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Which Powder day skis?

post #1 of 41
1/2/05 at 8:29pm
Thread Starter 
Hey all. First time on here. I live in Park City and am trying to decide on a powder day ski. I ski a K2 axis XP for everyday skiing (78 mid) which works, but not well in on the deep days. Id like to find a ski to take out on powder days, one that will work well in the bowls, in the gladed trees and the steeps. Yesterday skiing off Jupiter (knee deep, woohooo) I saw B3's, Gotamas, Atomic somthings? and a bunch of last years Dynastar whatevers that are that are near 100 under the foot i think. Soooo, all that said, the B3 seems like a nice ski at 94 in the middle, but not sure the the Gotama will handle well in the trees being 105 wide. Maybe something in between will fit the bill best? We all know that unless you got to the top in a heli that powder days ultimatly get tracked out, always tooooo quickly, so I want them to work well even after its cut up but still deep. I am 45 yrs old, 6' 170. Any first hand help would be appreciated... thanks.
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post #2 of 41
1/2/05 at 8:45pm
pcdano, welcome to EpicSki! You'll undoubtedly get a lot of responses for your question. You may also want to dig through the forum a bit and check out the Search function. I don't have the kind of experience you're looking for in deep Utah powder. My new powder boards at the Atomic Metron:b5 because I wanted them to be more "all conditions" than pure powder.

I have heard great things about the Gotamas, the Pocket Rockets, the Atomic Sugar Daddys, and even the Volkl Explosivs. Again, check out the threads here and wait for answers from the folks who can really relate (I don't get freshies frequently enough!).
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post #3 of 41
1/2/05 at 9:47pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by pcdano
Id like to find a ski to take out on powder days, one that will work well in the bowls, in the gladed trees and the steeps. .
pcdano: How about the Rossi B3. I haven't skied it, but my friends do, and they're ecstatic! I bought the B2 (female) for my wife - she loves them.

The B3 has received more unabashedly positive reviews than any other fattie. Everyone seems to love 'em. They're relatively soft (nice flex) with decent good edge hold. Apparently, they surf the light fantastic with aplomb. Check the reviews!

If you want something that'll handle knarlier conditions, I can recommend the Atomic Metron EX's I just bought (84 mm underfoot). But, they're stiffer and designed for a wider range of surfaces, including the slop we get around here.

For Utah, though, I'd probably pick the B3.
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post #4 of 41
1/2/05 at 11:41pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain_Strato
pcdano: How about the Rossi B3. I haven't skied it, but my friends do, and they're ecstatic! I bought the B2 (female) for my wife - she loves them.

The B3 has received more unabashedly positive reviews than any other fattie. Everyone seems to love 'em. They're relatively soft (nice flex) with decent good edge hold. Apparently, they surf the light fantastic with aplomb. Check the reviews!

If you want something that'll handle knarlier conditions, I can recommend the Atomic Metron EX's I just bought (84 mm underfoot). But, they're stiffer and designed for a wider range of surfaces, including the slop we get around here.

For Utah, though, I'd probably pick the B3.
Meh. The B3 will last maybe 75 days and then start to die a slow death. They're foam-core, so they lose their flex quickly. The only reason that Kent Kreitler et al. can ski them so well is that Rossignol will set them up with 5-6 pairs a season. Their edge hold isn't excellent, as they're too flexible torsionally. That helps the entry to the turn (which is why people like them so well), but makes them less grippy in a turn.

Go with something with a wood core. Dynastar's Legend series, Volkl's Gotama, Karma, or Explosiv, or even a Volant if you can push their weight around. Of these, I've heard the best things about the Legend 8800 and 8000.
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post #5 of 41
1/3/05 at 6:07am
Quote:
Originally Posted by jlb
Go with something with a wood core. Dynastar's Legend series, Volkl's Gotama, Karma, or Explosiv, or even a Volant if you can push their weight around. Of these, I've heard the best things about the Legend 8800 and 8000.
The models mentioned by jlb are definitely heavier duty skis than the B3's. In general, French brands are lighter than Germanic brands. In my experience, this also applies to the Legend 8000, which I found got knocked around in the crud (too light-weight for conditions up here - which is why I bought the Atomics). However, in the Utah fluff, they're probably fine.

While edge-hold on the B3's won't compare with the Volkls, Atomics or even Volant, they're still not bad. Friends of mine who ski the B3's (good skiers who've been on lots of skis), consider the B3's grip suprisingly good for a soft ski.
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post #6 of 41
1/3/05 at 8:38am
Since you Have a K2 xp I take it your looking for a pure Powder ski? Something that will work getting to and from The bowls and really shine in the real deep stuff. The Sugar daddy is a pretty good bet a bit stiff but vary wide. It is a ski that takes big muscles not the best for tight trees. If I were skiing Snowbird on Powder days It would be great. Volants Chubbs and fat boys, as others have said are heavy. Wonderful for busting crud and they are oh so smooth The best thing is if you look around you can find great deals on them. My current powder ski is the K@ Apache Cheif in a 174. I can't think of a better ski for the near perfect conditions we had New Years day. at 98 underfoot they have great float at 174 they are really good in tight trees. They not a point them and rip type ski.They are more of a Dancer. I might have gone longer with them a 181 would have been better for getting more float. The 174 is better for getting in and out of tight places. If I were younger I might want something like the Gotamas.
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post #7 of 41
1/3/05 at 7:55pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Utah49
Since you Have a K2 xp I take it your looking for a pure Powder ski? Something that will work getting to and from The bowls and really shine in the real deep stuff.
Utah49, hey neighbor, yes, looking for a ski just for the powder days that I can ski on all day, not just the first clean runs.

Thanks for all the input everyone, I have a pretty good idea now of a few to demo. Even if the B3's only last for 75 powder days as jlb says.....I can only pray Ill get that many pow days on any ski in only a few seasons.

Decisions Decisions...I'm going to try and demo the explosiv's, B3's, maybe the Chief and Sugar Daddy's.....problem is I could pay for the skiis just demoing all that I woud like to try. I'll let ya'll know what I think after giving them a try.

Dan
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post #8 of 41
1/4/05 at 12:31am
No first hand experience yet but lots of folks rave about the Dynastar Legend Pro (124-97-116) in a 186 length. One of the best and most versatile backcountry skis right now.

People over at TGR also love the PMGear Bro Models (125-99-112) as competitor to the Legend pros but way cheaper. Maybe try a search over there.
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post #9 of 41
1/4/05 at 9:57am
Dan, Welcome to Epicski and to Park City. There are a few of us bears here on the wrong side of the Wasatch
Your right about the demos getting out of hand. Most of the shops here in PC don't have a hugh fleet of pure powder skis to demo. Your best bet would be to head over to Alta and check the shops over there for demos. Most shops will allow you to change out skis when you demo. First think about what you want and or really need in a Pow ski. At 45 I don't think you are going to really need a twin tip. But who knows maybe your into backcounty jibing? On the other hand twins are nice for releasing edge I'm not a big fan of rossie skis just to soft for my taste. One more word of advice get the Look / Rossie pivot heal bindings. They are by far the best for deep pow. They are easy to click back into, if you loss a ski in the deep stuff. Trust me on this. getting back into a ski in thigh deep powder while balancing on the face of Scotts Bowl isn't a lot of fun. No matter what ski you get put the look P10 or 12 on your ski. The rossie is pretty much The same binding.
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post #10 of 41
1/4/05 at 1:47pm
Wow! Wasn't New Years Day GREAT. THe New Years Eve dump was just what we needed. I skiied The Canyons with my AX 4s. The perfect ski for the near perfect day. Knee deep in pure fluff! If you don't want 90+mm underfoot, I would definitely try to get a hold of a pair of AX 4. Typical Volkl wood core. Stiff. Powerful. Much more stabile than Xps, Apache Recons, or anything from France. I have heard good things about Stockli and Elan 777, but have no first hand knowledge.
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post #11 of 41
1/4/05 at 2:26pm
Quote:
I have heard good things about Stockli and Elan 777, but have no first hand knowledge.
I've put a couple of days on my 777's, including 2 days of cat skiing. Awesome ski, they border on Explosiv/G4 type of stiffness but still floated really nice in the pow. Blast through cut-up powder and crud like you're still in the fresh stuff and, even mounted with Freerides, hold a decent edge on hardpack.
Not a "real" fatty at 87mm in the waist, but skied just as well in the fresh stuff as either of my fatter skis.
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post #12 of 41
1/4/05 at 9:02pm

Elan

If you like the 777 and want more width, the Elan 999 is on the way.
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post #13 of 41
1/5/05 at 11:15am
What's a powder day.....?


signed

muddy and wet in NJ
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post #14 of 41
1/6/05 at 7:59am
Finndog. If you're lucky, you can buy a seat on Delta to SLC for $250. A small price to pay for champagne fluff!
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post #15 of 41
1/6/05 at 4:27pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by PowHog

People over at TGR also love the PMGear Bro Models (125-99-112) as competitor to the Legend pros but way cheaper. Maybe try a search over there.
Just FYI -- the Bro Model dimensions are 125-99-114.
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post #16 of 41
1/7/05 at 12:41am
183 GOTOMA! !
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post #17 of 41
1/7/05 at 5:20am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyrone Shoelaces
Just FYI -- the Bro Model dimensions are 125-99-114.
Oh Snap!
How could I forget?
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post #18 of 41
1/7/05 at 8:41am
Just demo'd the Rossi Scratch BC in a 182. Conditions were ideal to test, what I'd been told was, a "bombin' powder ski." In the deep, this ski thrived. Very responsive, excellent float, and incredibly easy to turn. Steep trees, this ski was one of the best I've tested. Twin tip accomodates quick turns and lighter weight allows for easy transition on steep pitches. Also, suprisingly, on the groomers this ski was incredibly quick edge to edge and even felt somewhat stable on ice. Moreover, I'd never imagined that I'd be able to tear through a mogul field with 90mm underfoot. But, the Scratch BC proved me wrong. Man this thing was quick for a wide ski.

So, while this ski may have a park specific design, it's still one of the best powder skiis I've ever skiied (compared to Rossi B3's, Atomic Sugar Daddy's, Dynastar 8800's, etc...).
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post #19 of 41
1/7/05 at 10:59am
I am interested in the Rossignol B3. I was just in my local ski shop to get a tuneup on the Volkel 6* and saw these fat monstors. The shop owner was willing to deal at $599 for a pair of 182 cm B3s. I ski off-piste in trees and steep lines and deep fresh whenever the opportunity is available. The 6*s have worked great in powder, but obviously ski a lot deepter than something with a 94 mm waist. I was last out at Heavenly just after an 8 foot dump and really enjoyed the conditions. More is on the way. I can ski powder on a narrower ski, but everyone seems to think wider is better. I can see the advantage in places like Alta's Glory Hole where you need to run a flat to get back to the steeps, but at the same time don't want to give up the speed control of a "sinker" where its really deep and tight.

Anyone have experience with the B3 that could put me over the edge on this?
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post #20 of 41
1/7/05 at 12:00pm

IMHO the fatter the better

The more I ski powder, and the wider my boards get, the wider I want them.

From my last pair of straight boards, I have owned or tried ever thing from snow Rangers, to B2 and B3s, to K2 Big Kahuna's to my present (but not yet skied) Salomon Swallowtails, plus at least five others that I can recall. JH has a top of the lift demo program for cheap, and I have tried a lot of skiis.

The only real truth I can find to skiing powder and junked up powder is that the wider the ski the better. My everday ski is Salomon Extra Hots, and it is just about as wide as Snow Rangers were. It is no powder ski.

Go wide and relatively short. The two are somewhat related. Somday ski makers will give the total surface area of their skis for easier comparison. Wider/shorter, longer/narrower, you get the picture. IMHO float is what you want.

52 years old, 27 seasons at JH, average 30 days a year and heavier than you by 50 lbs, (at least) but I think the truth remains, wider is better.

Saw a 130 underfoot (Line, was the company I think) that iinterested me.

Also have a strong interest in Spatulas (about 350 on EBAY brand new)
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post #21 of 41
1/7/05 at 12:48pm
just get the spatulas if you want a powder ski..

the best powder/chop/trees/soft anything ski ever.

Just try to find anyone who rode the spats for more than a day that does not think that.
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post #22 of 41
1/7/05 at 1:49pm
[quote=Trouthead]The more I ski powder, and the wider my boards get, the wider I want them.


Go wide and relatively short.



Trouthead, you sound like the kind of guy who will eventually be on a mono ski. I saw someone fly by me at Squaw a few weeks back on one and I had to do a double-take. Turns out he is a 50 yr old guy from CO who's son is an extreme ski instructor at Squaw

the big downside is that the bindings DON'T release, although I guess on steep terrain you wouldn't want them to anyway

check this site out....


http://www.monoski.net/people.html


some manufacturers are making split mono skis so you can ski them together or apart
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post #23 of 41
1/7/05 at 2:11pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by pm128
just get the spatulas if you want a powder ski..

the best powder/chop/trees/soft anything ski ever.

Just try to find anyone who rode the spats for more than a day that does not think that.
Or If you want a ski that you can actually not have to ski in alaska then go with the volant chubbs...

thats what I have they are sick and smooth and bust up everything and anything...

The spats are sick but their like 125 in the middle....big big big big ski
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post #24 of 41
1/8/05 at 3:14pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trouthead
The more I ski powder, and the wider my boards get, the wider I want them.

Go wide and relatively short. The two are somewhat related. Somday ski makers will give the total surface area of their skis for easier comparison.
Let's cut to the chase. THE powder ski of the future is square shaped.

One ski lodge cafeteria tray per boot and you are set.

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post #25 of 41
1/8/05 at 11:26pm
Skied a couple days on my 183 Gotamas at Snowbird last week, 1 day knee deep, 1 day 12+ in. Tons of fun, stable in the pow and solid through the crud and chop, but still nimble turning when you want it to be. I don't think you'd have any problems in the trees, I found it came around really easy in steep chutes and around soft bumps. Also noticed Footloose review said it's the only ski with this width that has a relatively light and manuverable feel. Was on the groomers very little, but it seemed to arc pretty nice if there was some soft snow to grab onto, and was a lot of fun playing around on the soft snow on sides of the trails.

I agree with the others about going wide, otherwise with the light snow you get there, you'll be skiing down on yesterdays crust and bumps, even with the Gotama I was down in it to a certain extent. I had last years Gotama too and this years has a more solid and stable feel, like it a lot better. Great ski, definitely give it a demo.
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post #26 of 41
1/9/05 at 9:04am
Quote:
Originally Posted by unionbowler
183 GOTOMA! !
Y'go through all the effort of font size and bold, then spell Gotama wrong. Go figure.

To the question, I demoed the B3 in Tahoe last week, it def. gets the job done well. But it's a very costly ski.

There are some super deals floating around out there on Ebay and other places on Volant Fat Bastards. Great powder ski, and can be had for dirt cheap. I got mine new for $125.

If cost is not a factor, then go B3, Gotama, Sugar Daddy, Seth Pistol, or Elan 777.
Dynastar Legends are sweet too.
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post #27 of 41
1/9/05 at 9:34am
I skied the Gotama and Seth Pistol this past Friday in powder. Both are great but I preferred the Pistol. It was more playful and sweeter/softer than the Gotama. The Gotama holds a better edge and is more stable at speed on the groomed but for pure powder fun I preferred the Pistol. Also, the Gotama reminded me of my Explosiv with just a bit less stiffness and tad more sidecut.

To have the Gotama and Explosive seems less quiver diversification than the Explosiv and Seth Pistol. And extroplating what I like in the Pistol, I'm going to get the K2 Made N AK in a 189cm for my deep powder ski to supplement my Volkl Explosiv 180cm.
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post #28 of 41
1/9/05 at 9:35am
Can wide brakes be fitted to older Look P12 with narrow brakes. Sold separately?
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post #29 of 41
1/22/05 at 11:38pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by liveandlearn
Just demo'd the Rossi Scratch BC in a 182. Conditions were ideal to test, what I'd been told was, a "bombin' powder ski." In the deep, this ski thrived. Very responsive, excellent float, and incredibly easy to turn. Steep trees, this ski was one of the best I've tested. Twin tip accomodates quick turns and lighter weight allows for easy transition on steep pitches. Also, suprisingly, on the groomers this ski was incredibly quick edge to edge and even felt somewhat stable on ice. Moreover, I'd never imagined that I'd be able to tear through a mogul field with 90mm underfoot. But, the Scratch BC proved me wrong. Man this thing was quick for a wide ski.

So, while this ski may have a park specific design, it's still one of the best powder skiis I've ever skiied (compared to Rossi B3's, Atomic Sugar Daddy's, Dynastar 8800's, etc...).
Hi L&L Can I ask what weight and height you are? Im torn between Seth pistols and Scratch BC for powder and a little park. I like turns and am less into ripping the bowl ..Im 90kg and 178cm..Im advanced/expert and spend every second I can off the groomed in glades and soft stuff

tar in adv
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post #30 of 41
1/23/05 at 2:28pm
I'm 6ft, 190lbs, and am a level 8/9. Really, you can't go wrong with either ski. I chose the Rossi BC b/c I preferred a little more flex in what I was going to use as my primary powder ski. As for the Seth Pistol, it may be a better everyday ski due to the fact that it really blows through anything the mountain can throw at it and holds a slightly better edge on hardpack. I'm in no way qualified to assess their park ability but, from what I've heard, each holds its own.

That being said, for powder, trees, steeps, and ripping deep snow turns...I'd go with the BC.
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