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Tuning Suppplies

post #1 of 28
Thread Starter 
Ok guys I have some question for you. This year I need to get some tuning supplies because my old stuff is no good. I plan on getting the stuff from Artech.com. Heres a list of things I plan on getting, tell me if I should add any more stuff or if I even need all of the stuff, keep in mind I am a racer.
ARTECH Horsehair Brush
ARTECH Nylon Brush
ARTECH Brass Brush
ARTECH Wax Scraper : Thick - 1/4Ó
ARTECH Basic Tuning Kit (2 Files, File Card, Edge Guide, Steel Scraper, P-tex, Brake retainer, Gummi Stone)
For an Iron I was thinking some cheap Iron from Walmart, tell me if you think its a good idea to do this. I have used a travel iron for years but it finally died, never had any problems with it though.

Also another question, for a 3 degree side angle I need a 93 degree guide right? Because I have seen so many different numbers that it confused me.
post #2 of 28
I wouldn't use a cheap iron to wax my skis. I always use my mom's best iron.
A 93d edge guide will work fine.

John
post #3 of 28
Stay away from steam holes in the iron base.
Marc
post #4 of 28
You can spend a fortune on a fancy iron. Most Nordic racers wouldn't use anything but a temperature calibrated Swix, believing that anything else will be death to their skis. I only use one for really hot CERA-F application. For daily HC wax anyone who can recognize smoke and has half a brain can use a Walmart iron, or your mother's best iron. Either one will heat up faster than a $150 Swix
post #5 of 28
Thread Starter 
Hrmm, I think the $6.48 special will do the trick its base is perfectly flat and it has no paint stuff on it. Thanks.
post #6 of 28
Get the oval brushes.
Look into the Moonflex diamond "stones",
Artech has a pretty good deal on those.
Careful with any iron, if you can see the
edge layout through the base, or the
wax is smoking, beware. Maybe one day
with hard wax that "cotton" setting was
ok, but with soft (warm) wax, you are not going
to need that much heat.
post #7 of 28
Just my opinion but if you have invested a fair amount of $ in other tuning supplies, consider a decent iron esp. if you race. The downside of home irons is that their themostats tend to fluctuate much more than ski irons.

There is an interesting thread at http://forums.epicski.com/showthread...light=grey+wax with a reply by "skidoc" who was a tuning specialist and generally important guy with Volkl USA for a long time.

My point is that if someone spends over $1,000 in skis, boots, bindings and tuning supplies, they might be better served with a better iron. There are other threads that speak to the bext temps. for maxiumum wax absortion. With harder waxes these optimal temps. bring you closer to the point where you can also do some damage the base or the ski itself.
post #8 of 28
I am kind of with Lostboy on this one. A good iron will last a long time. If you get a cheap one turn it on 10 minutes before you need it so that the temp can stabilize. You can use a kitchen thermometer to check temperature.

I use to buy cheap tools, but as I've gotten older and hopefully wiser, nothing is cheaper than buying a really high quality tool the first time.
post #9 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by SHREDHEAD
...nothing is cheaper than buying a really high quality tool the first time.
Great quote.

I would add a medium diamond stone of some sort to the initial listing of tools.
post #10 of 28
I would recomend the moonflex stones, I used them all last season. Love them. The secret sauce is, quite, don't tell everone, 50/50 denatured alcohal and water. But that's a secret so don't tell everbody. Home depot has the denatured alcohal for about $2.50 a quart. I use a old tooth brush and a plastic cup with a snap on lid to keep my sauce in. I do a lot of tuning and I haven't used more than half the can. I did use up one of the 200 grit moonflex stones and our racer took my newer one to Burke Mt Academy with her.

For irons, she likes her swix, I liked my old 1960's flat iron until it got to dangerous to use. To many jumps from the bench to the floor. I have a iron that I bought out of Tognar tool's. Seems to work well. www.tognar.com
post #11 of 28
Thread Starter 
Well the reason for the cheap iron is I have spent 2 grand on other equipment I just don't have the money for it now. I would get a good one if I had the money.
post #12 of 28
Try any flea market.I picked up a small travel iron without steam holes for a couple bucks and used it for years. It worked great. A friend has a high dollar wax iron and unless your mixing waxes my two dollar buy worked just as well.
post #13 of 28
Uhhhhh....Max Capacity, not trying to stir the pot but the formula you just mentioned is actually a mixture that Diaface (the Moonflex Stone manufacturer) recommends as a lubricant for their products. I'm sure you know how denatured alcohol behaves, smells, feels etc.... if you have the opportunity to compare that w/ the Sun Valley Ski Tools Secret Sauce, you'll be convinced that the Secret Sauce is absolutely NOT simply alcohol & water. What it is, though, is a non-oil based cutting solution formulated specifically for metal & actually used in machine shops when there is a need for such a thing. And that's all I have to say about that.
The End.
post #14 of 28
Is it gin?
post #15 of 28
It's Smurf Jizz
post #16 of 28
I have found that if you get some Swix Fiberlene or Toko Base Tex (thicker than Swix), use two or three sheets (like a paper towel), get you iron hot, and use the Fiberlene/Base Tex over the iron plate. That way you don't have to scrape away a lot of wax. I have found that this really helps. Look at Tognar's website for waxing tips.
post #17 of 28
I’ve been tuning my own skis since the 3rd grade. Like many here I’ve worked in shops and tuned thousands of skis. Every winter I start out with whatever POS iron is at hand at the moment. Over the years I’ve gotten used to all types – from “pro” waxing irons to the POS that no matter what you do you’re frying bacon, or you’re rubbing the iron like a sander hoping somehow the friction will melt the wax.

I think the biggest benefit from the real wax irons comes from their big heat sink – they maintain their temp over the length of the ski. The irons designed to press a shirt always cool-off as you travel down the ski, then you crank the heat, then it starts to smoke, then you back it down, then repeat.

I’ve never bought a nice iron though - never seem to get PO’d enough with the crappy irons until mid-way through the season … and then it’s too late to buy one.

One day I’ll get one … I couldn’t agree more with the comment “nothing is cheaper than buying a quality tool the first time”.
post #18 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdowling
I wouldn't use a cheap iron to wax my skis. I always use my mom's best iron.
A 93d edge guide will work fine.

John
Use a 94 to end up at 93 read this article! Read step 4-8 about backfiling.

http://www.holmenkol.us/myadmin/data...our%20Skis.pdf
post #19 of 28
Thread Starter 
Well I ordered everything on that list except I didn't get a file guide since they didn't have any 3 degree ones in stock. But now that I read that article I don't know what to do. Hmm should I get a 94 degree winning edge, or wait for a 93 degree winning edge.
post #20 of 28
I use the SVST edge bevelers 4 of them, a 92, 2 93's and a 94 and 4 plates, two 1 degress, a 2 and a 3.

The first 2 I ordered a couple of years ago were a 92 and a 93 with two 1 degree plates. This allowed me to do a 92, 93 & 94 degree and set up 2 at 93 if I wanted.The 92 with a 1 degree plate & the 93 with no plate.

This let me change the file or stones half the amount of times since i could have 2 set up at 93 at the same time.

Since then I also bought another 93 and a 94 with 2 degree and 3 degree plate.

You can see the versatility and combos you can arrange this way.

Now I use the 94 with a 3 degree plate to set the initial side edge with a short panser file(cross file) then I can have 3 94 degree bevelers set up with a file & 2 stones and donot have to stop & change the files or stones just pick up another beveler already set up. I am also using 100 or 150mm (around 4") files to prevent the ladder effect cuase by extreme sidecut and too long a file
post #21 of 28
as far as iron goes, I have/had a 20$ iron, that would get super hot. This was a problem, however when i was at Mt. Ste Anne i was talking to one of the shop owners/tuners and he marked the optimal temeprature on the dial, has worked wonders for me now. (he used some type of thermometer that he was able to place on the base of the iron)
post #22 of 28
Atomicman, Thanks for the link. I could get to the site but still not get to the article.

I have a young friend that goes to Burke Mt Academy and get's her wax from Holmenkol, last season she told me to put my Volkl's at 1 and 3. I have done that and I'm impressed with the edge grip on firm snow. The skis have the feel of the factory edge or maybe even better.
post #23 of 28
Try the link again, I changed it yesterday & it just worked for me.

http://www.holmenkol.us/myadmin/data...our%20Skis.pdf
post #24 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by Max Capacity
I have a young friend that goes to Burke Mt Academy and get's her wax from Holmenkol, last season she told me to put my Volkl's at 1 and 3. I have done that and I'm impressed with the edge grip on firm snow. The skis have the feel of the factory edge or maybe even better.
I set all my skis to a 1 and 3 and love it. I also use the SVST side guide.

I just picked up some Holmenkol stuff at Jack Frost up at Sunday River. The guy Fred that is always there loves their stuff and ordered a ton of tuning tools including guides, files, stones, diamond stones, wax, and other tuning supplies.

I picked up some files that A-Man recommended and a stone.

I need them to fix a nice gouge and some rock damage to an edge on my wife's Atomic that she killed on Friday.

I can't wait to try them out.
post #25 of 28
Right on! Have fun!
post #26 of 28
Very good information here. SVST makes very good stuff. I second Woodee's comment about the heat sink of a wax iron. It is really important that the heat is uniform and at the correcttemperature. You can check the temperature with an oven thermometer available in any kitchen supply store. I have seen a lot of travel irons used and they work, but in my opinion not too well. You do not get the wax penetration that a larger mass iron will get. I think money on a good iron is money well spent.
post #27 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by Norefjell
You do not get the wax penetration that a larger mass iron will get. I think money on a good iron is money well spent.
You guys just can't admit that there are great waxing irons at goodwill. My $1.50 iron is bigger and has more thermal mass than any fancy ski iron I've ever seen. You just need to find an old one. I wax daily with CH8-10 or something similar and it knocks that out in a flash...smooth, even heat, no smoke. My skis aren't damaged....I get my nordic skis from world cup racers and we glide test all the time.

The digital Swix takes much longer to warm up and doesn't have near the thermal mass. Of course it comes out for hard waxes and those nasty but wonderful fluoros. Unless you race or live in one of the icebox locations you should spent your money on good wine.
post #28 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by newfydog
... Unless you race or live in one of the icebox locations you should spent your money on good wine.
Oh Man! That goes without saying! Hmmm, maybe that's why I have yet to ever buy one ...

Those old ones are becoming scarce though.
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