m turn radius. Various types of profiles were seen, with some true Beta and some more squared."

Sorry to post it without the source but at least you know how we appreciate and process your precious information.
post #17 of 23
Thread Starter 
Betaracer:

The ski is marked "21 m" (no > sign) after the dimensions. Of course, if this is just the retail topsheet, can't trust that these numbers are accurate.

Wrxpilot
post #18 of 23
Thread Starter 
My usual ride these days are 188cm Volkl P50m Race Stocks. I freeski them, GS turns at GS speeds with big inclination. I am 6'2" and 220 lbs, so no problem bending these skis. Yet they have great rebound energy-- turn transitions are automatic.

Given my "heft" though, I wonder if a beefier race stock will be a fun alternative, and hence I have been eyeing the GS11's. Are there other race stock alternatives (Fischer, Nordica, Rossi) I should consider?

Wrxpilot
post #19 of 23
Any racestock GS ski is worth considering.
Testing them is one of the best things I can imagine.
The regular 2-day racestock demo I attend is one of the season highligths for me.
post #20 of 23
Thread Starter 
Yes, Checkracer, a racestock demo would be fantastic.

Wrxpilot
post #21 of 23
Thread Starter 
Well, thanks to John at Foothills SKi and Bike, I was able to compare my 188 P50 GS Race stocks with a Atomic GS11 (retail model, not race stock) in 186. My observations:
- Atomic has slightly better edge grip in a pure carve than the Volkl, judging from the borderline hardpack/icy conditions at Keystone.
- Atomic feels more damp than the Volkl
- Volkl has more edge feel/sensitivity-- by this I mean that I can tell very easily what my edges are doing on the Volkls. On the Atomics, they grip well, but the feel for what is going on is inferior. This is probably the tradeoff for increased dampness. Somehow the Atomics feel hollow while the laminate Volkls feel solid. I was quicker changing edges in transition and going directly into a carve with the Volks, while with the Atomics I felt like I was hunting for the trench. I suspect with more time on the Atomics this might go away.
- The Atomic got me into a faster, bigger arc rythm, while the Volkl's arc was more adjustable.
Verdict: for free skiing GS turns at speed, the Volkls felt more versatile, if that concept applies to a race stock GS. And I really love the superior feel I get for what my edges are doing on the Volkls. Maybe this is a typical laminate ski characteristic?

Wrxpilot
post #22 of 23
Wrx,
Was the Atomic you tested the FIS non-legal 04/05 ski or the older one with 21+ radius?
post #23 of 23
Thread Starter 
The ski I demoed was the 03-04 retail GS11 (the red one). The radius was indicated as 21 m. I compared the flex of the retail ski to a 186 04-05 GS11M race stock (48/39 flex, 41114) and the retail ski was less stiff.

Wrxpilot
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