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How to ski Paradise and Goat

post #1 of 14
Thread Starter 
I am going to be skiing Stowe and Mad River Glen in about a month and would like to know a little bit more about the two trails and decide if I want to ski them (Paradise and Goat). I can traverse almost any trail as long as The trail is not an entire sheet of ice (Ice cliffs, Rock Cliffs, and moguls are all fine). I have been skiing Tremblant for my entire life and have skied every single double diamond there except dynamite (I will certainly be skiing dynamite when I go there on my Stowe and Mad River Glen trip). What should I expect from these trails and am I able to ski these trails?


Mod note: Thread moved to Resorts, Conditions & Travel.
post #2 of 14

I don't think we will be skiing either of those (or any other natural snow trails in the East) this year.

IIRC Goat is narrow with big bumps that make it hard to find a good line.  Paradise is more like a wide open glade with a frozen waterfall to cross.  The waterfall is pretty easy when there's a lot of snow, not so much when there's not.

 

BK

post #3 of 14

Skied both last year.  Each is a steep narrow bump run with some rocks even in a great snow year like last March.  Each has a choke point that is a bit harder than the rest of the trail.  Paradise is  widish in spots but also narrow in spots and at at least one point splits in 2 for a bit then comes back together.

 

A bunch of us will be up there in about a month.  Check out the NE Gathering thread in Epic Community forum and join us if your schedule meshes.

http://www.epicski.com/t/144149/2016-new-england-gathering-march-25th-to-the-28th

 

I have skied everything at Tremblant other than Dynamite as well.  I would say both Goat and Paradise are more technical and steeper than anything there other than Dynamite.  Dynamite is, I think, steeper, but also a lot wider.  I remember parts of Expo being really steep, but it is wide and groomed so a different animal altogether.

 

Agree with Bode Klammer though- doubt they will be open this season....we can only hope.

post #4 of 14
Goat comes in three sections. The upper third has an extreme left leaning fall line. Usually the only skiable section is a thin strip down the left side. Getting ejected usually means hitting a tree or a rock. In all the years I've skied Stowe, I've seen it worth skiing exactly once.

The middle section is pretty straightforward. Variable fall lines, a few rocks, the pitch eases off... Your main problem is large moguls.

The fun begins anew once you cross Midway trail. The lower third has a few ice ledges, large rocks that never get fully covered, and of course even more moguls.

Except for the top part, it's narrow, but not stupidly narrow. It's usually four or five moguls wide with a few choke points.

Goat is essentially top to bottom. You can get out at Midway, but that will just get you to National which is more moguls. Starr is much the same -- double fall line moguls, but without the large rocks. It's a little wider; basically a good test.

Paradise isn't really a trail so much as it is an area. There's a fairly wide open chute through the trees that makes up the main body of the run. It's pretty wild, unlike anything else I've seen in the East. It's much much shorter than Goat or Starr.

All that said, we'd need a miracle snow fall in March to get either one skiable.
post #5 of 14
Goat is one of the classic expert runs of New England. KevinF's description is spot on in my opinion. Steep, narrow, twisty, with lots of bumps.
post #6 of 14
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=M_xH1NLbm-E

...More like this on YouTube
post #7 of 14
Those are pretty typical conditions for the top section of Goat, even in a good snow year. But the trick is to pretend that section is only 5 feet wide and hug skiers left, staying off of the rocks and ice on the right. (Decidely NOT what the guy in the video did.)

The steepest part is in the middle of the second section, I think. At least it seems that way to me.
post #8 of 14

The steepest part is the bottom of the upper section, if you come in from the Hay Chute it's "just a trail".

post #9 of 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by Whiteroom View Post

The steepest part is the bottom of the upper section, if you come in from the Hay Chute it's "just a trail".
Hmmm. I have a mental picture of the spot where the slope changes, but I can't swear which section it is in.
Here is a picture of the top section... the good snow was pretty wide that year, actually.
IMGP0462.jpg

Lots more in the 2008 Phil's Bumpfest thread...
http://www.epicski.com/t/69205/tr-bump-phest-08#post_891564
post #10 of 14
Thread Starter 
Thank you everyone so much for this great information!!
post #11 of 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdf View Post


Hmmm. I have a mental picture of the spot where the slope changes, but I can't swear which section it is in.
Here is a picture of the top section... the good snow was pretty wide that year, actually.
IMGP0462.jpg

Lots more in the 2008 Phil's Bumpfest thread...
http://www.epicski.com/t/69205/tr-bump-phest-08#post_891564

 

I didn't remember you being there on the "let's try Goat for the last run of the day / season".  I remembered epic, Phil's tumble on 30 year old skis, Living Proof carrying my busted ski and me.

 

Regardless of who all was there it was a day that will long live in Epic memory.  Thumbs Up

post #12 of 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinF View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdf View Post


Hmmm. I have a mental picture of the spot where the slope changes, but I can't swear which section it is in.
Here is a picture of the top section... the good snow was pretty wide that year, actually.
IMGP0462.jpg

Lots more in the 2008 Phil's Bumpfest thread...
http://www.epicski.com/t/69205/tr-bump-phest-08#post_891564

 

I didn't remember you being there on the "let's try Goat for the last run of the day / season".  I remembered epic, Phil's tumble on 30 year old skis, Living Proof carrying my busted ski and me.

 

Regardless of who all was there it was a day that will long live in Epic memory.  Thumbs Up

I took the photos of Phil's tumble.

I'm pretty sure that was the first time I met you.

post #13 of 14

Ahhhh...the infamous last run of the season on Goat. I remember that day very well, my first mini-Epic event, hosted by Philpug. Phil's Philly Bumppheast! Really a dumb idea going down Goat at day's end, at least for me and Kevin. I remember getting passed by a whole crew of women on telemarks, and, about half a dozen young kids. Did about 20% of the run on my back. I carried Kevin's broken ski down the bottom several hundred feet of Stowe. Went right to the bar and had one delicious beer. Long ride home that night to Philly. 

 

But, it was a great day. Epic lead us on a poach of a pretty good bump run.

 

Did get to meet many Bears that day: KevinF, MDF, Paul Jones, Epic and Whiteroom

post #14 of 14

If Goat is open by the time you get to Stowe, the best way to ski it will most likely be with skis you don't care too much about. Rocks are ever present on Goat, and if the season keeps going as it is, Goat will be more rock than snow if it's open. 

 

For Paradise, here's a clip of the Epic gathering on Paradise a couple years ago. With considerably more snow than we have now. Excuse the poor resolution, this was shot with my old camera. 

 

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