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Atomic Redster Doubledeck Race Stock GS 183 Masters R=24m DEMO

post #1 of 19
Thread Starter 

Took a pair of these brand new Atomic Masters GS racing skis to a competition last weekend. Season is ending and courses are soft and ruts are deep but still the Atomic performed well. They were off the shelf demo skis and I had no time to tune them exactly the way I usually do. Still I took off some side wall to get the edges reasonably sharp and waxed with HF. The bindings were the X16.

 

I'm not really familiar with GS ski's specs but seems most GS skis nowadays are wider than the old GS skis and the current SL skis. This ski has a waist of 67,5. Gives the ski a rigid feel and nice platforming against the snow. I also have a big ski boot, size 29/332mm, so its wider than most other racers. The wider waist of the ski plays in my favour. I usually always raise the binding to 5mm over FIS legal to compensate for the wider boot. I'm not skiing FIS events so no problem with officials.

 

The side cut specs on the ski's are 105/67,5/89. The stiffness of this particular pair vas 38/39. Don't know what that means. A fellow competitor said it was much softer than his own read colour Atomic GS skis.

 

This ski is super smooth. It bends nicely into the turns and holds well against hard snow. It absorbs uneven snow surface well and has a very good edge grip. As with all GS racing skis it doesn't really start to turn before its tipped quite a lot. When freeskiing the turn radius grows rapidly if you don't manage to end the turns across the hill enough requiring no crowds and a wide pist. On the course they were easy to ski on and did not cause any sudden surprises other than turning much sharper than I was prepared for in my second run when the course was salted and the surface much smoother. I could have taken a straighter line.

 

All in all, a great ski. Trying to get to one more event this season to test them out. If I do I will keep you updated.

 

Note, this ski also comes in a shorter 176cm length with a slightly tighter radius at 21m.

 

T

post #2 of 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by tdk6 View Post
 

Took a pair of these brand new Atomic Masters GS racing skis to a competition last weekend. Season is ending and courses are soft and ruts are deep but still the Atomic performed well. They were off the shelf demo skis and I had no time to tune them exactly the way I usually do. Still I took off some side wall to get the edges reasonably sharp and waxed with HF. The bindings were the X16.

 

I'm not really familiar with GS ski's specs but seems most GS skis nowadays are wider than the old GS skis and the current SL skis. This ski has a waist of 67,5. Gives the ski a rigid feel and nice platforming against the snow. I also have a big ski boot, size 29/332mm, so its wider than most other racers. The wider waist of the ski plays in my favour. I usually always raise the binding to 5mm over FIS legal to compensate for the wider boot. I'm not skiing FIS events so no problem with officials.

 

The side cut specs on the ski's are 105/67,5/89. The stiffness of this particular pair vas 38/39. Don't know what that means. A fellow competitor said it was much softer than his own read colour Atomic GS skis.

 

This ski is super smooth. It bends nicely into the turns and holds well against hard snow. It absorbs uneven snow surface well and has a very good edge grip. As with all GS racing skis it doesn't really start to turn before its tipped quite a lot. When freeskiing the turn radius grows rapidly if you don't manage to end the turns across the hill enough requiring no crowds and a wide pist. On the course they were easy to ski on and did not cause any sudden surprises other than turning much sharper than I was prepared for in my second run when the course was salted and the surface much smoother. I could have taken a straighter line.

 

All in all, a great ski. Trying to get to one more event this season to test them out. If I do I will keep you updated.

 

Note, this ski also comes in a shorter 176cm length with a slightly tighter radius at 21m.

 

T


That flex number sounds very suspect.

 

I have 2 pair. A 2012 183 23M that is 47/37  and a 2014,  Redster 188 30.5 M  that are 45/35    38/39 would be 2X4 stiff.....No Brick stiff. The lower the number the less the ski bends when tested and the stiffer the ski is!

 

this is from Betaracer who is an Atomic Rep. at Whistler!

 

The higher the number, the softer the flex.

Typical flex ranges are;
GS 48/38 (soft) to 46/36 (firm)
SL 38/28 (soft) to 36/26 (firm)

North American bookings were for Med flex, with some Firmer skis thrown in.


Edited by Atomicman - 4/12/16 at 3:44pm
post #3 of 19
Thread Starter 

 

Thanks Atomicman. Here's a picture. What does the #13 stand for?

post #4 of 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by tdk6 View Post
 

 

Thanks Atomicman. Here's a picture. What does the #13 stand for?

No idea on the 13 and I am baffled on the Flex #'s

post #5 of 19
Thread Starter 

I have to check with our local rep.

post #6 of 19
A'man I have noticed on the 16 and 17 slaloms they seem to have gone stiffer based on the flex numbers
Edited by ScotsSkier - 4/13/16 at 1:13pm
post #7 of 19

His #'s are 15% stiffer than my 188's which are not exactly noodles!  (Tongue firmly plated in cheek!)

 

And I have to be honest with you the 183 23 M,the  47/37....ski is brick stiff!


Edited by Atomicman - 4/13/16 at 9:06pm
post #8 of 19
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atomicman View Post
 

His #'s are 15% stiffer than my 188's which are not exactly noodles!  (Tongue firmly plated in cheek!)

 

And I have to be honest with you the 183 23 M I have the is 47/37....ski brick stiff!

 

Maybe the full sandwich vertical sidewall construction changed the numbering?

post #9 of 19
Maybe they used different weights for the flex test.
post #10 of 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by tdk6 View Post
 

 

Maybe the full sandwich vertical sidewall construction changed the numbering?

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Atomicman View Post
 

His #'s are 15% stiffer than my 188's which are not exactly noodles!  (Tongue firmly plated in cheek!)

 

And I have to be honest with you the 183 23 M I have the is 47/37....ski brick stiff!

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tog View Post

Maybe they used different weights for the flex test.


Yes, I was wondering about these possibilities  I will try to remember to check the flex dos on a 188/30 sandwich construction.  A'man was right about the previous generation numbering

post #11 of 19
@ScotsSkier i take it you still prefer the current crop of 188/30m to older 27 m radius fis skis. What about a 183/30 compared to this type at 24m? Ever tried the Fis 183/30's?
post #12 of 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tog View Post

@ScotsSkier i take it you still prefer the current crop of 188/30m to older 27 m radius fis skis. What about a 183/30 compared to this type at 24m? Ever tried the Fis 183/30's?


Yes, I do. The 183/30s for the most part tend to be basically the same dimensions as the 188/30 but slightly stiffer.  Although I have a Blizzard WC in 183/30 (actually marked >35!), which was good enough to get me a 3rd place in a FIS international Masters race (Chile) I personally prefer my 188/30 pairs I have been racing on this season.

 

A couple of thoughts that I have been developing with now 2 seasons worth of experience on the 30m skis.

 

The flex pattern (and normally slight early rise on the tip) is what most distinguishes them from the previous 27m skis (and note also that the 27m generation were primarily designed around the FIS 190/191 size so the shorter lengths were not always optimal performance).  The flex enables a better ride and better contact with the snow.  They respond best to good technique by rolling them up onto a high edge and a high apex into the gate.  While you can still throw them sideways when you get late, they are faster with a proper line and high early pressure.    However where i think they offer some of the biggest opportunities in the course is as you come through the gate and start the move to the new ski.  As most of us know, all too often there is a lot of chatter/cut up areas below the gate from those who run late and apply all the pressure (and scrub speed) below the gate. The flex characteristics of the 30m skis are such that they ride this cr*p better than most of the stiffer 27m skis, allowing you to make an earlier move to the new ski without getting jolted about, delaying the move.

 

WRT the different brands there is really very little between them.  I would happily race on any of them. (and have raced on 3 different brands this year :) )   All have slightly different characteristics but  these are minor related to the genre.    Ignore the radius, the flex is key. 

 

And, typically the 188/30 is my daily driver when on a GS ski, in fact even as snow has got softer over the last couple of weeks i have been using one as my reference ski while doing some boot evaluation/re-evaluation given that I can not source another pair of my favorite Atomic RT TI/STI.    


Edited by ScotsSkier - 4/13/16 at 2:26pm
post #13 of 19

What year is your Atomic Rt ti/sti? That's the plug?

You could try PJ at www.racestocksports.com

post #14 of 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by tdk6 View Post
 

 

Maybe the full sandwich vertical sidewall construction changed the numbering?

They are full sandwich under the cap. I can't imagine the sidewall makes em that much stiffer longitudinally. I think the main advantage of vertical side wall is more direct transmission of skier input to the edge.

post #15 of 19

And ease to change layups and build when warranted in the manufacturing process.

post #16 of 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by hbear View Post
 

And ease to change layups and build when warranted in the manufacturing process.

I am not sure it makes any difference whether it is a cap or topsheet in reference to that.  The fact that it is sandwich construction underneath allows the adaptability. 

 

Cap is probably cheaper and less labor intensive . 

post #17 of 19

Cap is actually more costly because of the tooling process/requirements on a per ski basis for race skis.  There is a sizable capital outlay and you are stuck with that mold and have to retool if you wish to create a slightly different profile/shape.  Normal sidewall construction doesn't have the same requirements (no cap mold) so OEMs can tweak at will without increased costs (good when building race skis).

 

The price of cap (per ski) comes down when mass producing (cost of tooling averaged out over large numbers of skis) which makes sense for lower end or rental skis.  

post #18 of 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by tdk6 View Post
 

Took a pair of these brand new Atomic Masters GS racing skis to a competition last weekend. Season is ending and courses are soft and ruts are deep but still the Atomic performed well. They were off the shelf demo skis and I had no time to tune them exactly the way I usually do. Still I took off some side wall to get the edges reasonably sharp and waxed with HF. The bindings were the X16.

 

I'm not really familiar with GS ski's specs but seems most GS skis nowadays are wider than the old GS skis and the current SL skis. This ski has a waist of 67,5. Gives the ski a rigid feel and nice platforming against the snow. I also have a big ski boot, size 29/332mm, so its wider than most other racers. The wider waist of the ski plays in my favour. I usually always raise the binding to 5mm over FIS legal to compensate for the wider boot. I'm not skiing FIS events so no problem with officials.

 

The side cut specs on the ski's are 105/67,5/89. The stiffness of this particular pair vas 38/39. Don't know what that means. A fellow competitor said it was much softer than his own read colour Atomic GS skis.

 

This ski is super smooth. It bends nicely into the turns and holds well against hard snow. It absorbs uneven snow surface well and has a very good edge grip. As with all GS racing skis it doesn't really start to turn before its tipped quite a lot. When freeskiing the turn radius grows rapidly if you don't manage to end the turns across the hill enough requiring no crowds and a wide pist. On the course they were easy to ski on and did not cause any sudden surprises other than turning much sharper than I was prepared for in my second run when the course was salted and the surface much smoother. I could have taken a straighter line.

 

All in all, a great ski. Trying to get to one more event this season to test them out. If I do I will keep you updated.

 

Note, this ski also comes in a shorter 176cm length with a slightly tighter radius at 21m.

 

T


This ski has been around for a while. They changed the plate to the D 3.0 plate last year, which is an improvement. I have 3 pairs and it's what I've been using since it became available. This spring, I may have a chance to test the new version, which has the vertical sidewalls, the Hirscher "Marker" plate, and the binding that goes with it. Watch this space for details...

 

:D

post #19 of 19

I remembered to check the numbers on some recent pairs today (all vertical sidewall stock skis)

 

2017 165 Redster slalom  33/25

 

2016 188 FIS Redster 42/32

 

2016 195 FIS Redster 35/30

 

As has been noted above these are significantly stiffer than previous generations.  The previous 188/30 redsters were  soft 48/38, medium 47/37, stiff 46/36

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