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another base angle thread

post #1 of 16
Thread Starter 

does anyone just leave the base angle at 0 degrees after getting a stone grind (or buying new)?  i'm sure i've had new skis and just left them at 0.

 

seems kind of risky to grind away a bunch of metal to make them 0.5 or 1.0 degrees.  and shortens the overall life of the ski by doing so.

 

i'll do it if you guys say so (would be nice to know why 0.5 or 1.0 skis better than 0, actually).  what am i missing if i just leave them at 0?

 

thanks!

post #2 of 16
Your not shortening the life of the ski by putting a base bevel on it. You're making it respond the way you want it. Even if you want a 0 deg, it's unlikely the ski is flat and had that from the factory.

Edit: i see you're asking differently. Yes, people often get them ground flat and structured then bevel them themselves. So give 0 a try. Then you can go a little more. And a little more after that. If wanted.

Unless it's a race ski and says it hasn't been beveled, it has a base bevel on it from the factory. They can be all over the place and quite bad. Does grinding a new ski decrease the life? Well, how long do you want to wait to ski a decently tuned ski if that's what it needs?
Edited by Tog - 5/4/15 at 8:00pm
post #3 of 16

I've skied a 0 bevel for years on old straight skis (with no detune might I add).  It develops a very flat feel for the ski or else!!!! the skis will bite you hard.

 

Do I recommend it now, not so much so, 1 is a good starting point for about 95% of the skiers out there.  The rest well they know what they want and are willing to take the risk for the performance and will hand tune to their preference.

 

Personally I ski 0.5 and set my families skis at 1 (with one exception my nephew at 0.5), but it is something I am so used too.

 

Think of the base bevel as a forgiveness, just enough to no kill you, but not to much that you notice it.

post #4 of 16
Quote:
Originally Posted by JonD999 View Post
 

does anyone just leave the base angle at 0 degrees after getting a stone grind (or buying new)?  i'm sure i've had new skis and just left them at 0.

 

seems kind of risky to grind away a bunch of metal to make them 0.5 or 1.0 degrees.  and shortens the overall life of the ski by doing so.

 

i'll do it if you guys say so (would be nice to know why 0.5 or 1.0 skis better than 0, actually).  what am i missing if i just leave them at 0?

 

thanks!

Hey Jon, Please let us know how that -0- base bevel works out! :popcorn:D 

post #5 of 16
Hi JonD999,

I regularly only polish the base edge after a grind, but few like it and it is seldom recommended. As @Tog says, hard to get perfectly flat anyway.

If you have them flat, then might as well try them that way and then you'll know. You can always increase the bevel from there to suit your preference.

Here are some past illustrations by @Alpinord to help get past the fear of removing too much material ...and he can get you the tools you'll need biggrin.gif www.slidewright.com
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpinord View Post

I'm sure that a .045° difference in bevel angle won't affect my skiing (measuring 60mm x 1mm versus 57.3mm x 1mm). For those wishing for more precision, here are the relationships for various bevel angles:





HTH

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpinord View Post

Here's what the approximate lateral difference in knee movement is for the different base bevel angles (YMMV):


post #6 of 16

I find 0.5 works best for most applications, but 1 degree works better in bumps. 

However, since they are now at zero degrees, I agree with the above posters who say give it a try, then you'll know.

If you don't like the 0, you can easily go to 0.5, and to 1.0 from there, but you can't go back without either a long long bevel or a base grind.

post #7 of 16

If the reason you want to try 0 deg is because you are worried about running out of base edge, stop worrying. The only time the base edge should be set is after a ski is ground flat and structured, which is going to be once a year or less for most people. And if you do have your skis ground enough times to risk running out of edge you'll be running out of base at the same time.

post #8 of 16
Quote:
Originally Posted by oldgoat View Post
 

If the reason you want to try 0 deg is because you are worried about running out of base edge, stop worrying. The only time the base edge should be set is after a ski is ground flat and structured, which is going to be once a year or less for most people. And if you do have your skis ground enough times to risk running out of edge you'll be running out of base at the same time.

My wife would be so happy if I even gave it a thought about running out of edge, before I replaced a pair of ski's

post #9 of 16
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brad J View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by oldgoat View Post

 
If the reason you want to try 0 deg is because you are worried about running out of base edge, stop worrying. The only time the base edge should be set is after a ski is ground flat and structured, which is going to be once a year or less for most people. And if you do have your skis ground enough times to risk running out of edge you'll be running out of base at the same time.
My wife would be so happy if I even gave it a thought about running out of edge, before I replaced a pair of ski's

Well, for me it comes up when I buy a very used pair of skis cheap. Usually race skis from some kid.
post #10 of 16

Jon, years ago when zero was the standard, we had to dull the edges at the tip & tail to prevent hooking.  Modern skis perform much better with the base edge bevel and sharp all the way to the contact point of the edge (dull above the contact point so the ski doesn't catch on the side of a frozen rut).

 

As said above, putting a base edge bevel does not shorten the ski's life.  The only work done to the base edge between bottom grindings is to use a stone to take off a raised burr.  All sharpening is done on the side edges.

post #11 of 16
Thread Starter 

  thanks everyone.  I'm setting my skis to 0.5 base (and 3 side) after a recent stone grind with the FKS multi-tool.  

post #12 of 16
I'm assuming you mean set the bevels with the multi tool: http://www.fktools-us.com/Product-Details.asp?Part-Number=3100 and not a "stone grind" done with some multi tool? Wording is confusing.
post #13 of 16
Thread Starter 

yes, i had a simple stone grind (told them not to do any edge work).  then set/polished the base/side bevels with that tool.  worked well.  kind of fun.

 

as an aside, has anyone noticed the slight "give" from the plastic-backed DMT diamond stones in that tool when using for the side angle?  i might get a fixed side angle tool.  thx

post #14 of 16
Even some fixed angle guides have give, depending on how they are held. I'm sure most of us have been through a series of guides before we are happy. Also watch for the impact of different thicknesses of files in the guides. Good reason to have the stones all part of the same series. I think some of this is reduced with a good spring clamp rather than a holder.
post #15 of 16
That multi tool is hardly a precision tool.
This one right?
PAMGACHLIMMAJJKMt.jpg

If you have access to a good grinding shop, rare, it might make sense to have the shop do th base bevel and leave the side. The screw ups i've seen on edges from shops usually involved the side edge.
That doesn't include the screw ups on the base though- concave usually if there's a prob.
Also, you have to specify absolutely no detuning of tips and tails. Otherwise, for some places this is standard procedure. Places that do lots of race skis usually don't do such butchery but there's always that guy who does you a "favor".
post #16 of 16
Thread Starter 

good advice.  that is the tool.  works pretty good though i might shop for a fixed side bevel one.

 

the shop i went too gave me a good deal on the stone grind but said they weren't super precise on the edge angles so if i wanted them a certain way to do them myself.  which is what i wanted anyway. 

 

thanks all and happy tuning.  

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