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Designing the ultimate ski pack

post #1 of 18
Thread Starter 

Hi all,

 

Some ski friends and I are designing the ultimate ski backpack (for downhill resort).  As part, we're trying to see how many people ski with packs or have issues skiing with packs.  We would appreciate any feedback via a 1-minute survey: 

 

https://goo.gl/forms/jNA24Wjbiaz4mJBr1

 

Many thanks all!

post #2 of 18

I think you maybe need to reset the permissions on your survey before anyone here can have a look at it?

post #3 of 18
Thread Starter 

Doh!  Inauspicious start, eh?  Thanks bud.

post #4 of 18

Before I even took a survey - I'd want to know what you think is lacking in current designs. Compared to a few years ago, there are some crazy good packs out there. Including resort-oriented any packs in a wide range of sizes, proportions, and styles.

 

So what problem are you solving? Who makes the best and worst in your view? And what puts those things into each category?

post #5 of 18
Thread Starter 

Well, the initial idea was to create a pack that one could wear while on a lift because most packs force you to lean forward on the lift.  From there we thought about other problems skiers have, such as cell batteries that die more quickly because of the cold,  protection for goggles, organization so everything doesn't settle in the bottom of the pack, squished sandwiches, etc.   So we came up with some designs to address these and other issues and then thought that before we sink any real money into realizing those designs we'd better check to see if others have similar issues and there's a potential market - hence the survey :)

post #6 of 18

Hey - Looked at your survey, I think that possibly a few additional questions might get you better results.  It really depends on what type of resort skier you're targeting. For example, when I'm resort skiing I do not use a backpack - so my first answer would be 'no'.  However, if I'm resort skiing but thinking of maybe doing a little OB sidecountry skiing utilizing the lifts, than I bring a smaller pack with all my avy gear, but not as full a pack as I would on 'backcountry' day. If it's a high avy danger day, and I'm, skiing off-piste but completely in bounds, than I sometimes wear a pack with avy gear, just to be on the safe side.  Than, there's the rare day when I may be lift skiing but want to bring a DSLR camera and bring a pack - but the way the survey is set up, I would answer "no" since I generally do not wear a pack resort skiing.  If you're designing a pack for a resort skier just wanting to carry sandwiches and junk, that's a lot different than a backpack for someone  wanting to carry avy gear, or even DSLR camera gear.   If you have a design for a pack that works better for sitting on a chair lift - than you are definitely solving a problem with most (if not all) existing packs.  I've come up with ideas myself on this since I agree that wearing a pack on lifts is horrible, cumbersome and can even be dangerous  (although I am not pursuing my ideas on this or planning on being in the pack business).   Maybe a few more questions to ferret out answers that can point you in the right direction.  Good luck.

post #7 of 18

I'd look at Evoc's inbounds oriented packs. Likewise Patagucci Maybe even the low volume Arva and Ortovox. I've not looked closely at Dakine in a bit. With or without any gear in them, those packs cover the low profile, goggle pocket, etc, end of things pretty well. The challenge with crush avoidance via the pack is that it would likely add bulk to the pack (my guess). Whereas a low profile tupperware sandwich tub would protect an individual sandwich.... Anyhow, if I did not think I could step it up from there, I'd not bother. If I did, I'd get pretty feature specific and see what folks would pay for them.

 

Sort of what ILOJ said  but with a shade more competitive analysis.

 

BTW - what range of packs have you used?

post #8 of 18
Thread Starter 

You're right - we realized a bit late that we were not explicit enough describing that we're mainly targeting resort skiers.  

post #9 of 18
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by spindrift View Post
 

I'd look at Evoc's inbounds oriented packs. Likewise Patagucci Maybe even the low volume Arva and Ortovox. I've not looked closely at Dakine in a bit. With or without any gear in them, those packs cover the low profile, goggle pocket, etc, end of things pretty well. The challenge with crush avoidance via the pack is that it would likely add bulk to the pack (my guess). Whereas a low profile tupperware sandwich tub would protect an individual sandwich.... Anyhow, if I did not think I could step it up from there, I'd not bother. If I did, I'd get pretty feature specific and see what folks would pay for them.

 

Sort of what ILOJ said  but with a shade more competitive analysis.

 

BTW - what range of packs have you used?

 

Mainly Camelbak variations.  For me the main things were goggles, baklava and stuff for kids, water, snacks, and often lunch, but was curious how "standard" that is.  This survey was an attempt to get a better sense of the market before we sink more time/money into our design(s)

 

Hadn't heard of a bunch of the brands you mentioned so thank you for that!

post #10 of 18
If it's a wish list, I would really appreciate a way to dry out and warm goggles on a storm day. I have a lot of trouble with fogging, so sometimes bring as many as three pairs of goggles with me to rotate. Once the foam in the frame gets wet, they are done and I have to change them out. Once all my goggles are wet, I have to head back to the lodge and use the hand dryers to get the moisture out. So, if there is some way to design a compartment in a backpack that can dry out goggles on the go, you have my order.

Maybe a compartment with a built in fan that circulates warm dry air, or even a pocket lined with dehydrating gel packs?
post #11 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalcarver View Post
 

 

Mainly Camelbak variations.  For me the main things were goggles, baklava and stuff for kids, water, snacks, and often lunch, but was curious how "standard" that is.  This survey was an attempt to get a better sense of the market before we sink more time/money into our design(s)

 

Hadn't heard of a bunch of the brands you mentioned so thank you for that!

 

There are many. Go to backcountry.com, rei.com, amazon.com, etc and search for "ski pack", "backcountry ski pack", "avalanche pack", "freeriede pack", etc, etc and you will find a  number of brands and packs. Most of the core features of these packs are pretty well evolved (including fleece lined goggle and sunglass pockets, bladder compartments and insulated hose guides, helmet carrying systems, etc)

 

At a minimum, there is no point reinventing the wheel for features that are well known.


Edited by spindrift - 8/5/16 at 7:50pm
post #12 of 18

I find that most packs designed to clear a climbing harness also sit high enough to not be a problem on chairs.     The only problem I have is that a pack worth carrying is also going to change balance, enough to really be noticeable for at least a day, especially in 3D snow. 

post #13 of 18

I've got the Dakine Heli Pro and honestly it has most of the features I could want in a backpack for resort and a little bit of sidecountry riding

post #14 of 18

As others have noted, the Dakine Heli Pro does have a lot of good features for a resort pack - could be a good baseline for what features you may want to include.  I used the Dakine Heli Pro for sidecountry and short BC days - I was completely happy with it until I got a bigger better BC pack  - Mammut Trion Pro - soooo much more comfortable when you put the skis on the pack and are carrying the ski weight - I never use my Heli Pro for any BC or Sidecountry any more - but, as the OP stated, you are thinking of designing a resort pack, so carrying skis is not an issue.  Helli Pro is fairly narrow and doesn't get in the way on lifts too much - that is if you're not stuffing if too full.  More size adjustabliity would be a good thing to adjust for different torso lengths.

post #15 of 18

mod note: survey has been approved.

post #16 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by ILOJ View Post
 

As others have noted, the Dakine Heli Pro does have a lot of good features for a resort pack - could be a good baseline for what features you may want to include.  I used the Dakine Heli Pro for sidecountry and short BC days - I was completely happy with it until I got a bigger better BC pack  - Mammut Trion Pro - soooo much more comfortable when you put the skis on the pack and are carrying the ski weight - I never use my Heli Pro for any BC or Sidecountry any more - but, as the OP stated, you are thinking of designing a resort pack, so carrying skis is not an issue.  Helli Pro is fairly narrow and doesn't get in the way on lifts too much - that is if you're not stuffing if too full.  More size adjustabliity would be a good thing to adjust for different torso lengths.

 

One thing I really want on the Dakine Heli Pro is an external crampon pouch like the old BD Attack packs used to have. 

post #17 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by cantunamunch View Post
 

 

One thing I really want on the Dakine Heli Pro is an external crampon pouch like the old BD Attack packs used to have. 


Indeed. Utterly critical for resort skiing :D

 

OP  - I forgot to mention that there are also a number of vests and vest/pack hybrids available as well. Or there were a couple years ago....

 

Meanwhile, tune in to TGR for this week's entertainment on this topic. 

post #18 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by spindrift View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by cantunamunch View Post
 

 

One thing I really want on the Dakine Heli Pro is an external crampon pouch like the old BD Attack packs used to have. 


Indeed. Utterly critical for resort skiing :D

 

 

Why yes, yes it is (assuming one needs a pack in the first place).    

 I got more use out of that one 4"x4"x12" double-cinch-strap  extra thick cordura  external pocket than all the other features on the Attack pack - carrying thermoses (on chair direct access!),  bota bags (with zero! slosh),  my nephew's Kneissl Bigfoots,  cinch-compressed down layers,  shoes with Ice Trekkers still on them, two different knee braces, the ex's Walk-EZs just to list what can easily remember.    

 Not sure who at BD designed that pack  but they had a very clear sense of what was useful and what wasn't;  one that isn't really evident on most of the packs I see today.   

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