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need help - suggestions and questions about some intermediate skis

post #1 of 9
Thread Starter 

I been having trouble deciding which skis to purchase for my son. After tons of investigating and reading I had it down to a choice but never pulled the trigger because I want to make the best choice I can and perhaps I am over analyzing but I cant help that, its how my mind works lol.

 

About my son-

My son is 19 and is 6'2" @ 220 lbs. ( a big young man)

has skied plenty but has never been on anything but rentals.

Skiing east coast - PA, NY, and usually a trip to VT.

The few days a season we get to ski he (especially last year) he is skiing now parallel (not really carving per say) but controlling well enough and starting to come into his own ability wise on the blues and will also shall we say "venture" down milder blacks. . So its time imo to get him on an intermediate ski he can progress further with and also last him as he improves even more through the next level.

Looking for an all mountain piste bias ski fwiw

 

A ski more advanced than the rental and longer is of course going to probably cause some difficulty at first until he gets use to them. But imo its what must be done in order to keep advancing. Actually once I get him on new skis I will probably plan a one-on-one intermediate type lesson to help him learn better carving and general technique advancement skills.

 

One of my issues is due to my sons size and weight.  In general its usually suggested a skier being of extra size and weight get a ski a step up (ability wise) from where they are actually looking. The notion being that the extra size and weight of the skier will compensate for the extra flex stiffness and torsional stiffness in the ski. This also then brings metal into the picture (for some skis even at the intermediate level). But of course the more advanced the ski, the less forgiving the ski. I want to be in the ski considering his need to improve as well as considering his size and weight but also forgiving enough . So with his size its kind of a catch -22.

 

The rossi experience 80 was gong to be the choice. The 77 was my initial thought but due to his size/weight decided 80 would better suit the objective here and also last him at least a few years as he improves even further. That ski has no metal but is a wood ski. Its known to be a light ski and has side wall underfoot with cap tip&tail. Sounds forgiving enough but still suppose to be an upper intermediate to advanced ski.

 

Then we have the salomon xdrive 78 or 80. The 78 is composite core and also hybrid side wall. The 80 (which has different models) is composit but with single layer metal while the 80 ti is wood with double layer metal.   

 

The head rev 78 or 80. this is a starnge leap here between the two. 78 is composit with fiberglass and full sidewall. The 80 is wood with double layer metal. This is like a jump from low/intermediate and then the 80 being high/intermediate through advanced. Almost like there need to be something in between. The only difference between the 75 and 78 is the full side wall, yet the 80 takes on wood and also goes double metal. Where is the in betweener? The composit 78 may allow him to out grow (ability wise) it too fast especially at his size. But the 80 would seem too difficult a ski for him.

 

There are others as well but you get the gist here. I desire a ski forgiving enough for him yet one he can advance while leaving room for some more further improvement. Of course his size and weight play its role here too.

 

Composit, compsoit with metal, wood, wood with metal, full or hybrid side wall? Its tough to figure for an in betweener and also a heavier/taller one. Too far in an advancing direction and the ski is too hard to handle, too little and at his size he too quickly out grows it.

Any thoughts or experiences with any the above skis? or any other thoughts for skis? or whatever thoughts you have for my situation in genral? perhaps i'm over analyizing the crap out of this. But its an investment and needs to last and work well for him.

 

 

 

 

.

post #2 of 9
I would go with double metal (and discard all the other ones more or less by default, although there are stiff skis non metal too), but hard to say, as its a personal preference in the end. Cant you get him to demo some skis? Some stores allow for the rental of higher end gear

Does he want ot progress fast or not? Are the boots sorted? How many days per year? You need to know this to see how much up-level you can buy the ski


Cheers
post #3 of 9
Hi rollin, I live in PA and ski the Poconos and some in VT and Maine. I'm 6'6" and 225 lb and was skiing the Experience 83 (no metal, basalt) in 184 for the last few years. I think the E80 may be too light as I felt like I have out skied the E83. I was on rentals before these and never ventured onto PA blacks, but with the E83 I was skiing these with confidence in the first year and then VT/ME blacks after that year. Lessons really helped here!

Same for the lower levels of the other skis you mentioned. I demoed the Fischer Motive 86 (metal) and E88 (no metal, basalt) at Elk last year and liked them more than the Salomon (it may have been >80) and several others that made even less impression, but that's just me. Perhaps the Motive 80 or E84? If others could chime in that would be best. Do you live near Elk Mtn? They have a nice demo day in early Jan. Check their calendar once they open.

I've seen your posts in other threads, so I assume you've got the rest (boots, etc.) already sorted out. After my experience, I'd say the high-end rental suggestion is a good one, but I was able to sell my skis for almost what I paid for them on discount, so all good in the end.biggrin.gif
post #4 of 9

We know that skis are made stiffer as they're made longer.  Your son will be well served by a top-line ski one size (stiffness) less than what he'd want as a very good skier.  I'd look at less than 80 mm width, although that isn't too much.  The expert 6'2" 220# skier would be on the longest ski in each line.  Get your boy one length less, and he should be good for a few more years.  The Head Rev line has been replaced, so there should be some good pricing.

post #5 of 9
Thread Starter 
Thanks all, and try to respond to all in one post lol.
My sons advancements don't have to be fast and considering the minimal ski days we get to go probably wont exactly fly through this change. But hey, ya just never know. Just like when all of a sudden (out of the blue) one day he just started skiing so much better and from that point on , but the next advancing level on better skis may click too, but who knows when and/or how quickly???Any guess is as good as another.
new boots? not yet, but of course going to have that fit done.
Even though skking better, don't get me wrong he still needs decent forgiveness. And sure hes been down blacks but managing to get down vs skiing down are worlds apart. He has a ways to go.
usually on 170 and the one time I put him on 177 he struggled and lost some confidence. But that was also before he took a leap forward ability wise. So I plan on him skiing (manufacturer size depending) 177ish.
I am skiing blizz xpower 810ti and of course is wood/double metal full side wall and and tip rocker barely existing and imo anything similar would not be nearly forgiving enough for him. So I'm certainly thinking a level or two down from that. Only due to his weight and size I consider something with metal. The problem is that it normally is in skis of higher ability which are indeed less forgiving. Except in some cases like perhaps the xdrive80 with single metal but not wood. I dont know if the "non wood" is a way to go or not.
The rossi E80 is certainly considered an upper intermediate and even the 77 is considered to intermediate so I figured for his size  the 80 makes better sense. But still may be too soft a ski???
The motive is another I've searched as well which is a non metal option yet like the rossi 80 on the upper end of the intermediate spectrum. but just not really reading a whole lot of good responses on piste.
If my son was lighter I would probably pulled a trigger on something already. lol but once again it come down to having - between having enough forgiveness yet not being too soft for him at his size. hence a bit of a catch-22 lol. But again I do over analyze :)
post #6 of 9

You need to stop worrying about what the manufacturers say about who the ski is designed for, it is mostly false, except for race skis.  Have him demo some skis and he should definitely demo the Head Monster 83.  80-85mm underfoot should be a good width for him.

post #7 of 9
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtcyclist View Post
 

You need to stop worrying about what the manufacturers say about who the ski is designed for, it is mostly false, except for race skis.  Have him demo some skis and he should definitely demo the Head Monster 83.  80-85mm underfoot should be a good width for him.


I can here ya about the manufacturer suggested skil level thing. I read a ton of reviews from everywhere. Weed out the BS and collectively gain info. But fwiw demo is not practical for me for many reasons (and I don't wan to get into explaining why). But especially for him as he will struggle some being first day out and also being on longer and better skis than he is use to so imo he wont get much info from a demo. Even assuming conditions are average and he even gets to ski enough right size skis and models. Also 2015/16 models too much money so looking last year and even prior.


Edited by rollin - 12/19/15 at 3:17pm
post #8 of 9
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtcyclist View Post

You need to stop worrying about what the manufacturers say about who the ski is designed for, it is mostly false, except for race skis.  Have him demo some skis and he should definitely demo the Head Monster 83.  80-85mm underfoot should be a good width for him.
The head monster 83 is what i was thinking.
The line supernatural 92 would be a good choice too, if the 92mm waist width isn't a turnoff. I wish they made it in the 85 width like they did the Prophet series.
post #9 of 9
Thread Starter 

And so finally after collectively accumulating many hours of reading and searching over last couple months I pulled the trigger for him on the Experience 80 @176.  This should be quite a nice step up from his usual basic rentals (quite honestly most any of the skis mentioned would be also). Of course he'll now be in a longer and wider and also more capable ski vs rentals and this should offer him some new challenge while also offering good improvement for quite some time. The ex line is a lighter but wood core ski and should offer the forgiveness he still needs, yet very many reviews collectively state the ski engages very well and is stable enough even for mellow rides with advanced skiers. This imo should fit well for one looking to go from sliding to carving and gain much more technical skiing towards intermediate status even at his size and weight. If he was smaller and lighter I probably would have went with the 77 which is almost the same ski. So I think I am good with this choice for him, I hope, I think...lol

 

Last years model (which according to Rossi tech) is exactly the same except for graphics and so saved some bucks with that. Very few of these skis in that size are to be found at all. Actually had them 50bucks less a month ago but never pulled the trigger because of my over analyzing investigating and lost that deal. But still a good price and snatched it up before they too are gone. It seems other models I have had some interest in were a bit easier to find more of and perhaps that speaks something positive for this ski. In any case, thanks for your suggestions and thoughts. I feel confident this will work

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