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Knee Bindings & Flat Skis Question

post #1 of 12
Thread Starter 

Currently I have a pair of Head Titan skis in 170 cm length - am I able to remove the plates that the existing Head bindings sit on and install Knee Bindings directly on the ski? I keep hearing and reading it has to be a "flat" ski, but if I remove the plate is not a "flat" ski at that point?

 

My kids are aggressive skiers as I am, and the thought of an ACL injury sort of freaks me out. Great forum by the way here guys!

post #2 of 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles J White View Post
 

Currently I have a pair of Head Titan skis in 170 cm length - am I able to remove the plates that the existing Head bindings sit on and install Knee Bindings directly on the ski? I keep hearing and reading it has to be a "flat" ski, but if I remove the plate is not a "flat" ski at that point?

 

My kids are aggressive skiers as I am, and the thought of an ACL injury sort of freaks me out. Great forum by the way here guys!


Welcome to Epic!

 

It's a good question. My wife's Dynastar Legend Exclusives came with a system binding; the binding and rails were removed and the ski redrilled for KBs. I assume you'd be no trouble, if the old plate's holes weren't too close to where the new binder would go. You can only drill so often.

 

For a definitive answer, though, you should go to a shop that sells and installs KB. Release testing must be a different thing with KB — and of course there's no knowing whether the lateral release setting is optimal. No TUV cert on that binding, you know. 

post #3 of 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by lakespapa View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles J White View Post
 

Currently I have a pair of Head Titan skis in 170 cm length - am I able to remove the plates that the existing Head bindings sit on and install Knee Bindings directly on the ski? I keep hearing and reading it has to be a "flat" ski, but if I remove the plate is not a "flat" ski at that point?

 

My kids are aggressive skiers as I am, and the thought of an ACL injury sort of freaks me out. Great forum by the way here guys!


Welcome to Epic!

 

It's a good question. My wife's Dynastar Legend Exclusives came with a system binding; the binding and rails were removed and the ski redrilled for KBs. I assume you'd be no trouble, if the old plate's holes weren't too close to where the new binder would go. You can only drill so often.

 

For a definitive answer, though, you should go to a shop that sells and installs KB. Release testing must be a different thing with KB — and of course there's no knowing whether the lateral release setting is optimal. No TUV cert on that binding, you know. 


If you remove the system binding it is a flat ski at that point. We did this for my wife's K2s. The release testing is the same as any other binding as there is no test for the lateral release.

 

You are good to go.

post #4 of 12

You can remove the plate which, as indicated above, will make it a flat ski.  However:  (1) Head's plate may allow the ski to flex more than the Knee Binding, in which case the ski may ski stiffer.  You can get more info. on this by calling both Head and Knee Binding.  (2) You may have  interference between the hole patterns of the Head plate and the Knee Binding.  You'll need to bring it into a shop and have them check this. It's pretty easy to do a quick check --- they just need to slide the Head bindings off (which exposes the screws in the plate) and overlay the jig for the Knee Binding, at the appropriate point, on top of the plate.

post #5 of 12
Thread Starter 

Well I'm going to give it a try and buy 4 sets, one for each of us in the family, I have been thinking about picking up a pair of BBR Salomon's so it should work on that as a test model i guess

post #6 of 12
Thread Starter 

Does anyone where I can pick up a good deal on Knee Bindings? Everywhere I look they seem to be the most expensive binding on the market...

post #7 of 12

Ebay has them for about $300.  I'll be hard to find much cheaper — maybe used somewhere.  Very small company, and far fewer units sold than other bindings.

post #8 of 12

Golf&Ski Warehouse has the Mist for $250, which has the same DIN range as the Carbon, w/o the carbon fibers (not sure if the carbon fibers make much difference; you could call KB and ask). It's pictured in white on their website, but the stock they have might be in a diff. color.  According to their site, they have 3 pairs left -- if you offer to buy all of them they might give you an additional discount (or get you some different brake widths if the 90 mm they have doesn't work).  Regarding brake width, you want to check your skis against KB's brake width chart to ensure 90 mm is the appropriate width.  Too narrow and they won't fit (though brakes can be bent out a bit); too wide and they're an entanglement hazard (so you should never go w/ overly-wide ski brakes; people have had v. bad falls this way).

 

The other difference with the Mist, I believe, is that its stock delta is 3 mm vs. 6 mm on the Carbon.  I personally prefer a flatter delta, not sure about you and your family.

 

http://www.golfskiwarehouse.com/kneebinding-mist-3-12-ski-bindings-i-2064707.html?gclid=CjwKEAjwmdu5BRCg1O3a-tDY0AQSJACKPgRKb5yIDqiG-bOSu9hAZ1z4aw5B-Wk54ZAFdH0ovU0z0xoCboXw_wcB

post #9 of 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles J White View Post
 

Does anyone where I can pick up a good deal on Knee Bindings? Everywhere I look they seem to be the most expensive binding on the market...


Keep in mind that if you buy the bindings online you will have to find a dealer that can mount them. If they are not a KB dealer they won't have the templates and will not be able to mount  and test them.

post #10 of 12
Thread Starter 

Well I have tried them, a few things - they have some heft, they seem like they are built like a tank (which is not a bad thing), I did have a release (2 in fact) on what I felt for certain in that moment was going to end my season (the sense of panic when I realized I could not save myself from the crash), but I walked away from it, without any sort of pain. I talked to another guy on my local mountain who told me he had the same sort of feeling when he crashed. We like to ski off-piste so I don't know if that contributes to it much.

 

The other question I have is racing:

 

Is there a way to modify a Knee Binding for racing on plates or would the high amount of force on the binding cause a pre-release?  

post #11 of 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles J White View Post
 

Well I have tried them, a few things - they have some heft, they seem like they are built like a tank (which is not a bad thing), I did have a release (2 in fact) on what I felt for certain in that moment was going to end my season (the sense of panic when I realized I could not save myself from the crash), but I walked away from it, without any sort of pain. I talked to another guy on my local mountain who told me he had the same sort of feeling when he crashed. We like to ski off-piste so I don't know if that contributes to it much.

 

The other question I have is racing:

 

Is there a way to modify a Knee Binding for racing on plates or would the high amount of force on the binding cause a pre-release?  


Their use in racing, or in any other kind of skiing where retention is crucial, has been a controversial subject, especially on Epic. Not sure what the elastic travel is on those bindings, for one thing.

 

Maybe @Whiteroom could enlighten us — seems as if he's had experience with KB (could be wrong).

post #12 of 12


​I do know that the owner has been trying to get racers on them, so he must have confidence in them on the course. The race plates are a problem. I would suggest contacting him and getting his input and suggestions. Let us know what you find out!

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