or Connect
EpicSki › The Barking Bear Forums › Ski Training and Pro Forums › Ski Instruction & Coaching › Racer struggling with powder
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Racer struggling with powder - Page 3

post #61 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by a98alvin View Post


I'm relatively short... 5'8"

160 cm all mountain skis are short skis for a 173 cm skier; especially to ski powder...

 

I suggest you try some fatter skis with rocker next season and you will see the difference...Don't need to go to a 180 cm 117 mm fat ski but just going for something like a shreditor 102 in 175 cm or around...

 

I'm not telling you that there is not some technical issues that could help you ski a short 78 mm ski in powder, but for sure, if you use the right tool, it will be lot easier and fun!

 

For technique, Ghost just nailed it the post before...

post #62 of 81

I coach u14's on a race team and this video is near to my heart. Here is the bounce technique I was mentioning in my previous post.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c2ScKSMGvtc

post #63 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by bttocs View Post
 

I coach u14's on a race team and this video is near to my heart. Here is the bounce technique I was mentioning in my previous post.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c2ScKSMGvtc


That's a whole lot of effort to compensate for using exactly the wrong gear for powder. Doubly so in deeper powder.. 

 

More appropriate gear allows stuff like 

 

 

 

post #64 of 81
Sorry if someone linked this earlier... I cant remember:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=YNUgPCcyYRE
post #65 of 81

There is no wrong gear just bad techniques. Like yours in the back seat.

post #66 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by mowmow View Post
 

There is no wrong gear just bad techniques. Like yours in the back seat.

 

 

 

Physics says there is wrong gear. Do you use your excellent technique on wood skis with wooden edges? Why not? Would you like to take my fat reverse/reverse skis for a spin on blue ice? Why not?

 

Getting in the backseat is certainly something I do too often. But how would you know? Those are two videos found randomly on the Internet that I happen to like because - well, they show some cool stuff, show presumably normal skiers,  and were not over-produced.

post #67 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by mowmow View Post

There is no wrong gear just bad techniques. Like yours in the back seat.

Nice troll! smile.gif. I think I'll do beer league next season on my powder skis! smile.gif
post #68 of 81

Yes, a powder ski is a great thing to have ................. WHEN YOU HAVE POWDER. If you ski in NE, powder skiing represents, on average, about 5 to 7% of one's total skiing with a 3% margin of error. Unless you are wealthy or a shop rat gear junky, you are probably not going to drop $1200 on powder boards and bindings. Most New Englanders probably ski on an all mountain ski. A second pair is most likely going to be a carver or race ski. A third pair is likely going to another race ski or bump ski. A powder ski in NE should probably come in at the fourth or fifth ski in one's list. That said, the average NE skier only skis with one or two pairs throughout a season.  Again, I absolutely agree that a powder ski is the best thing to have for powder and, in light of the above school of thought, renting a pair for the 3 to 5 days per season is probably the best option.

 

Although, due to successful marketing campaigns we are seeing a few more powder skis regardless of the mathematical logistics stated above. What this results in is that we see a lot of skiers skiing on ice, bumps and groomers on powder skis. This is a sad sight to see as it is a very poor option in terms of ability development. This is a significant aspect as skiing is a sport that is highly developmental in nature. Skiing with fat skis on groomers is the equivalent of riding a bicycle with training wheels. On the steeps, bumps and ice, more often than not, this will produce awkward movement patterns. These awkward and poorly derived movement patterns become ingrained to the point that can make it difficult to go back to a ski that requires much more balance, the result of which, can "developmentally" trap a skier on a ski that is only good for 5 to 7% of the terrain they will encounter.

 

On the other side of the coin or, the other side of the country, I believe that, on average, a powder ski would move up to the second slot in one's quiver. However, due to the above mentioned successful marketing and the ease of use of a fat rockered ski, for many out west, a powder ski is the only ski they will ski on throughout the season. This, again, is a detractor of the types of developmental opportunities only found on a skinny ski. 

 

This is only my personal opinion, the logistic rational of which, will not translate to those who love their powder skis and rather not delve into any details that would kill their buzz. Completely understandable.

post #69 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich666 View Post
 

Yes, a powder ski is a great thing to have ................. WHEN YOU HAVE POWDER. If you ski in NE, powder skiing represents, on average, about 5 to 7% of one's total skiing with a 3% margin of error. Unless you are wealthy or a shop rat gear junky, you are probably not going to drop $1200 on powder boards and bindings. Most New Englanders probably ski on an all mountain ski. A second pair is most likely going to be a carver or race ski. A third pair is likely going to another race ski or bump ski. A powder ski in NE should probably come in at the fourth or fifth ski in one's list. That said, the average NE skier only skis with one or two pairs throughout a season.  Again, I absolutely agree that a powder ski is the best thing to have for powder and, in light of the above school of thought, renting a pair for the 3 to 5 days per season is probably the best option.

 

Although, due to successful marketing campaigns we are seeing a few more powder skis regardless of the mathematical logistics stated above. What this results in is that we see a lot of skiers skiing on ice, bumps and groomers on powder skis. This is a sad sight to see as it is a very poor option in terms of ability development. This is a significant aspect as skiing is a sport that is highly developmental in nature. Skiing with fat skis on groomers is the equivalent of riding a bicycle with training wheels. On the steeps, bumps and ice, more often than not, this will produce awkward movement patterns. These awkward and poorly derived movement patterns become ingrained to the point that can make it difficult to go back to a ski that requires much more balance, the result of which, can "developmentally" trap a skier on a ski that is only good for 5 to 7% of the terrain they will encounter.

 

On the other side of the coin or, the other side of the country, I believe that, on average, a powder ski would move up to the second slot in one's quiver. However, due to the above mentioned successful marketing and the ease of use of a fat rockered ski, for many out west, a powder ski is the only ski they will ski on throughout the season. This, again, is a detractor of the types of developmental opportunities only found on a skinny ski. 

 

This is only my personal opinion, the logistic rational of which, will not translate to those who love their powder skis and rather not delve into any details that would kill their buzz. Completely understandable.

Or you just have to wait till I get rid of mine...;)

post #70 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich666 View Post
 

Yes, a powder ski is a great thing to have ................. WHEN YOU HAVE POWDER. If you ski in NE, powder skiing represents, on average, about 5 to 7% of one's total skiing with a 3% margin of error. Unless you are wealthy or a shop rat gear junky, you are probably not going to drop $1200 on powder boards and bindings. Most New Englanders probably ski on an all mountain ski. A second pair is most likely going to be a carver or race ski. A third pair is likely going to another race ski or bump ski. A powder ski in NE should probably come in at the fourth or fifth ski in one's list. That said, the average NE skier only skis with one or two pairs throughout a season.  Again, I absolutely agree that a powder ski is the best thing to have for powder and, in light of the above school of thought, renting a pair for the 3 to 5 days per season is probably the best option.

 

Although, due to successful marketing campaigns we are seeing a few more powder skis regardless of the mathematical logistics stated above. What this results in is that we see a lot of skiers skiing on ice, bumps and groomers on powder skis. This is a sad sight to see as it is a very poor option in terms of ability development. This is a significant aspect as skiing is a sport that is highly developmental in nature. Skiing with fat skis on groomers is the equivalent of riding a bicycle with training wheels. On the steeps, bumps and ice, more often than not, this will produce awkward movement patterns. These awkward and poorly derived movement patterns become ingrained to the point that can make it difficult to go back to a ski that requires much more balance, the result of which, can "developmentally" trap a skier on a ski that is only good for 5 to 7% of the terrain they will encounter.

 

On the other side of the coin or, the other side of the country, I believe that, on average, a powder ski would move up to the second slot in one's quiver. However, due to the above mentioned successful marketing and the ease of use of a fat rockered ski, for many out west, a powder ski is the only ski they will ski on throughout the season. This, again, is a detractor of the types of developmental opportunities only found on a skinny ski. 

 

This is only my personal opinion, the logistic rational of which, will not translate to those who love their powder skis and rather not delve into any details that would kill their buzz. Completely understandable.

Yes, most of my skiing is in NE and I currently have 2 pair of slalom skis.  They work fine for the little bit of powder we get.   However, if I were to spend significant time in powder country,   I'd be watching for some skiers whose skiing I really like in the POW and look at what they have on there feet.  Besides  looking around, I'd be getting some advice and trying out a few pair of skis.  YM

post #71 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by yogaman View Post
 

Yes, most of my skiing is in NE and I currently have 2 pair of slalom skis.  They work fine for the little bit of powder we get.   However, if I were to spend significant time in powder country,   I'd be watching for some skiers whose skiing I really like in the POW and look at what they have on there feet.  Besides  looking around, I'd be getting some advice and trying out a few pair of skis.  YM

 

As a matter of fact, whenever we do get a storm in NE, more often that not is is moist and heavy which makes a powder ski more crucial than the light and dry they get out West. I spent a big snow season working at Alta before powder skis existed. Every storm produced the light and dry that my skinny K2 KVC's ripped through like hot butter. I found it easy enough to ski that in my mind, today, fat skies still has an essence of "training wheels" to them. Back then, the steep and deep separated the men from the boys. Now it is a goddamn free for all for just about anyone. Makes me glad I tasted the real thing before it turned into pepsi. I guess it has its advantages if someone wants to ski with their grandfather or grandchildren. Can't complain too much about something that keeps the family together.

post #72 of 81

I ski mostly Tremblant, so I think we have less than 5 big storm by season... Still, I have a couple of fatter skis ranging from 104 to 117 mm ( I don't consider fat skis under 100 mm) and can't believe the fun I have with these skis in fresh snow! Yes, I don't use them a lot, so ounce you bought one, you can keep it for a long time versus my skinnier skis...

 

These skis also make me last all day while people ski for a couple of hours and then quite... And to go in the same direction as Rich, when snow is so light that it moves all around you. I could ski with almost anything but when we get our usual more dense snow, I then appreciate being on fatter skis...

post #73 of 81

I have skied for a long time and spent plenty of "out west" and Europe days in deep powder on skinny skis. It is much more challenging to do it old style. In the last five years I have been experimenting with all the new ski shapes, widths, and styles. I think it is fun to get on a wide ski. I do it whenever there is some soft snow on the mountain. (so in New England, not that often) You can do so many different things on a wide ski than you can't on a carving ski. It is almost like a different sport on a wide ski. I am a race coach, so I like to carve, but I find it fun to spend a day on a wide ski if the snow is soft. I am a little to old for butters and jibing, but I do amuse myself doing 360's on the fully rockered skis.  I find one or two wide skis covers it for NE, but I have double that number of skis for the frontside or all mountain. I do agree that wide skis have increased access to expert terrain without having to earn your stripes, so to speak.

 

Spring snow in NE is a great time to bring out the wide skis, also. I can float over all the slush on my powder skis, and since mine have some camber, they ski great all over the mountain. In my mind, that justifies the purchase of at least one pair for everyone. My wife has one pair of skis, 78mm wide underfoot. In spring snow, she struggles a bit. She is an intermediate skier and always slides her skis to turn. In the slush she has trouble. A wider ski would allow her to use the same smear style. Lessons would also help, but for some reason she doesn't seem interested. I should probably encourage her to give that approach a try.

post #74 of 81

go straight and flex your ankles

post #75 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by bttocs View Post
 

I have skied for a long time and spent plenty of "out west" and Europe days in deep powder on skinny skis. It is much more challenging to do it old style. In the last five years I have been experimenting with all the new ski shapes, widths, and styles. I think it is fun to get on a wide ski. I do it whenever there is some soft snow on the mountain. (so in New England, not that often) You can do so many different things on a wide ski than you can't on a carving ski. It is almost like a different sport on a wide ski. I am a race coach, so I like to carve, but I find it fun to spend a day on a wide ski if the snow is soft. I am a little to old for butters and jibing, but I do amuse myself doing 360's on the fully rockered skis.  I find one or two wide skis covers it for NE, but I have double that number of skis for the frontside or all mountain. I do agree that wide skis have increased access to expert terrain without having to earn your stripes, so to speak.

 

Spring snow in NE is a great time to bring out the wide skis, also. I can float over all the slush on my powder skis, and since mine have some camber, they ski great all over the mountain. In my mind, that justifies the purchase of at least one pair for everyone. My wife has one pair of skis, 78mm wide underfoot. In spring snow, she struggles a bit. She is an intermediate skier and always slides her skis to turn. In the slush she has trouble. A wider ski would allow her to use the same smear style. Lessons would also help, but for some reason she doesn't seem interested. I should probably encourage her to give that approach a try.

Exactly!

post #76 of 81

I totally agree that it's much harder to ski deep soft snow with narrow race skis then with wide skis, but honestly, I'm happy I don't need to anymore. It's so much more fun to ski with something that it's 100+mm underfoot then with FIS legal SL ski for example. Sure skiing powder with race SL skis did separate men from boys, but honestly I don't give a sh** about someone else and if he can be considered man or not. I did my share of skiing soft snow on race planks and it's not going to happen again... ever! :) I don't care what people think, but when it starts snowing, I put my race SL/GS skis to basement and take out powder skis... even if someone considers me being a pu**sy :) Main thing for me is, that I'm having fun, not what someone thinks about me ;)

post #77 of 81
Can we retitle this thread "How to Make Powder Skiing Boring: A Tutorial"?
post #78 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by NayBreak View Post

Can we retitle this thread "How to Make Powder Skiing Boring: A Tutorial"?

 

You don't jump into instructor threads much, do you? This one isn't quite as eye bleeding as some of them get. :D

 

They often deal with the (to paraphrase Elaine on Seinfeld) "the excruciating minutiae of skiing".

 

Good info, but can be all over the place in terms of detail and readability.

post #79 of 81

I just caught a newbie reading one of my posts after she accidently left her screen cam on. Poor girl just wanted to learn pizza and french fries.

 

images?q=tbn:ANd9GcR5Gtn98m3XkpcEg1rpzVQ7KJmNT_eYfquJtYyxMB7DEvULgP5ekA 

post #80 of 81

post #81 of 81

Its difficult but worth trying the advice given.

New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Ski Instruction & Coaching
EpicSki › The Barking Bear Forums › Ski Training and Pro Forums › Ski Instruction & Coaching › Racer struggling with powder