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Suggestions for all mountain twin tips

post #1 of 29
Thread Starter 
Here's me:

Strong intermediate/advanced skier who skis almost exclusively in the east. I spend very little time on straight groomers

I'm somewhat into park/pipe skiing, but I spend most of my time in the bumps or the trees (mainly trees)

I'm looking for a twin tip that will let me go into park/pipe but is mainly a strong, all-mountain ski that would be good in the trees and bumps of the east coast. So many of the twins I see are so wide that I'm concerned with how they'll perform on the east coast as an all-mountain ski. Even in the woods, float is not too much of a concern

Anyone have experience with a particluar model / suggestions for a twin tip than can carve a little too?

BTW, I'm not picky about the latest/greatest. If you have a 3 or 4 year old model you've seen on ebay or wherever, I'm not too proud to buy used skis!!

Thanks in advance
post #2 of 29
What do you consider fat?

What do you currently ski on?

How do you ski the bumps?

Do you like stiff skis or soft skis?

What is your height and weight?
post #3 of 29
Thread Starter 
Thanks for answering

What do you consider fat? -- don't want to go too far north of 75, although if some has had good experience skiing in the east with something wider, I'm all ears.

What do you currently ski on? --very narrow waisted head xp60s (63 mm, i think) that were the first pair of skis I ever bought and are decent skis but don't really suit what I like to do anymore

How do you ski the bumps? -- very carefully (somewhat slowly) I'm more interested in getting down than bombing down the bumps -- I just like to mix it up a little and I get bored / cold on groomed slopes

Do you like stiff skis or soft skis? -- don't have enough experience to really answer too well. I think I would error on the side of stiffness because I do want to be able to carve when needed.

What is your height and weight? -- 5' 11", 185 lbs

Thanks
post #4 of 29
When I was buying my Pocket Rockets (which are probably a bit wider than you are looking for), it was suggested that the 1080 would be a great option if I wanted a ski that was more versatile - many PR characteristics, but not as wide so better when you are dealing with groomed slopes. Since I already had skis for the groomers and was looking for powder skis, I stuck with the wider PR.

As better ability on groomed and some compromise on powder were given to me as the main reasons to go with a 1080 instead of a PR, maybe you would want to check out the Salomon 1080. Since it has been out for a while and is relatively popular, I would think it is a ski that you might be able to pick up used.

I suspect that, like the PR, the 1080 will be easy to turn and fun in the trees. However, it is likely also a soft ski, so if you are a heavy guy or like a stiff ski, it might not be your cup of tea.

FYI, while I think the PR is too wide for everyday skiing in the East, I must mention that my husband loves his in everything and is now pretty much skiing them exclusively, even on our groomed ice (aka packed powder!).

Kristine
post #5 of 29
I have used the Salomon 1080 and found it a very capable all-round ski both easr coast and west. Never found it to be a soft ski, indeed I was surprised at its versatility. I bought it originally for some fun but ended up using it as an all-round ski. Surprised me as I normally like a GS type ski

i used the earlier version which if memory serves me right was 71 or 72 waist but still worked well on soft stuff and gave decent grip on east coast hard pack
post #6 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by stattry
Thanks for answering

What do you consider fat? -- don't want to go too far north of 75, although if some has had good experience skiing in the east with something wider, I'm all ears.

What is your height and weight? -- 5' 11", 185 lbs

Thanks
Most twins are wider than 75-mm in the waist...they are made for the park, and carving is secondary. However, many of the 78-80-mm waisted twins carve just fine.

At 185, you want to be in the 180-cm range (give or take a few). I currently have the 2003 Teneighty for my SoCal park ski, and concur that they are really nice more all-mtn. riding. Remember, most park skis are mounted more forward, so a 180 skis shorter in the tip, and has more tail for switch riding and fakie landings.

The quick list is as follows:
  • Sallie Teneighty
  • K2 Public Enemy
  • Rossi Scratch FS
  • Dynastar Troublemaker
  • Volkl V/V Expression

Older V's, Dynastar Concepts/Candides, and K2 Enemys are still floating around new for sub $200, so keep an eye out...
post #7 of 29
Bandit Man, Any comment on the Scratch (plain Old)?
Thinking of it as an all mountain for my wife.
It is simply a lighter? less pop filled FS?
post #8 of 29
Forget the K2 PE.

The go-to ski for you is the Elan Mantis 666.
post #9 of 29
Fischer Big Stix 8.0
post #10 of 29

1080! Ack!

Quote:
Originally Posted by ScotsSkier
I have used the Salomon 1080 and found it a very capable all-round ski both easr coast and west. Never found it to be a soft ski, indeed I was surprised at its versatility. I bought it originally for some fun but ended up using it as an all-round ski. Surprised me as I normally like a GS type ski

i used the earlier version which if memory serves me right was 71 or 72 waist but still worked well on soft stuff and gave decent grip on east coast hard pack
I have the good fortune of being the same sole length as my friend, so we will often switch skis with each other if the day gets slow. He had a pair of 1080's and I had Bandit XXX's.

The run is a 12' cornice drop onto crud, a wide run tilted at about 30 degrees, narrowing into some trees. My friend, on the 1080's, gingerly rolls over the lip and takes 10 turns into the trees. He comments later that they felt very skittish in anything approaching crud.

I sidestep about 30' up the hill and blast off the cornice into the crud.

BAROOOOOOMMM!

I make 2 turns. I don't even notice the crud or slow down until I see the trees growing wildly in my path.

Next run, we switch.

I do the same thing, or attempt to. The 1080's are about the same length and weight as my XXX's, but whoa whoa whoa! They roll, twist, buck, and generally go anywhere but where they're being pointed. I barely make it to the bottom with my dignity intact.

My friend launches the lip and straightlines the entire run. He sprays a 15' high wave of snow in his exuberance upon reaching the bottom.

I decide to keep the 1080's on the way to the terrain park. My friend blasts ahead on my skis, making big big downhill turns all the way. The 1080's have so little torsional stiffness I can't match his turns, and when we get to the last line of bumps he zippers them, bashing through them at high speed. The 1080's are so light I have to do more skidded turns, again reaching the bottom in second. They were OK in trees though, a little zippier than my Bandits.

However.

The 1080's feel very light and "flippy" in the air. Very easy to twist and grab, and spin 360's with. The XXX - well, nevermind. They just don't belong in the park. Think of 2x4's strapped to your feet.

I also tried the Pocket Rocket at Crested Butte, and found it very similar to the 1080. Fun in the trees and the park, but definitely not a big-mountain push-it-hard go-fast ski.
post #11 of 29
Go with the 2004/2005 1080s!!!
I got the same 2003 ones as above and flexed the 04/05 model which is significantly stiffer now, making it even a lot more versatile all-mountain ski without sacrificing the advantages in the park. It should also work much better in the crud now - wish I could trade my old ones in exchange for the new. Spending the extra bucks vs. a used one is definitely worth it!
post #12 of 29
Troublemakers

Both my son and I got them last year. We ski mostly northern Vermont, a lot of glades, woods and bumps, and they are awesome. Also had them at Alta/Snowbird in the spring, some pow, lots of corn and some crud and they were great. I went from a Rossi Viper slalom to them, and I have no problems on groomed with them. Definately try and demo them.
post #13 of 29
While this has not been my direction for ski selection my son (a very strong skier) went this way last year with Public Enemies. He like them a lot but alas, they were stolen in Telluride! This year he would like to get a pair of Volkl Karmas (but depending on finances may just have to ski his Seth Pistols with Freerides - his BC setup - as his main ski). The Karma is supposed to have pretty favorable all mountain characteristics and in addition wider, stronger edges and a tougher base. It's got a reputation (or at least advertisement) as an indestructable ski. Something to consider.
post #14 of 29
MichaelH - how do you ski the bumps (what 'style') and how do the TM's do on them? (and have you ever skied on bump skis, and how do they compare to those.. on the bumps)
post #15 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by PowHog
Go with the 2004/2005 1080s!!!
I got the same 2003 ones as above and flexed the 04/05 model which is significantly stiffer now, making it even a lot more versatile all-mountain ski without sacrificing the advantages in the park.
I'm pretty sure that there is no change to this years 1080 compared to the last two years except for the graphic.

The two LAB 1080 skis are stiffer then the normal 1080s.
post #16 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scalce
I'm pretty sure that there is no change to this years 1080 compared to the last two years except for the graphic.

The two LAB 1080 skis are stiffer then the normal 1080s.
Just to clarify:
I am talking about the ones with the white top sheet at 181 - they are definitely[u] stiffer than last year's.
post #17 of 29
This just in... wide skis rip the groomed and everything else. The only thing they don't rip is zipperline bumps and gate bashing. Get a medium stiff 90mm wood core ski and be happy. 80s do great on hard snow but 90 is the new 80.
post #18 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by PowHog
Just to clarify:
I am talking about the ones with the white top sheet at 181 - they are definitely[u] stiffer than last year's.
From: Salomon US Info <us_info@Salomon-sports.com>
Date: 2004/10/15 Fri PM 01:27:46 EDT
To: 'John Scalcione' <john@scalcione.com>
Subject: RE: Question from the website: Ski products


John,
No it is not stiffer then last seasons.

-----Original Message-----
From: John Scalcione [mailto:john@scalcione.com]
Sent: Friday, October 15, 2004 12:56 PM
To: Contact U.S.
Subject: Question from the website: Ski products

Is this year's 1080 ski any stiffer then last years?

Is there any construction difference between them?

Thanks

----
date of the request : 10/15/2004 4:56:22 PM GMT
post #19 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scalce
From: Salomon US Info <us_info@Salomon-sports.com>
Date: 2004/10/15 Fri PM 01:27:46 EDT
To: 'John Scalcione' <john@scalcione.com>
Subject: RE: Question from the website: Ski products


John,
No it is not stiffer then last seasons.

-----Original Message-----
From: John Scalcione [mailto:john@scalcione.com]
Sent: Friday, October 15, 2004 12:56 PM
To: Contact U.S.
Subject: Question from the website: Ski products

Is this year's 1080 ski any stiffer then last years?

Is there any construction difference between them?

Thanks

----
date of the request : 10/15/2004 4:56:22 PM GMT

Yours noted!

But no matter what your rep might say: I posess the 2003 model - this one is notably softer than the one from this year I flexed at the shop which was a stunning surprise for myself. I did not notice any hint on a LAB version when looking at the white topsheet.
Will check directly with Salomon France later on for confirmation.
post #20 of 29
All the normal 1080s are the white graphic.

The LABs are a dark camo design.

I also have a 2003 1080 and I think it is the same flex as this years.
post #21 of 29
Stockli has a new handmade twintip called the Snake 114-80-108 Holds real well on east coast hardpack. Has 2 mounting positions one for park and one for all mountain. Can be seen at Stockli.com
post #22 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mack
MichaelH - how do you ski the bumps (what 'style') and how do the TM's do on them? (and have you ever skied on bump skis, and how do they compare to those.. on the bumps)
I am not very technical, but I take it as smooth as possible in bumps, my son is more of a banger. No zipperline. Either way, most of our bump skiing is natural snow ungroomed trails, so the rocks and other stuff determines some of the style. We weigh 150 and 160 lbs, and we are both on 165's.
post #23 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by John J
Bandit Man, Any comment on the Scratch (plain Old)?
Thinking of it as an all mountain for my wife.
It is simply a lighter? less pop filled FS?
JohnJ,

I can't really comment on the Scratch (non-FS), but I think you are on the right track. It's Rossi's answer to the $299-$350 park ski arena where K2 prices their Fujative and PE. I'm not sure on the core nor construction. That being said, for a lighter female, I still think that the Teneighty is a great all-mtn. stick. I saw some of the 03-04's on a local big box retailer for $349. At that price, its hard to beat, and it makes a decent off-piste ski, too.
post #24 of 29
Didn't like the scratch at all. I'm tellin u yo, try that Elan 666.
post #25 of 29
if you want to go older, the Dynastar Concept and/or Candide were some of the greatest all-mountain twins ever...I think corbetts sports in Oakville (www.skiandsnowboards.com) may have something left....

They run around 72 or 78 in the waist, and the difference between the 2 is just stifness - highly recommended (I still have Candides along with my Rossi scratches, and use them in the east and mogul conditions)
post #26 of 29

1080

I have last year´s model in 170.Great ski BUT:
-It´s soft,i wish i had the 180.I wish it was stiffer because the width and sidecut are really good for a do everything ski.
-Factory mounting position is way too centered for all-mountain.I mounted mine with the old method:"ball" of the foot over the middle of effective edge lenght.
I would buy it again.
post #27 of 29
Vita-mam beat me to it. I'll second the Snake.... not to mention the cool graphics too. It's black with silver lettering and a cobra head on the tip. Dimensions are 115-80-108 and comes in 160, 170,180.
post #28 of 29

???silly

Quote:
Originally Posted by PowHog
Yours noted!

But no matter what your rep might say: I posess the 2003 model - this one is notably softer than the one from this year I flexed at the shop which was a stunning surprise for myself. I did not notice any hint on a LAB version when looking at the white topsheet.
Will check directly with Salomon France later on for confirmation.
Let's see, an air-core ski that's a year old being softer than a new one in the shop? Will wonders never cease? Do tell.

In all seriousness, an air-core ski does not retain its flex well, and it's not surprising that the 2003 didn't feel as stiff. My Bandit XXX's lost their flex after one and a half seasons, about 90 days.

I'm going with a woodcore ski next time, for sure.
post #29 of 29
Latest edition of Freeskier Mag has some great twin reviews - they actually trash some of the skis unlike reviews in most magazines in which all models are beautiful in their own unique ways. Their final picks include the Troublemaker, Karma, Rossi Scratch FS, and a half dozen others. It's well worth checking out. If you're like me, you'll make the wrong choice if you base your decision entirely on reviews - ours or theirs - use the reviews as a basis to demo a couple of models in a couple of lengths. I've made poor decisions based on reviews, and also made poor decisions on length (being a little older, I always have to fight my bias towards a longer ski).
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