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Need to adjust old bindings for new boots 8mm shorter

post #1 of 6
Thread Starter 

Hi all,

 

I upgraded my boots after 15 years, and didn't realize that (1) shops won't touch really old bindings, and (2) the new shells are 8mm shorter. So now I have one sweet pair of powder/all mountain backside skis, but two pairs of perfectly good skis that I can't use--well, one good pair and a shitty pair of rock skis. Against the advice of Marker lawyers, the last time I skied on the bindings, they worked just fine, so I'm going to adjust them unless the dangers of worn out springs are serious--I think not.

 

Specs: Skis = Salomon Supermountain 185, c.2001-2. Bindings = Marker M9 racing (yeah, I know ... ski swap, FTW), c.1998-2001. Boots old =316, new=308

 

The problem is, I have absolutely no idea what I'm doing, not counting the three hours of internet research I just wasted. I can turn a screwdriver, but I don't know if 8mm puts me too far forward ... guessing I'll be okay on traditional skis--is that right? And can anyone elaborate on what I need to do to check the front--I saw some posts about that, but not much detail was given.

 

If I need to re-drill, are any of you aware of a useful tutorial for someone who has no binding mounting knowledge but has reasonable mechanical skills?

 

Thanks! John

post #2 of 6
Don't know much about that specific binding, but most heel pieces have some travel to them. Keep in mind 8mm is a lot and most bindings (unless they are system) won't be able to move that much in one direction. (Assuming they were mounted with the heel centered).

As for remounting, it's not the actual doing that's tough, it's having the proper tools and jig to do it properly. I leave that one to the pros especially given they can do release checks as well. I know the shops won't touch your old bindings however so you might be stuck.

Not sure how much guidance you'll get regarding remounting given most people tend to recommend having the pros do it (especially for somebody that has no experience in doing so). Sliding the heel piece and setting forward pressure isn't very tough however....just need to see if your bindings can travel enough.
post #3 of 6
Those bindings should have 8mm forward travel left, that's not a large amount. Those Markers had I probably around 2cm total heelpiece adjustment. Just move them up.....it's that lower screw. And don't worry about where the boot is positioned. The boot center will be only 4mm ahead of where they were before, which isn't very much. You may like the skis better that way. Try them and see.

IF there's not enough adjustment and the heelpieces do need to be moved, it's not difficult. I still have a few pr. of M9's mounted and they're still very good bindings. Don't worry about a shop not working on them. A jig isn't necessary for re-mounting, just measure carefully and then drill holes. Actually it's pretty easy. The toepieces will need to stay where they are.......holes require about 7mm between centerlines and drilling new holes only 4mm back won't work.
Edited by Utahski - 4/13/16 at 6:09pm
post #4 of 6

I'll add to Utahski's reply - go for it, or as TGR says: "Mount your own f'ing skis!"  As you say you're mechanically inclined, as long as you take your time and be methodical and precise, it's easy.  For anyone who's a quick, "well, that'll do" type, maybe a shop is in order...

 

Anyway, you asked about resources for this.  The best I've seen is over at TGR, in their tech talk forum - there is a long thread, stickied to the top, called "Binding Mount Paper Templates"  Post #77 has a step by step tutorial; it's what I used my first time doing a mount.  (Not sure if I'm allowed to link; I'll try but if mods need to delete, just go over there and you should find it easily.) Thread: http://www.tetongravity.com/forums/showthread.php/153971-Binding-Mount-Paper-Templates

Direst to tutorial post: http://www.tetongravity.com/forums/showthread.php/153971-Binding-Mount-Paper-Templates?p=2562026#post2562026

 

Overall tips / knowledge that may be helpful:

-Adult skis use either a 3.6mm drill bit for a wood core with no metal or carbon fiber or 4.1mm if metal or carbon in the ski.  You can buy special bits with a depth stop built in or buy a collar to put on a regular bit OR if you like living dangerously, there are plenty of success stories of people just marking the depth with tape on the bit (...of course there are also plenty of people who have drilled through a ski too).  A drill press will help keep holes vertical but it can be done without one.

-Skis with metal need to be tapped; wood cores do not need but it can be helpful (the screws are self tappers in wood).  The tap is a special size, I can't remember exactly but search on a place like slidewright's or tognar.

-I'd recommend practicing by mounting on a 2x4 first

-Since the TGR thread may not have a template for that binding, if you don't move the toe, you could freehand it by putting your boot in place on the ski tight against the toepiece, sliding the heel in place and marking the holes.

-a drop of wood glue or epoxy in the hole when putting it all together helps seal against water intrusion to the core.

 

edited to add - the screws look like phillips but are actually pozidrive, #3 I think.  A phillips driver will work but can slip out, stripping the screwheads.  If buying any tools, might be worth picking up a poz screwdriver.

 

Good luck!

post #5 of 6
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boogles View Post
 

Hi all,

 

I upgraded my boots after 15 years, and didn't realize that (1) shops won't touch really old bindings, and (2) the new shells are 8mm shorter. So now I have one sweet pair of powder/all mountain backside skis, but two pairs of perfectly good skis that I can't use--well, one good pair and a shitty pair of rock skis. Against the advice of Marker lawyers, the last time I skied on the bindings, they worked just fine, so I'm going to adjust them unless the dangers of worn out springs are serious--I think not.

Couple things here..  First of all most GOOD shops WILL mount your old bindings.  You just have to sign a waiver stating you accept responsibility and they will FAIL them on all visual inspection tests.

 

Second, the main problem with old bindings isn't so much the springs getting loose or initial function tests in a 70 degree room.  The problem is that the plastic housing around the springs degrades, gets brittle and fails suddenly and violently. The springs are fine, the plastic becomes too weak to hold them after about 10-15 years.

 

Here's what happens. 

 

 

 

I skied some old ones this season knowing that the above could happen at any given moment.  So, I took it easy and didn't push the envelope around any spots where a sudden failure would send me in to trees or rocks or other people...  Think of skiing old bindings like driving a car with 50 year old tires.  They may look just fine but they could BLOW at any moment and hope that doesn't happen heading around a mountain switchback at high speed..  If the housing around the heel springs is ALL METAL they may still be fine,  Beware of old plastic!

post #6 of 6
Old springs are also wildly erratic in their release values.

It's cute when folks say "I am mechanically capable" but they can't figure out how to do a Google search using basic key words. It took all off 20 seconds to find written articles and a youtube video explaining exactly how. If you fail at that, just step away from the screwdriver and buy a working piece of safety equipment, you do not have the DIN gene
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