or Connect
EpicSki › The Barking Bear Forums › On the Snow (Skiing Forums) › Ask the Boot Guys › Lange SX100 (too upright)
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Lange SX100 (too upright)

post #1 of 8
Thread Starter 

I'm not sure how much backstory to add, as I don't want to bore anyone.  I'll try to keep it short, but I am very willing to discuss any of this or get additional information/pictures/etc.

 

Almost exactly 2 years ago, I was in Salt Lake City, and my wife wanted new boots.  We went to Sports Den, and they helped me out, too.  My feet are different that most, it seems.  I have a wide toe area, a skinny heel, and larger than average calves.  It is always hard for me to find footwear (even shoes or hiking boots) that feel good.  I often find that my heel lifts out when I step or that my toes are cramped.

 

The guy that helped me immediately steered me toward the Lange SX100 boots.  In fact, I have never felt a boot that fit my foot so perfectly until then.  My recollection is that I did try on several others and there was one other that I remember fitting my foot shape, but it was quite a bit more money.  As I was not intending to buy new boots at all, a huge jump in price was not in the budget.

 

So, I left with new boots that fit like a dream.

 

And my skiing has suffered greatly ever since.

 

Unfortunately, it took me quite a while to understand that the boots played a role in my regression.  Prior to this, I was blissfully unaware that boots even had different angles or that a person might care about such things.

 

I recall having more difficulty than normal at the mountain the day after purchasing the new boots, and we left SLC the next morning.  I didn't think much of it at the time, as we really don't ski mountains of that caliber most of the season.  I could just be out of shape/practice.  We usually ski at Terry Peak (most weekends) in South Dakota (not known for its mountains of course).

 

The rest of that season and into the next season, my father-in-law helped me with my form.  I was a skier growing up, then I snowboarded for many years, and I somewhat recently got back into skiing most of the winter.  It became very clear that I was skiing "in the backseat" way too much.  The more I understood this, the more I could feel it myself.

 

We tried some spoilers.  They helped, but they also created problems for my calves (which already create some problems for my circulation).  We experimented with some shims under the ski boot.  That helped even more.

 

When we went back to Salt Lake City a year after the SX100 purchase, I skied with spoilers and shims one day.  Then, I went back to Sports Den to talk about the issue with the "experts."

 

I was basically (likely not in these words) told to "get better at skiing."  The guy there said that the SX100 boots were on trend in a movement to get more upright.  They were better for me.  I should learn to ski them better.  He put a small pad behind my calf to help me get slightly more forward.  I guess it's about a 1/8" thick squishy pad that he stuck to the back of my boot liner (instead of the spoiler I had taped in before). 

 

The next day I skied with my new micro spoiler and without any shims under my boot heel.  It was probably the worst day of skiing I've had on the mountain.  Yeah, it was still fun, but by the end of the day, I couldn't even ride down a easy groomer without huge muscle fatigue.

 

So, that was almost exactly a year ago, and I'm still confused.

 

I tried my liners in an old pair of boots.  The old boots have more forward angle, but they're sloppy and way too soft.  I like the stiffness of my SX100s.  Yesterday, I tried my brother-in-laws boots as an experiment just to see if I liked the lean better.  Not only was my toe in smashed agony (not enough toe box space), but I had my worst crash in a very long time.  They just felt insanely foreign to me, and I actually think they pushed my feet into a duck footed stance (because of how they scrunched up my toes).

 

My next thought is to put a plate under my bindings (only under the heel portion), but I would rather find a solution that moves with my boot, so I can change skis easily.

 

SO, WHAT DO I DO?  (P.S.  Did I fail at keeping this message short?)

post #2 of 8

have you had your ankle joint flexibility assessed? normally if someone is in a back seat position it is either technique related or because they are being tipped too far forward (the back seat position is a compensation for being out of balance towards the front) 

 

you mention your calf muscle and cutting off circulation, if the calf muscle is bigger than designed for a regular boot then that will push you forward which will cause some of the issues which you describe.  if the ankle joint motion is limited then this will further restrict your ability to get forward... your body may have changed in your years boarding which again could inhibit your stance.

 

i think you need to get this assessed by another fitter as the one you are working with appears to have run out of ideas (or has not told you his new ones yet).... sometimes it is the tools, but sometimes the workman needs adjustment too!  if you have restricted ankle joint flexion then this could be the root of the problems and with some stretching and a few boot adjustments it will all be good

 

hope that helps a bit

post #3 of 8
Thread Starter 

Thanks for the quick reply, Colin.

 

I think that it might not be easy for me to find professional help nearby, but I am willing to try to assess this.  Is there a good technique to assess my ankle flexibility?  My father-in-law is really becoming a student of everything skiing, and learning all this would be something he'd want to invest in, too.  In that way, I have help available to me, but it's not necessarily by anyone with experience with my exact problem.

 

If there's a way that him and I can assess my range of movement, I'd love to try to measure it and see what you think.

 

I also want to say that it's quite possible that the "backseat" comment is not from expertise.  That may be me using improper vocabulary.  What I mean with that is I feel like I can't get forward.  With my SX100 boots (no mods/experiments installed), if I'm stopped, I can get in a balanced position.  When I ski, I can maintain this position, UNTIL something happens.  If I hit some moguls, unexpected loose snow, icy crust, etc. and I get thrown back a bit, I can't get back to balance until I stop again.  It can be scary depending on the situation. 

 

With the pair of old boots I tried, there is so much slop and flex that, even though I don't always feel at balance, I can reset myself while skiing obstacles.  I feel like I can push and pull my ankles to change my angle and my balance.  However, I really dislike that my feet are moving around inside of the boot and that my movements aren't being translated to the skis themselves.

 

I've done a fair bit of research lately, and I've read a lot of things Bob Barnes has posted.  I can really identify with B3 in the following picture.  That's the position I feel like I get into when I start to have problems.  Maybe that's not what you'd refer to as "backseat."  Maybe I have multiple problems.

 

 

Note:  I am becoming more and more tuned into the effects of small experiments I try.  Everything up to this point suggests to me that I am not getting enough forward lean.  Boots with more forward lean help my balance (but have other negative effects on my foot etc.).  Shims between my boot and binding help me feel more in balance, but they aren't a real long-term solution.  Spoilers seem to help my balance but pose a circulation problem (and sound like they may reduce my flexibility).  I'm even somewhat open to trying new boots, but every boot I've tried up to this point has given me foot problems (heel lifting out of the boot, toe pain, etc.).

post #4 of 8

Could you measure your calf muscle circumference at the top of the liner for us---both legs please.

 

 

mike

post #5 of 8
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by miketsc View Post
 

Could you measure your calf muscle circumference at the top of the liner for us---both legs please.

 

 

mike

 

Right Calf: 14.25"

Left Calf: 14"

 

(and just to add some more data)

Height: 5' 9.5"

Weight: 165'

post #6 of 8
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flavor View Post
 

 

Right Calf: 14.25"

Left Calf: 14"

 

(and just to add some more data)

Height: 5' 9.5"

Weight: 165'

what size boots? (didn't see it listed above)

post #7 of 8
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by miketsc View Post
 

what size boots? (didn't see it listed above)


Shell: 296mm / 255

Liner: 25-25.5

 

I usually wear a shoe size 8.5 (US men).

post #8 of 8

I PM'd you.

 

mike


Edited by miketsc - 2/8/16 at 7:33pm
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Ask the Boot Guys
EpicSki › The Barking Bear Forums › On the Snow (Skiing Forums) › Ask the Boot Guys › Lange SX100 (too upright)