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List of recommended base/edge angles - Page 2

post #31 of 41

I have a question for Atomicman especially.

Would you recommend a 3 degree edge bevel on powder skis (waist 100+ to 132, say), and does Atomic put 3 degree bevels on its fatter skis, such as the Automatic, Bent Chetlier, Blog and Ritual? 

I own a pair of Rituals, my favorite ski so far, and it didn't seem to have a 3 degree bevel initially, when I got it new.  Would there be any downside to putting a 3 degree bevel on such a ski, whatever the brand?

 

I'd also like to add, that in the short time I've been following Epic (c. 2 yrs.), I've found Atomicman's posts, including about tuning, and base and edge bevels, to be dependable and game changing for me.  

 

In my limited experience, most any edge-carving skier can probably tell the difference between 1, 2 and 3 degree edge bevels on many if not most skis: "good, better, best" would about summarize it for me, IMHO.

 

To experiment, at first I used a few rock skis to try out all three bevels, one after another.

If I can tell the difference so dramatically, most carvers can. 

 

As an example, the 2 degree edge bevel Kastle puts on their skis, and that at first I've kept (on LX 92s), creates a noticeably better edge control than one degree edges. I would characterize it as "smooth," having used such a bevel on 3-4 different skis now.  All gained grip and "smoothness" over a 1 degree bevel. An old Volkl with a 2 degree bevel gained something of the "smoothness" of a Kastle. 

 

Another example: Atomic Crimson Ti's, when I got them, had a rough factory or even demo shop tune on them, maybe approximately 3 degrees edge bevel (?). Once I'd put a true 3 degree bevel on that ski (albeit, a ski probably designed with that bevel in mind), no detuning tip or tail, the fun and dependability of that edge hold was noticeably better, in the case of an already great ski. And at least for me, there was no loss of "forgiveness" to the ski, at any speed. 

 

While I haven't yet tried the three degree bevel on a fat or powder ski (not enough nerve yet, maybe),  the three degree edge bevel to me has noticeable improvement in edge hold and grip, just a joy to ski on, with skis 98mm waist and smaller, on groomers and in bumps especially. But also in any chopped up conditions where carving on edge comes into play, on either hard or packed snow. 

post #32 of 41

Still learning about tuning, but had my skis ground flat before this season.  I put a .5* base bevel to see what that was like, and a 3* side bevel.  They were a little tricky the first time out, but once I got back into form, this setup was working well for me.  I skied Belleayre on Christmas Day, two days after the Great Thaw ended.  It was low teens and everything was frozen.  I didm't have any trouble holding an edge on the frozen corduroy or glare ice.  I was also using my old, incanted, larger boots, yet I wasn't experiencing much edge chatter turning to the right like I used to.  t think I'll stick with the 3* side edge.  Jury is still out on the .5 base, but I figure I might over tune it anyway, so err on the side of a smaller (intended) angle.  

post #33 of 41

I've changed almost everything I own to a 0/3, .5/4, or a 1/4...

post #34 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by ski otter View Post
 

I have a question for Atomicman especially.

Would you recommend a 3 degree edge bevel on powder skis (waist 100+ to 132, say), and does Atomic put 3 degree bevels on its fatter skis, such as the Automatic, Bent Chetlier, Blog and Ritual? 

I own a pair of Rituals, my favorite ski so far, and it didn't seem to have a 3 degree bevel initially, when I got it new.  Would there be any downside to putting a 3 degree bevel on such a ski, whatever the brand?

 

I'd also like to add, that in the short time I've been following Epic (c. 2 yrs.), I've found Atomicman's posts, including about tuning, and base and edge bevels, to be dependable and game changing for me.  

 

In my limited experience, most any edge-carving skier can probably tell the difference between 1, 2 and 3 degree edge bevels on many if not most skis: "good, better, best" would about summarize it for me, IMHO.

 

To experiment, at first I used a few rock skis to try out all three bevels, one after another.

If I can tell the difference so dramatically, most carvers can. 

 

As an example, the 2 degree edge bevel Kastle puts on their skis, and that at first I've kept (on LX 92s), creates a noticeably better edge control than one degree edges. I would characterize it as "smooth," having used such a bevel on 3-4 different skis now.  All gained grip and "smoothness" over a 1 degree bevel. An old Volkl with a 2 degree bevel gained something of the "smoothness" of a Kastle. 

 

Another example: Atomic Crimson Ti's, when I got them, had a rough factory or even demo shop tune on them, maybe approximately 3 degrees edge bevel (?). Once I'd put a true 3 degree bevel on that ski (albeit, a ski probably designed with that bevel in mind), no detuning tip or tail, the fun and dependability of that edge hold was noticeably better, in the case of an already great ski. And at least for me, there was no loss of "forgiveness" to the ski, at any speed. 

 

While I haven't yet tried the three degree bevel on a fat or powder ski (not enough nerve yet, maybe),  the three degree edge bevel to me has noticeable improvement in edge hold and grip, just a joy to ski on, with skis 98mm waist and smaller, on groomers and in bumps especially. But also in any chopped up conditions where carving on edge comes into play, on either hard or packed snow. 

Thanks for the props!

 

As far as I know Atomic does put a 3 degree on all it's skis and yes, absolutley put a 3  side edge on your POW skis. I have a 3 degree on my MOJO 94's and had a 3 on my old Sugar Daddys. Coincidentally I may buy a pair of Rituals in a 182. I've heard it is an excellent ski!

 

Blizzard Bonafide comes with a 3 from the factory also! Atomic has used a 3 degree on all skis for a very long time!


Edited by Atomicman - 12/27/13 at 8:03pm
post #35 of 41

atomicman, why not go to 4? or 5 and beyond?

 

(I actually have tuned my SL and cheater GS skis to 4)

post #36 of 41

See page 196 of "The Athletic Skier" for Witherell's and Evrard's comments on beveling ski bases.  They advocate zero. What, you don't have this book?  Get it!  Amazon has it.  I use 0/2 on my skis: they ski fine. 

post #37 of 41
I think the standard rejoinder here is going to be "but that was in the era of straight skis".

How many people here actually use a 0 degree base edge angle, and on what skis. And for those who do, do you detune tip/tail.
post #38 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by Metaphor_ View Post
 

atomicman, why not go to 4? or 5 and beyond?

 

(I actually have tuned my SL and cheater GS skis to 4)

I have a 4 on my slaloms and a pair of Gs skis!

 

 

No real reason not too.

post #39 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by jc-ski View Post

I think the standard rejoinder here is going to be "but that was in the era of straight skis".

How many people here actually use a 0 degree base edge angle, and on what skis. And for those who do, do you detune tip/tail.

shape skis ar a diffrerent animal.  0 is too extreme for most skis on shape boards.

post #40 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by jc-ski View Post

I think the standard rejoinder here is going to be "but that was in the era of straight skis".

How many people here actually use a 0 degree base edge angle, and on what skis. And for those who do, do you detune tip/tail.


I generally ski mine with only polishing the base edge minimally with fine stones after a base grind to just get the machine pattern out. Is that 0? It aint much and less then if I use the .5 bevel guide or wrap a file with tape.

So whatever that is combined with 4 deg side bevel.

No detuning of tip or tail.

Current sample of skis tuned as such in the order of frequency usually skied...

3 pairs of SL
Stockli OTWO 177cm
Kastle MX78 178cm
Hell & Back 170cm (Not that it would matter in the snow these would be out for)

and older stuff that comes out now and then...
post #41 of 41

Interesting. Thanks for sharing that.

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