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EpicSki › The Barking Bear Forums › On the Snow (Skiing Forums) › Ask the Boot Guys › Another boot board question specifically about the Salomon Xmax 130
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Another boot board question specifically about the Salomon Xmax 130

post #1 of 5
Thread Starter 



I am a certified boot fitter (Dark arts/Master and have worked with several of you) and have built some tools for some of you. In my own journey to learn more, I have a question about my fit on the Xmax 130.


The history, I have been skiing on the X3-RC, 130 CS and have been extremely happy with it. It's pretty much dialed in with Cuff alignment, Canting, Flattened boot board and 7 mm of toe lift.(I have the specifics if you need it)  However my question is regarding the boot boards and fit in the newer yellow X-Max 130. I have found that they are NOT flat. I have gone ahead and flattened them however I did ski them before I made this last modification and noticed something else that I wanted to run by the experienced boot fitters (I don't work in a shop so I only work on a few boots a year). One thing I noticed is that because the boot board was not flat, there was a little extra pressure under the little toe side of the foot, (both feet) making it seem hard to roll over to the LTE while doing some one legged skiing. I don't know if the flattening of the boot board will fix this but the fit feels better now. I'll have to wait until I get back on the snow to check the rest of this part.


HOWEVER my main question is because of the "deeper" heel pocket on this boot, I noticed a lot of extra pressure near where the Achilles reaches the heel. I guess you would say on top of the calcaneus. Almost like I am getting pinched there enough to cause some pain and tenderness, especially after a day of hard skiing. I don't think I'm moving much, otherwise I would probably have a blister but it's painful like someone was pinching and pressing down right there. 


Is this because of the deeper heel pocket and maybe the liner/shell is not quite fitting my foot right in that area? Should I consider lowering the boot board a little (grinding off the top) and/or removing some of the posting on the bottom of my foot bed to lower my heel in the pocket just a little. Except for building it back up with some plastic/filler or replacing the boot board, it's a one way trip to grind off the top to experiment with this. I guess another option might be to heat mold the liner (specifically in the heel area) and see if it opens up a little. This is why I tried skiing them about 8 days to see if they would pack out a little.

The other thing I was thinking is it might be because the boot is quite a bit softer than my X3-RC even though both are rated "130" and more upright, that maybe the geometry of the boot is allowing me to put more pressure on this spot as I flex forward.


Other info that may be pertinent..


I am almost hyper mobile in the ankles 23-24 degrees ROM using the 90-90-90 lift test. Average windlass test. I have custom footbeds using the blue top conformable foot bed and red posting,  I have longer than average TibFib for my height which puts my knee well in front of my toe piece of the binding when standing cuff neutral. This test done while standing in my Head skis (10mm of ramp delta and the reason I am using so much toe lift on my old boots) The boots are 25 shells and I wear a 9.5 street shoe. The Braddock tool puts me in a 27 (measured at 26.9mm and a 104mm width)   Even on my new boots I found I still needed about 3MM of toe lift to get my hip to sit just above my arch while standing cuff neutral and in my bindings. The shells have been heat molded to help with some bunion issues and to set the cuff alignment. No other work done on the liners (yet) other than installing boot heaters. I use Booster straps (heavy/race) run between the shell cuff and the liner tongue..

post #2 of 5

if you like all the angles in the boot you have and just want to change the fit of the boot, I would suggest grinding out a TINY bit near that spot and see if htat feels better,   if it does, do a but more.



Is it the same feeling with different liners?  (IE its not the liner that is pinching you?)

post #3 of 5
Thread Starter 

Good point which I thought about after I wrote the original post. I swapped liners with my old X3-RC and it feels a little different but still have some pressure. I don't know if it is a different location or not. I'll have to ski them to see. (I guess I could put down some carpet in the garage and stand on my skis and really flex forward to get the same pressure feel). I do know that the new X-Max has built up the padding in that area to give "better hold" for the heel.


I guess the best bet is to just flatten the boot board without making any other adjustments and try skiing them (I'll have to wait until next year at this point) I'll have to try skiing in both liners and maybe in my ZipFit liners and see how it changes.


As far as the geometry/Angles, I don't know for sure yet. I do know that the new boots still put me a little too far forward such that I tend to displace the tails of my skis because I'm overpowering the front of the ski. Symptom went away when I switched to my old boots.

post #4 of 5

I've always found it easier and faster to work on shells than liners and in general I've found more problems are caused by shells than liners.  I also find most things that really cause substantial pain get worse rather than better with time.


Flattening the boot board may help the problem but I doubt it will be substantial.  


No part of good boot fit or ski control requires tightness in the achilles area.  Grind the achilles channel in the shell wider and I think you'll find the problem will disappear instantly.



post #5 of 5
Thread Starter 

Thanks Lou,


The flattening of the boot board is to fix a strange feel of pressure under the outside (little toe edge) of my foot. Almost as if there were a seam running under my sock. Flattening the boot board fixed this.


Part of the question has to do with the newer design of the XMax shell compared to the X3-RC shell. (the deeper heel pocket) I went ahead and stuck my foot bed in my shell with some material under the footbed to simulate the liner thickness, without the liner to try to see if the shape of the shell might be where I'm getting pressure and it appears that maybe it's not the shell after all. (thanks everyone for being my sounding board) The shape of the heel pocket on the new boot seems to match the shape of my foot quite nicely. I think maybe I'll try putting in my zip fits tomorrow when I have time. Since it has gel flow, I can shape the heel area a little and see if I get relief from the pressure. It this does work, I'll plan on doing some shaping of the liner (heat and compression of the heel padding) and see how that works. While I'm sure cutting away some of the shell would probably work, My goal is to keep as much of the shell intact as possible for now. After about 8 days of skiing them, the sides became more comfortable (liner packing out a little bit) but not quite enough and a second targeted heating to stretch the bunion area has resulted in more comfort with very little else changing as far as fit.. Still snug but no longer painful in that area.

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EpicSki › The Barking Bear Forums › On the Snow (Skiing Forums) › Ask the Boot Guys › Another boot board question specifically about the Salomon Xmax 130