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Something to heal for ... - Page 2

post #31 of 40
Originally Posted by RotoFury
Just went to see the chair of harvard medical's upper extremity ortho school. He said I need surgery (next week). The bone is displaced (one half resting on top of the other half), angulated (one half is perpendicular to the other half) and comminuted (broken into a bunch of small fragments).

So I will have surgery next week, get a steel plate. Season is over.
Dude...that sucks With all the money you're going to save from not skiing, I recommend taking a nice trip to the Carribbean once you feel better. Dirty Banana drinks and sunshine definitely feels good in March

Heal well and enjoy the holidays.
post #32 of 40
google it. The testimonial by C. Everett Coop, Surgeon General under Ronald Reagan will blow your mind. I've had it done to my knees (out of braces for last two years after 12 years in them) my back (felt like a new person for six months). I just sent Kent Kreitler to my doc for a little prolo follow-up on his knee injury.
post #33 of 40
Sorry to hear about the diagnosis.

I know how you feel as I crashed up at Cannon and had to get taken in an ambulance to the middleton hospital. They stapled up my torn side and checked out my knee and said they couldn't make a diagnosis.

I could bear weight right away but I knew something was wrong. I couldn't ski the rest of the season. My ACL was 100% ripped and I had meniscus damage that needed surgery.

Just rehab like crazy.

You would be surprised how driven you can be when you want to ski the next season.
post #34 of 40
Roto -
sorry to hear the news --
No way 'round it, sounds like a tough slog, man.

But sounds like you're in good hands now -

There was a great piece on Hermann's rehab in the New Yorker last year, if I can find it I'll pm it to you.
You'll come back stronger than before.
post #35 of 40
Worse come to worst, there is always Mammoth. It will open until late May. I was there May 23rd and the snow was still very good. Warm but good. We even got a few inches of snow up there on the top part and it was powdery.
post #36 of 40

Ooph, glad the old hot poker treatment has been improved. Looks great in its current form...
post #37 of 40

Harvard vs Rural Vermont

Hiya Roto,

Sorry for your injury - that sux. And I hear it can hurt like a sunnofa.... Hope you mend quickly.

I know you're PO'd at the Vermont Birke-doc, but just a couple of things...

The guy may indeed be an A$$hole, but it may also just be a function of facilities available, expertise, and extent of injuries.

Where did ya go? ----Doc-in-the-box? 20-bed rural hospital ER? Orthopedic center? Family Practice/Internist office?

Different places have different imaging capabilities - yer average rural clinic may have an X-ray set up, but it may not produce the quality films w/ high resolution that you'd get at Mass General. Just like an old Kodak 110mm snapshot records the event, but ya don't get the detail of a 7 megapix digicam, the original films may have been incapable of recording the extent of the damage. And if all they had for you was an X-ray - the muscle damage would not have shown up either. You need an MRI for that.

Also, alot of times there is so much local inflammation that you can't get a good shot until a few days later after the swelling subsides a little. When I tore my ACL 3 years ago, the orthopod would not order an MRI for a week - cause it would have been useless for showing detail.

It also depends on who read your original X-rays. The ER doc? The doc-in-a-box? The radiologist? The skill level varies for obvious reasons.

Anyhow - all of this is not to minimize your pain or frustration in any way -- it's gotta suck big-time, and I feel for ya -- it's just that Dr. Birkenstock may not have been an incompetent, so much as limited by his facilities and experience. Rural Vermont just hain't Hahhhvahhd.

Cheers! and Heal Quick!
post #38 of 40


Sorry to hear about the complications. You might also check out if Global Platelet Separation Therapy is applicable to your surgery. My doc used it for my rotator cuff repair and it helped significantly with pain reduction and speedy healing.


Good luck in the procedure. Bummer being out for the season. Welcome to the "injured reserve" list.:

post #39 of 40
Originally Posted by RotoFury
The bone is displaced (one half resting on top of the other half), angulated (one half is perpendicular to the other half) and comminuted (broken into a bunch of small fragments).

NONE of which those f-cks in Vermont noticed. So I will have surgery next week, get a steel plate.
I'm no collar bone expert but my wife and I have both broken ours and one of the US Ski Team docs taught in our patrol training. We discussed collar bones--- The x-ray tech on our patrol asked him why the heck they let those things heal crooked and overlapping.

The Vermont doc may have not been that far out in granola land. The ski team doc said that due to the fact that the muscle and blood supply is usually stripped back from the ends they usually heal best overlapped. Sometimes a plate can be one of the worst things to do.

I broke mine one July and they let it heal with the ends overlapping. By January it was stong enough to remove an entire mogul on A-Basin's Pahlavicini run with my shoulder and not re-break.

Sounds like you're in the right hands now, but weird as it sounds, Dr. Birkenstock was following convention.

Hope you're better soon

post #40 of 40
Originally Posted by Tigerpaw

Ooph, glad the old hot poker treatment has been improved. Looks great in its current form...
Especially considering the lack of credentials by those who practice and recommend it:

Prolotherapy...Dr. C. Everett Koop's Story

"Prolotherapy is the name some people use for a type of medical intervention in musculoskeletal pain that causes a proliferation of collagen fibers such as those found in ligaments and tendons, as well as a shortening of those fibers. The "prolo" in Prolotherapy, therefore, comes from proliferative.Other therapists have referred to this type of treatment as Sclerotherapy. "Sclera" comes from the Greek word "sklera", which means hard. Sclerotherapy, therefore, refers to the same type of medical intervention which produces a hardening of the tissues treated – just as described above in the proliferation of collagen fibers.Not many physicians are aware of Prolotherapy, and even fewer are adept at this form of treatment. One wonders why that is so. In my opinion, it is because medical folks are skeptical and Prolotherapy, unless you have tried it and proven its worth, seems to be too easy a solution to a series of complicated problems that afflict the human body and have been notoriously difficult to treat by any other method.

Another reason is the simplicity of the therapy: Injecting an irritant solution, which may be something as simple as glucose, at the junction of a ligament with a bone to produce the rather dramatic therapeutic benefits that follow.Many of his patients were people who had been treated for years by all sorts of methods.......I saw so many of them cured that I could not help but become a "believer" in Prolotherapy Another very practical reason is that many insurance companies do not pay for Prolotherapy, largely because their medical advisors do not understand it, have not practiced it, and therefore do not recommend it. Finally, Prolotherapy seems too simple a procedure for a very complicated series of musculoskeletal problems which affect huge numbers of patients.

The reason why I consented to write the preface to this book is because I have been a patient who has benefitted from Prolotherapy. Having been so remarkably relieved of my chronic disabling pain, I began to use it on some of my patients – but more on that later. When I was 40 years old, I was diagnosed in two separate neurological clinics as having intractable (incurable) pain. My comment was that I was too young to have intractable pain. It was by chance that I learned that Gustav A. Hemwall, M.D., a practitioner in the suburbs of Chicago, was an expert in Prolotherapy. When I asked him if he could cure my pain, he asked me to describe it. When I had done the best that I could, he replied., "There is no such pain. Do you mean a pain…" And then he continued to describe my pain much better than I could. When I said, "That’s it exactly," he said, "I can fix you." To make a long story short, my intractable pain was not intractable and I was remarkably improved to the point where my pain ceased to be a problem. Much milder recurrences of that pain over the next 20 years were retreated the same way with equally beneficial results.

I was so impressed with what Dr. Hemwall had done for me that on several occasions, just to satisfy my curiosity, I watched him work in his clinic and witnessed the unbelievable variety of musculoskeletal problems he was able to treat successfully. Many of his patients were people who had been treated for years by all sorts of methods, including major surgery, some of which had left them worse off than they were before. Many of his patients had the lack of confidence in further treatment and the low expectations that folks inflicted with chronic pain frequently exhibit. Yet I saw so many of them cured that I could not help but become a "believer" in Prolotherapy. I was a pediatric surgeon, and there are not many times when Prolotherapy is needed in children because they just don’t suffer from the same relaxation of musculoskeletal connections that are so amenable to treatment by Prolotherapy. But I noticed frequently that the parents of my patients were having difficulty getting into their coats, or they walked with a limp, or they favored an arm. I would ask what the problem was and then, if it seemed suitable, offer my services in Prolotherapy at no expense, feeling that I was a pediatric surgeon and this was really not my line of work.

The results I saw in those many patients were just as remarkable as was the relief I had received in the hands of Dr. Hemwall. I was so impressed with what Prolotherapy could do for musculoskeletal disease that I, at one time, thought that might be the way I would spend my years after formal retirement from the University of Pennsylvania. But the call of President Reagan to be Surgeon General of the United States interrupted any such plans. The reader may wonder why, in spite of what I have said and what this book contains, there are still so many skeptics about Prolotherapy.

I think it has to be admitted that those in the medical profession, once they have departed from their formal training and have established themselves in practice, are not the most open to innovative and new ideas. Prolotherapy is not a cure-all for all pain. Therefore, the diagnosis must be made accurately and the therapy must be done by someone who knows what he or she is doing. The nice thing about prolotherapy, if properly done, is that it cannot do any harm. How could placing a little sugar-water at the junction of a ligament with a bone be harmful to a patient? I hope that Dr. Hauser’s book, written for laymen, will push them to inquire more about Prolotherapy and that it might receive the place in modern therapeutics that I think it really deserves.

C. Everett Koop, M.D., ScD Former United States Surgeon General
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