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The Tool - Page 2

post #31 of 40

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich666 View Post
 

 

I agree that the materials themselves have been directed at making a lighter (Ghost), thinner (Zen) but but not very much at all when you make a direct comparison. The advances in material use was more significantly directed at making a that is absorbent of all small frequency vibrations while retaining or increase the snap to the overall ski. 

 

Making a ski with a softer longitudinal flex with more torsional rigidity primarily comes from not the materials but the construction design and more specifically how the materials are inlayed into the ski by proportion and direction.

 

I believe that lighter skis were more of a sales point than something that made a performance difference in anything other than mogul, powder and back country. For the Ice Coast, we like our skis heavy, damp and snappy.

 

Exhibit A: (Volkl explains it better than I can)

 

   RTM 84 UVO

Our 3D.RIDGE technology – now found in everything from the V-WERKS KATANA and BMT to the ultra-light VTA88 LITE touring ski, the RTM high-end models and 100EIGHT/90EIGHT – is quite probably the most extreme and effective construction technique that exists currently.

It has become a symbol of Völkl lightweight construction. The distinctive characteristic of this technology is a raised central ridge that sharply levels out toward the edge, both in front of and behind the binding. This reduces the inertial mass around the fulcrum to a minimum and significantly enhances the agility of the ski. At the same time, the center ridge allows for a precise dimensioning of the hardness distribution, which leads to an especially harmonious flex on the ski. Despite the weight savings, the 3D.RIDGE ensures that there is no compromise whatsoever in the ski‘s durability and elasticity.

 UVO dampens disruptive vibrations that constantly emerge as a result of varied terrain and uneven ground. The free-floating mass of the UVO follows the ski’s vibrations and counteracts them effectively. Because the greatest amplification of vibration occurs in the ski’s shovel, the UVO is positioned close to the ski’s tip for more effective minimization of the vibration phase. 3D dampening means that jolts and vibrations are handled from all directions (360°).

The result: the ski’s edge contacts the snow surface for a longer period and interruptions are minimized. The ski then holds edge grip more effectively. The ski does not lose any liveliness since the UVO technology has its own completely free-floating mass. This differs from previous systems, which were attached to the ski at a fixed point and thus functioned solely along the Z axis (along the direction of travel and ski’s length). Another even more important benefit of UVO technology is the fact that ski and binding can be produced in an even more lightweight version, which promotes greater performance and agility.

 

TIP & TAIL ROCKER:

WHAT IT IS:  A slight rocker bend in the tip and tail, complemented by traditional camber under foot.

WHAT IT DOES:  With a slight rocker in the tip and tail, combined with a classic camber profile under the foot, Völkl engineers have created the ideal blend for frontside carving. Easy, smooth turn entry and exit, with acceleration and rebound as well. The new Extended Tip/Tail Rocker features an elongated rocker profile beginning in front of the toe piece and ‘extending’ toward the tip. A prime example of all elements of ski design coming together, the extension of the rocker allows a stiffer tip flex and more open sidecut radius, promoting stability, turn initiation, and playfulness ALL AT ONCE.

post #32 of 40

Heavier skis provide turn characteristics of dampness and stability. For those skiers relying heavily on twisting movements to get the ski to do what they want such as a bump skier, a heavy ski won't be as good as a light one. For those skiers who carve all or most of their turns by using the sidecut with edge tipping, the weight is much less an issue. More importantly you have a more damp, stable and quiet ski for clean carving. Choosing materials across the board that do not cater to high frequency vibrations all tend to be heavy.  When making super light skis with backwards compensatory technology like the UVO, now you have two marketing features that are almost meaningless a they work to cancel each other out. Same thing as the Dynaster bulb from the 80's minus the viscous liquid.

post #33 of 40
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich666 View Post
 

Heavier skis provide turn characteristics of dampness and stability. For those skiers relying heavily on twisting movements to get the ski to do what they want such as a bump skier, a heavy ski won't be as good as a light one. For those skiers who carve all or most of their turns by using the sidecut with edge tipping, the weight is much less an issue. More importantly you have a more damp, stable and quiet ski for clean carving. Choosing materials across the board that do not cater to high frequency vibrations all tend to be heavy.  When making super light skis with backwards compensatory technology like the UVO, now you have two marketing features that are almost meaningless a they work to cancel each other out. Same thing as the Dynaster bulb from the 80's minus the viscous liquid.

You neglect one important aspect of lighter skis... lugging them around!  I used to ski very heavy damp high performance skis (which I loved)...as the years go by I hate lugging heavy skis across the parking lot and up onto the slopes.  I also have to frequently skate across flats to get where I'm going at the resort I teach at.  I went to a light ski/ binding combo for a few years.... when the snow gets lumpy all I feel is vibrations and deflecting tips (good snow and the skis are really nice).... my  bad knee has not been happy.  2 high level skiers I know and trust both told me the UVO seems to actually work based on their experience.  The 3D constuction removes core material which is why it lightens the ski...it doesn't make it super light... just lighter.  I held a code speedwall  and an rtm side by side and the rtm is noticeably lighter.

 

Since we're talking about the modern tool... one should not neglect the conversation about ski widths/lengths as well.  Same (or more) surface area in shorter lengths has allowed the modern ski to be stable at shorter lengths.  My first pair of beginner skis were 160cm.  Now I ski 160 (+/-) cm.  I was on 180cm at one point.  I'm not convinced that wider is better... at least at 90+ widths used as a daily driver.  The evidence of knee damage isn't definitive but food for thought for sure.....http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4541126/

post #34 of 40

The modern ski does not to be wide to be stable at speed.  Try any race or cheater race ski, and you will agree.

post #35 of 40
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghost View Post
 

The modern ski does not to be wide to be stable at speed.  Try any race or cheater race ski, and you will agree.

Correct.. my Stockli Laser Cross (I owned both the 68mm and 72mm width) was awesome.  My 160 was at least (if not more so) stable at speed as my old skinny180's. When shaped skis first came on the scene the increased surface area in relation to length was one of the big selling points for now we can go shorter.

post #36 of 40
Quote:
Originally Posted by EasternSkiBum View Post
 

You neglect one important aspect of lighter skis... lugging them around!  I used to ski very heavy damp high performance skis (which I loved)...as the years go by I hate lugging heavy skis across the parking lot and up onto the slopes.  I also have to frequently skate across flats to get where I'm going at the resort I teach at.  I went to a light ski/ binding combo for a few years.... when the snow gets lumpy all I feel is vibrations and deflecting tips (good snow and the skis are really nice).... my  bad knee has not been happy.  2 high level skiers I know and trust both told me the UVO seems to actually work based on their experience.  The 3D constuction removes core material which is why it lightens the ski...it doesn't make it super light... just lighter.  I held a code speedwall  and an rtm side by side and the rtm is noticeably lighter.

 

Since we're talking about the modern tool... one should not neglect the conversation about ski widths/lengths as well.  Same (or more) surface area in shorter lengths has allowed the modern ski to be stable at shorter lengths.  My first pair of beginner skis were 160cm.  Now I ski 160 (+/-) cm.  I was on 180cm at one point.  I'm not convinced that wider is better... at least at 90+ widths used as a daily driver.  The evidence of knee damage isn't definitive but food for thought for sure.....http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4541126/

 :) Funny. Let me ask you, though, if the barrel on your new tank doesn't fit in your garage, do you cut the barrel or do you extend the garage? Never cut the barrel so you always have a full blast!

post #37 of 40
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich666 View Post
 

 :) Funny. Let me ask you, though, if the barrel on your new tank doesn't fit in your garage, do you cut the barrel or do you extend the garage? Never cut the barrel so you always have a full blast!

There's 2 solutions to the problem... simplest is to park the tank on the street.... this saves the garage for storage of important stuff like ski equipment.  The better solution is to send the tank back and look for a new fangled model that satisfies both form and function.  Modern technology is making that a real possibility.

post #38 of 40
Quote:
Originally Posted by EasternSkiBum View Post
 

There's 2 solutions to the problem... simplest is to park the tank on the street.... this saves the garage for storage of important stuff like ski equipment.  The better solution is to send the tank back and look for a new fangled model that satisfies both form and function.  Modern technology is making that a real possibility.

 

Now your talking! 

 

post #39 of 40

But will it fit in your garage?

post #40 of 40
As soon as my scud missile launchers sell on Craig's List, I'll have the space. However, there'll always be space in the garage for the AK Launchers. Just maybe not in the cargo box because they are too long. Talk about a big "fire at will" sweet spot, though ...
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