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What does it mean when something is "technical"? - Page 2

post #31 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by oldschoolskier View Post

The comment that technical means it reduces your options isn't always true. The bigger your skill set the more options you have.

Some very technical and difficult runs do require very specific skill set that must be performed on demand. However, most technical runs just require that you perform on demand to control your decent in safe manner.

As an example trees are technical, you must pick a line and turn as required not to hit one. Requires some technique (skill).

Some beginners run trees safely, so they have enough skill to manage that run. A beginner is very limited in how they ski this run, an expert skier skis it with a vast range of options and speed to run the same run. Difference is range of skills on demand.

But regardless of your skill set, there is terrain where your options become limited. If you have a fairly high skill set, the terrain needs to be much more difficult to limit your options.

 

For example, an intermediate skier might consider a regular mogul field technical. Their options are limited by their ability, then further limited by the terrain. On the other hand, I wouldn't consider an open mogul field technical, because I have the skill set to navigate it in just about any way I please. A 6' wide, 35 degree chute in the trees, that I would consider technical for me. Because I have very few options available, even with an extensive skill set. 

 

Just like so much else, technical is largely in the eye of the beholder. 

post #32 of 49

so i suppose that Alta Badia, Adleboden, Bormio GS's  wouldn't be technical skiing for most here... So maybe the Val D'isere GS might qualify because sometimes it has rocks.

post #33 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by g-force View Post
 

so i suppose that Alta Badia, Adleboden, Bormio GS's  wouldn't be technical skiing for most here... So maybe the Val D'isere GS might qualify because sometimes it has rocks.

 

In normal conditions, the Face piste in Val d'Isere isn't all that technical. Yes, it's steep in places, but it's also quite wide and regularly groomed. The only somewhat narrow parts are on the flatter traverses that cut across the rocks near the top. So unless it's really icy, most upper intermediates can ski it without looking like they're completely out of their depth.

 

Now, the ungroomed, off-piste terrain to either side of the piste can be technical in places. There are some large rocks and trees that create narrow lines in certain spots to go along with the steep terrain and variable snow. But, the only way you can make the piste itself technical is if you're trying to ski it at race speeds.

 

Here's a photo from the bottom:

 

 

Here's a YouTube video of some snowboarders going down the entire run:

 


Edited by CerebralVortex - 8/17/16 at 8:22am
post #34 of 49

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=stsrOfR2jW4

or

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QwWIYe5TtZI

Isn't 'technical' ?

Skiing as entertainment in the exciting world of the future where Frank's "Joe's Garage" has come true.

I am outta here.

post #35 of 49

The question was about whether terrain is technical, not whether someone is skiing it in a technical way.

 

For example, no one would argue that a groomed blue is technical. Skiing it normally is easy for most people. But if I ski it backwards, that would be a bit more difficult. If I ski it backwards on one foot, that would be even more difficult. And if I try to ski it backwards on one foot with my eyes closed, then that would be extremely difficult. But just because I'm skiing it in an extremely difficult manner doesn't mean that a groomed blue is technical terrain.

 

Similarly, the piste used for the races in Val d'Isere is not hugely difficult to ski if you're skiing normally. If you turn it into a sheet of ice, then skiing it becomes a bit more difficult. If you place a bunch of gates in awkward positions, then skiing it that way becomes even more difficult. And if you try to go as fast as you absolutely can between the awkwardly positioned gates on a sheet of ice, then it becomes very difficult. But that doesn't mean the terrain itself is technical; it just means that people are going out of their way to ski it in a challenging way.

 

Now, if you want to talk about technical terrain in Val d'Isere, then you should be looking at something like the Couloir des Pisteurs. No matter what the conditions are like and no matter how slowly you want to ski, it's a challenge. No one needs to go out of their way to make it more difficult than it already is.

 

 


Edited by CerebralVortex - 8/18/16 at 3:24am
post #36 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by g-force View Post
 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=stsrOfR2jW4

or

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QwWIYe5TtZI

Isn't 'technical' ?

Skiing as entertainment in the exciting world of the future where Frank's "Joe's Garage" has come true.

I am outta here.


Don't let the door hit you on the way out.  It's not technical if you don't have to make the gates with a good time.

post #37 of 49
I think we're seeing confusion between terrain that's technical and skiing that's technical. If the discussion is about terrain, then most race courses (excluding maybe downhill with intentional flight sections) aren't technical, but certainly require technical mastery to ski at speed. Then there's technical terrain, which would normally require technical mastery at ANY speed. And I think that "technical terrain" as being discussed here might be an Americanism, leading to confusion when discussed with a global audience. Change it to "complicated" and I think the arguments would die down.
post #38 of 49

I love posts like this because it attracts bees to a hive. Anyone else with a story?

post #39 of 49

In the context of the original post, technical skiing skill proficiency and tactical experience are necessary.

 

Strength and athletic ability aren't enough to compensate.

post #40 of 49

Must turns with high consequences for failure. And must be skied with good technique. A lot of people can make it down double black lines or harder doing survival skiing. In a technical line if you don't ski it properly you won't make it down, or you'll make it down in a big hurry. Survival skiing doesn't work here. While it is the line that is "technical" excellent technical skiing skills are mandatory.

Look at videos of gapers trying to ski Corbet's. Too narrow to sideslip in. If they get back on their skis and try to make the turn away from the wall they crash. (Not a great example--consequences of failure are low for most people who fall and the technical portion is just the entrance, but it's an easily accessible example of what the term means.)

 

Technical isn't synonymous with hard, although technical runs are always hard. It is not synonymous with steep, although all technical runs are steep. It is not an advanced mogul field for a beginner. It is not in the eye of the beholder. There is no bailout. It means that you make the first turn or you hit something. And if you don't make the first turn perfectly you can't make the second and you hit something. And if you hit something you go to the bottom, unless you hit something else that stops you. Patrol would prefer you go to the bottom, though, because if you don't they will have to use high angle rescue techniques to remove your corpse. 


Edited by oldgoat - 8/20/16 at 8:44am
post #41 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by mogulmuncher View Post
 

In the context of the original post, technical skiing skill proficiency and tactical experience are necessary.

 

Strength and athletic ability aren't enough to compensate.


I like this definition.  Technical terrain requires more than mere strength and athletic ability; it requires skill, the more technical the more skill required.

post #42 of 49
Hard to find a dictionary definition that applies to skiing.
post #43 of 49
Classic epic thread - the question the OP asked is answered in the first few posts but then people start confusing the issue with assertions that race courses and groomer carving require application of
post #44 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by fatbob View Post

Classic epic thread - the question the OP asked is answered in the first few posts but then people start confusing the issue with assertions that race courses and groomer carving require application of

 

Classic Epic post... starts out like it's going to give you good information, then just trails off without finishi ;) :D 

post #45 of 49
Oops...oh let's be honest I lost the will to live wink.gif
post #46 of 49

An old goat once said "there's a peculiar line."

post #47 of 49

It's not the same thing, but the French have a lovely term "combat skiing". As I've seen it applied, it seems to refer to what's below that 500 meter couloir and the wide open slopes under the couloir--tight little trees with low branches, rocks, dirt, brush,  etc (and maybe a long hike or hitch back to town).

post #48 of 49
Yep combat skiing involves dealing with scrub, fences, barbed wire, cows, cow pats, hopping streams, hoping there is just enough snow cover on that gravel or tarmac. It's kinda Type II fun.
post #49 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by fatbob View Post

Yep combat skiing involves dealing with scrub, fences, barbed wire, cows, cow pats, hopping streams, hoping there is just enough snow cover on that gravel or tarmac. It's kinda Type II fun.


You forgot hawthorn, another use for ski poles.

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