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Do they make THIN custom footbeds? (long read - sorry)

post #1 of 19
Thread Starter 
Hi everybody,

Great forum first of all, I have learned a lot here over the last week or so of reading and I am no novice to the slopes (18+ years skiing)...I just never took the time to keep up with my education.

I am currently working through a boot-fit issue and wanted to pick some brains about custom liners - I apologize for the long post.

I am choosing between a 27.5 and a 26.5 Tecnica Diablo (street size was measured at just over 27.5 for what it is worth). The 27's are comfortable right out of the box...no pain at all, no scrunching...while the 26's are T-ight. However, after properly seating my heel and buckling, the pain in the 26's is reduced, enough so that flexing is just pulling my toes off of the boots, still a slight rub but nothing extreme that I hope would decrease further after the liner packs-out. At normal flex in the 27s I do not touch the liner or the boot tip - again, these are comfy like a wool slipper.

My question is this: Is it possible to get a custom footbed that it actually thinner than stock? From what I understand a stock footbed actually serves to lengthen the foot due to improper arch support (whatever each person needs) and actually flattens the foot out causing more toe rub.

I suspect that with proper support, a thinner footbed, and pack-out, I would be best served to keep the 26s.

Does anyone have experience with a thinner footbed?
post #2 of 19
You can get or make very thin custom footbeds. A stock footbed does not magically lengthen your foot. Your foot does that on it's own when weight bearing DEPENDING ON THE FOOT. The stock bed simply does nothing to control that. A good custom footbed should control that lengthening but will likely increase the volume of the foot somewhat to a lot. This has nothing to do with it's thickness just the change in position occuring in your weighted foot.

It sounds like the 26 is clearly your size BUT it should be tried on with a footbed. The liner may need stretching to fit the footbed. Do not cut down the bed to fit the liner if that means it is now cut down smaller than your foot.
post #3 of 19
I've never seen a custom footbed that was thinner than the "paper like" stock insoles although some are pretty thin.

I agree that you're better off with the smaller size boot, even if you require a little boot work to reduce any hot spots. The larger size will surely pack out and become too loose down the road. And...you're right than an unsupported foot will typically expand (if that a good term here) as compared to a supported foot. Keep the 26.5, get custom footbeds and then see where your fit stands. You can always have the shells stretched a bit if needed. It sounds like your pretty close to a good fit.

Why the worry of a "thin" footbed?
post #4 of 19
Thread Starter 
Thanks for the replies. I really appreciate the feedback.

I am just afraid that if I go with a custom footbed, the extra volume will really make the boot too tight (e.g. a 27 footbed to take-up gap felt in a 27.5). But like I said, the 27.5s are way to comfortable out of the box (IMO) to give me a good fit a year from now.

One concern I have is this whole idea of shell fit and where to shell fit from. The store where I originally tried on the boots had me in the 27.5s. If I look at the back of my heel, toes scraping the end, flex with shin just up to the liner, in the 27.5s I have at least 1"+ from the heel and at least 1" at my achilles, in the 26.5s it is about a half inch in both spots. (some techs have told me you want 1", another 1.5")

It seems the consensus is that smaller is better...boots can be stretched - but larger is basically just that. Larger - no way to shrink them yet!

I will play with them again tonight and send off a pair tomorrow. I am still leaning towards the smaller size (though as I write this I am strangely aware that my feet still hurt a bit in the toes and arch...are they chiming in now too?)

Thanks again, let's hope for some good snow in the East!
post #5 of 19
One of the local shops here has been using Sole heat-moldable insoles for a couple of years. Last year they were posting virtually all of them. This year they are doing a fair number unposted or partially posted (just the heel area). If you don't post them, they are quite thin, yet way more supportive than a stock insole. I have a super high instep which causes me a bunch of boot hassle - so I switched to an unposted set this year, mainly to try so get a tiny bit more volume in the instep area. So far, great results. I had them molded in the shop. Supposedly, if you are not posting them, they can be done readily at home as well.

post #6 of 19
You should def. go with the 26.5. The Tecnicas run big. Check out http://www.bootfitters.com/all_mountain.htm#tecnica I bought Diablo Fire's recently. My size was 28.0, and I got a 27 size. The 26.5's will pack in, and they'll fit just fine. Good luck.
post #7 of 19
Have the 26s shell checked - that's the easiest and fastest way to see if you're in the proper size. Liners pack out, shells don't (without assistance from a heat gun and punch at least!) Chances are that a custom footbed will shorten your foot a bit anyway so the length won't be as close.
post #8 of 19
Thread Starter 
Spindrift, thanks for the link! There is a shop in my area that uses these so I am planning a trip there to check them out - seem to be in line with what I am looking for.

Verdugan, great link, thanks. Since you were fit a size bigger too, when you initially wore yours, how tight were your toes? Mine are pretty much scrunched (just stopped hurting about an hour or so ago)...were you in the same boat to start?

Gotamagal, I am visiting a shop tonight to see about the shell and footbeds, I agree, it is time to see another bootfitter. Since I have both pairs with me, it makes perfect sense to drop by.
post #9 of 19
Yes, they were tight, but not painful. I bought them right on the slopes, so I went skiing w. them right away, so don't remember much of the pain. But from what I read here, the boots are supossed to be a bit uncomfortable the first couple of days. Do they have a 27? Good luck.
post #10 of 19
I just went through the exact same thing. I normally ski in a 26.5 but when I tried on the Tecnica Diablo Fires in a 26.5 they felt way too comfortable and I just knew they would pack out and be sloppy. I down sized to the 25.5 and when I first started wearing them they felt way to tight (I was concerned). I skied them for a few days and my foot really settled in. I have made just a few minor streaches to the boot and they fit great! I am soooo glad I did not go with the 26.5’s
I would stick with that size.
post #11 of 19
ALWAYS go with the smaller size you can possibly fit in. ALWAYS
post #12 of 19
ski in em for 5 or 6 days, THEN get a footbed. there'll be room.
post #13 of 19
i'm no expert on this, but I just bought new boots and after doing reading here (thank you, thank you everyone) go with a smaller boot for sure !!.

my toes touched the end (just) of my Pininafarina's when standing, pulled away slightly when flexed forward. I used the Sole Ulta liners ( I have way small volume feet)

after one day of hard skiing the toes on the end were not even an issue, toes what toes.

Sole makes a thin footbed for dress shoes perhaps those will work for you. I found them thinner than the stock ones from Lange. I tried both the Ultra, then the stock, then the thin sole, then the stock, then the ultra, then the thin... you get the idea. the thin definately imcreased the verticle volume but opened up the heel area too much for me.

don't be scared of toes touching while standing.

post #14 of 19
Thread Starter 
Thanks again for all of the feedback everyone.

I went to another shop armed with some new knowledge and did not mention anything to the tech, I just told him what I wanted and my ability and waited to see what he pulled down for me.

Lo and behold...no Tecnicas. A Nordica which I did not feel had the volume mid-foot and an Atomic T:9 which felt good - definite toe rub when standing, slight pull-off at flex, but nowhere near the jammed pain of the 26.5. I had previously not tried this boot.

So now there is a new boot in the mix. I am still leaning towards the 26.5 Tecnica if I keep it (the 27.5 is on it sway back). Worst case, it will pack-out, and I agree that smaller will definitely be better in the long run especially given the ability to "enlarge" if needed.

Anyone try on the t:9 as well and opt for the Tecnica?
post #15 of 19
Another tip. If you buy smaller and the boots are too tight to begin with, go with the thinnest thing you can find for sock. (I personnally don't like barefeet; foot doesn't slide into boot well and it feels oogie). My boots were kinda tight when I got them and I got a pair of kneehigh stockings to wear with them that were way thinner then even the thinnest liner type ski sock. Noone you care about, you only care about real skiers, will think you're queer if you this. In the store, you're picking them up for your wife. Buy white and from 5' away, everyone who sees you put your boots on will think it's a thin ski sock. I wore my boots around the house for an hour three or four times like this and I skied 1/2 day then switch to my thinnest sock. Boots fit fine now.
post #16 of 19
having just got the jist of this thread without reading everything, here is my two cents.

buy the smaller boot size. it will be better in the long run (once it is worn in)

there is no difference between a 27. and 27.5 once you take out the stock insole. so don't worry about that.

a custom insole takes up volume in a boot in a very different way than you may think - solution: get the small boot, then put in a custom insole. you will feel not decreased volume, but actually a little extra length in the boot and a much better and improved heel hold.
post #17 of 19
Yes, you can have thin custom insoles made, but it may be a little more effort. I have mad orthotics that start w/ a 1.5 mm carbon fiber shell & are then molded, posted & covered. I have made several pairs for track athletes (& my bear when she skied in the Rossi plug boot). This route requires you see an MD & get a script.

As for the tecnicas, they always pack out. have them shell fit & start there. My foot measures 25.5-26 & I ski in a tecnica 24.

I am really suprised about the diablos. I have a pair I have not had time to build up yet. They are a 24 & feel the same as the 24 icon comps. the shell is even smaller by 3 mm. I wonder why there is such a size diffrence in other sizes? It will be interesting to see what happens when I ski em.
post #18 of 19
forgot the most important thing!!!
Save your stock insoles & compare them to the new ones..I have found that most boot fitters end up making a custom foot bed that is larger in length / width than the original. To ensure the actually fit in the boot flat & that your foot is not all contorted, make sure they get shaved down to size & fit in the boot. For some reason this always is the case & avoid the cork ones, as they are the worst w/ this
post #19 of 19
Originally Posted by iriponsnow
forgot the most important thing!!!
Save your stock insoles & compare them to the new ones..I have found that most boot fitters end up making a custom foot bed that is larger in length / width than the original. To ensure the actually fit in the boot flat & that your foot is not all contorted, make sure they get shaved down to size & fit in the boot. For some reason this always is the case & avoid the cork ones, as they are the worst w/ this
any boot fitter that does not cut down a custom insole is not completing the job. this is a good tip - always keep your original stock insoles. but ask the bootfitter to cut down the custom to fit - though they should do this anyway without having to be asked.
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