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Is Blizzard out of the WC? - Page 2

post #31 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by markojp View Post
 

 

 

Eye yeye eye.... feeling silly yet?

 

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by markojp View Post
 

 

 

Eye yeye eye.... feeling silly yet?

 

 


Sorry , I don't know your skiing (and may be you are a very good skier) however your previous  comments about a high end RD equipment were very very " intermediate"  ( and it is not about how to flex the B 2)

p.s. Out of the 3 boots that you show on this picture there is 1  that can make you a better skier (if  this is your goal of course)

post #32 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by Karlsson View Post
 


Pretty sure Nordica and Blizzard are the same ski to begin with. BUT, as explained many times in this forum top WC athletes have individually made skis, so in practice an Atomic (No 1 skier in men's and women's SL) athlete might have a ride which is actually closer to, say, a Rossi WC athlete than to his Atomic "stable mate", because the latter prefers a completely different dial in/flex/edges...

The top skiers in each discipline can win on pretty much any of the bigger brands. The exception might be Head, who doesn't seem to be able to make a proper SL ski (ok this season looked better than last) ;)


The  FIS general brand ranking ( I was reffering to in my previous post) includes skis and boots (and not skis alone) and Head is the undisputed leader in all categories ecxept for the slalom. Your observation that the top skiers in each discipline "can win on pretty much any of the bigger brands " is completely wrong and the best example in this direction is MIkaela Shiffrin herself  and her results from the beggining of the season when she used to ski with the new Atomic (that is trush in my opinion) and only after the coaches decided to return her to the old set her results (and her skiing) came back. Each athlete has a very individual (and kept in secret) set up for each competition, that can not be repeated (just like that)with another brand  so the results are very unlikely to be the same . (and the top racers know this very well)

post #33 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bogatyr View Post
 

 


Sorry , I don't know your skiing (and may be you are a very good skier) however your previous  comments about a high end RD equipment were very very " intermediate"  ( and it is not about how to flex the B 2)

p.s. Out of the 3 boots that you show on this picture there is 1  that can make you a better skier (if  this is your goal of course)

 

 

Indeed.  Seems your experience band is pretty narrow. Each boot in my picture serves an extremely different purpose. The white boots aren't likely to help my telemark skills much, nor will they do much good for ski touring. Personally, I wear the boot that fits/flexs the best for my size, weight, ability, and given mission: alpine, telemark, and AT. 

 

 

(to the rest of the peanut gallery, apologies for my ill humor... I'll knock it off and let the thread get back on the beer & popcorn track)



popcorn.gifbeercheer.gif
Edited by markojp - 4/10/15 at 6:09pm
post #34 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bogatyr View Post
 

best example in this direction is MIkaela Shiffrin herself  and her results from the beggining of the season when she used to ski with the new Atomic (that is trush in my opinion) and only after the coaches decided to return her to the old set her results (and her skiing) came back.

 

 

I think Shiffren changed more than just the skis after the start of the year.  I think she also changed her boot setup:according to observations by [mod note - post has been edited].

post #35 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by nflanagin View Post
 

I think Shiffren changed more than just the skis after the start of the year.  I think she also changed her boot setup:according to observations by [mod note - post has been edited].

 

What happened?

post #36 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by markojp View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bogatyr View Post
 

 


Sorry , I don't know your skiing (and may be you are a very good skier) however your previous  comments about a high end RD equipment were very very " intermediate"  ( and it is not about how to flex the B 2)

p.s. Out of the 3 boots that you show on this picture there is 1  that can make you a better skier (if  this is your goal of course)

 

 

Indeed.  Seems your experience band is pretty narrow. Each boot in my picture serves an extremely different purpose. The white boots aren't likely to help my telemark skills much, nor will they do much good for ski touring. Personally, I wear the boot that fits/flexs the best for my size, weight, ability, and given mission: alpine, telemark, and AT. 

 

 

(to the rest of the peanut gallery, apologies for my ill humor... I'll knock it off and let the thread get back on the beer & popcorn track)



popcorn.gifbeercheer.gif
Since you posted a picture of your boots, here is my collection -- each boot serves different purpose as well : the Raptor B2 is for fast piste skiing , the Raptor Oblivion - for trees , bumps, jumps and off piste, the Salomon X Max 130 - for a relaxed on and off piste skiing ( these are my "sleepers") The Aggressors are currently for sale, so I don't count them.
L
post #37 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by nflanagin View Post
 

I think Shiffren changed more than just the skis after the start of the year.  I think she also changed her boot setup:according to observations by [mod note - post has been edited].


Exactly what I meant - she returned to the old boots ( the old Atomic) and the setup from last year.

post #38 of 66

So lift served only then... 

post #39 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rise To The Top View Post
 

Nordica and Blizzard are not identical. I frequently get to try other equipment (thanks to a good relationship with my shop and reps), and the Nordica GS and slalom skis that I have been on are different. I find that the 35m Nordica GS boards have a smoother initiation and mid flex transition than the Blizzard skis do, but that is just me.


there are some minor differences in the GS but the slalom is the same (I have both)

 

and to those who have been repeating the old meme that Head can't make a slalom ski, i have some updates for you. The 2105 Head FIS slalom is an excellent ski.  I had to play about with the mount and ended uo 3/4' forward on it but finished up my race season on it instead of the Blizz/Nordi Slalom I was on for th rest of the season.  Oh and just for good measure also switched from the Volkl FIS W GS to the Blizzard FIS W GS mid season......:o

 

But as I have said here before, there is so little between all the top brands at the moment, I would happily race on any of them....

post #40 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by markojp View Post
 

So lift served only then... 


I ski Quebec and NE .....

post #41 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by ScotsSkier View Post
 


there are some minor differences in the GS but the slalom is the same (I have both)

 

and to those who have been repeating the old meme that Head can't make a slalom ski, i have some updates for you. The 2105 Head FIS slalom is an excellent ski.  I had to play about with the mount and ended uo 3/4' forward on it but finished up my race season on it instead of the Blizz/Nordi Slalom I was on for th rest of the season.  Oh and just for good measure also switched from the Volkl FIS W GS to the Blizzard FIS W GS mid season......:o

 

But as I have said here before, there is so little between all the top brands at the moment, I would happily race on any of them....


Head slalom skis are perfect . For some reason however Head slalom boots and set ups were weak this season. For GS and and speed events hands down Head boots are no 1 .

post #42 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bogatyr View Post
 


Head slalom skis are perfect . For some reason however Head slalom boots and set ups were weak this season. For GS and and speed events hands down Head boots are no 1 .

 

 

 (yawm emoticon here).

post #43 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bogatyr View Post
 


I ski Quebec and NE .....

 

You're on post 24 now and digging deeper quickly. You should realize that the ski world is bigger than what you see from your perch, but somehow that's not appearing to be the case. 

post #44 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by markojp View Post
 

 

You're on post 24 now and digging deeper quickly. You should realize that the ski world is bigger than what you see from your perch, but somehow that's not appearing to be the case. 


This thread is in " Racing and Big Mountain competition " section of the forum and we discuss here some brands presented on the WC scene and this has absolutely nothing to do with my number of posts or the presence of not lift served areas around me or  how big your ski world is , etc.  I don't see any relation between one's opinion on a given subject and  his number of posts - 24 or 2424  this is not supposed to change anything whatsoever.

post #45 of 66
Better things to do than humor folks like yourself. Good luck there rockstar.
post #46 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bogatyr View Post


The  FIS general brand ranking ( I was reffering to in my previous post) includes skis and boots (and not skis alone) and Head is the undisputed leader in all categories ecxept for the slalom. Your observation that the top skiers in each discipline "can win on pretty much any of the bigger brands " is completely wrong and the best example in this direction is MIkaela Shiffrin herself  and her results from the beggining of the season when she used to ski with the new Atomic (that is trush in my opinion) and only after the coaches decided to return her to the old set her results (and her skiing) came back. Each athlete has a very individual (and kept in secret) set up for each competition, that can not be repeated (just like that)with another brand  so the results are very unlikely to be the same . (and the top racers know this very well)

You're totally wrong and underestimate the importance of the athlete (AND service team). We were talking brands and not set ups. Mikaela could probably win on ANY brand, but not on any set up. Except Head then ... (joke ...)
Also interesting that you use Shiffrin as an example. Of all the WC skiers she seems to be one who is more relaxed about equipment issues, she just skies. At least that is what she said herself in sn interview here in Sweden. But of course it happens that they come across a "magic" pair. And when they have a period of struggle, you can go back to them. That's what "our" skier Jessika did for Vail this year after a bad season with a lot of back problems and she took the bronze in gs.
Edited by Karlsson - 4/11/15 at 4:47am
post #47 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by markojp View Post

Better things to do than humor folks like yourself. Good luck there rockstar.


Good luck to you as well and have fun with the telemark and ski touring. ( this was a racing thread any way ...)

post #48 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by Karlsson View Post


You're totally wrong and underestimate the importance of the athlete (AND service team). We were talking brands and not set ups. Mikaela could probably win on ANY brand, but not on any set up. Except Head then ... (joke ...)
Also interesting that you use Shiffrin as an example. Of all the WC skiers she seems to be one who is more relaxed about equipment issues, she just skies. At least that is what she said herself in sn interview here in Sweden. But of course it happens that they come across a "magic" pair. And when they have a period of struggle, you can go back to them. That's what "our" skier Jessika did for Vail this year after a bad season with a lot of back problems and she took the bronze in gs.


I totally agree with you that a top level racer is supposed to be equally good with each of the major brands and I don't underestimate the importance of the athlete.However the reality is slightly different and another good example in my direction is Alexis Pinturault. After changing brands - his skiing (and results)changed.He finished the season 3rd in the overall ,he tries to stay on the top in 3 disciplines ( which is extremely difficult) and only the future will tell if this change (from Salomon to Head) was for good or for worse. One thing is for sure --  the change is there. Concerning Shiffrin  evrething I said was this -- she struggled with her new boots at the beginning of the season and only came back to her "standard" after returning to the old Atomic. However strong an athlete can be - the  equipment (and set up)  can either boost or ruin his performance .

post #49 of 66
...
post #50 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bogatyr View Post


I totally agree with you that a top level racer is supposed to be equally good with each of the major brands and I don't underestimate the importance of the athlete.However the reality is slightly different and another good example in my direction is Alexis Pinturault. After changing brands - his skiing (and results)changed.He finished the season 3rd in the overall ,he tries to stay on the top in 3 disciplines ( which is extremely difficult) and only the future will tell if this change (from Salomon to Head) was for good or for worse. One thing is for sure --  the change is there. Concerning Shiffrin  evrething I said was this -- she struggled with her new boots at the beginning of the season and only came back to her "standard" after returning to the old Atomic. However strong an athlete can be - the  equipment (and set up)  can either boost or ruin his performance .

You're stating the obvious. Off course equipment matters, but ski brands really do not on a WC-level. But obviously it has a great marketing effect since lots of people seem to believe Head makes the best skis because they're ranked #1 and say stupid things like "why bother with the other brands?"

Over and out
post #51 of 66

This is anedoctal and not really 100% fitting in this WC question but, in the valley (the resort is actually the Adamello Ski area) I go to ski since 2011, and have frequented since my teen age years and even before (one of the places for summer ski, many many years ago, now the "Glacier is gone" and "Summer skiing" is confined to May-June at most) the presence of the Voelkl brand has been dominant until...well unt8il 2011-2012.

Since then, Blizzard/Tecnica have completely wiped out that presence and are the dominant Brand I see on foot of Master racers and Juniors alike. Not to speak of the Freeskiing/Free-riding side.

Of course this has a lot to do with the on-mountain rep/ambassarod who's done an excellent work, still I wonder what kind of "blunder" Voelkl did hre in this valley. When I arrived "back", in 2011 instructors and racers wore Dalbello Scorpions and skied Voelkl. As said, since then trhings have completely changed (and might change again).

So, I do not believe that Blizzard will be pulled out of the WC, with that kind of investment in young skiers / racers...On the contrary it looks to me that they are gorinw the new breed of racers...

At the time I write, I am lusting after a women WC GS Blizzard 188 ski that the on the mountain main dealer has to sell (probably will remain unsold, too much of a ski for the normal users, what with the R=30mt). I am not a top notch skier but I've been used to buy that kind of skis in the past unsold (too high performanced skis for the general public to appreciate/correctly exploit to full satisfaction) because of the good deal. Then I used to "man up" and ski with the beast at the best of my capabilities. With age and fading health...came the decision to switch to a softer, gentler kind of ski (like the 178 Hot Rod I ski now)...but this deal, plus the increaed ski days stat an a little returning physical form, might put me on that track again.

If it will ever happen, it will definitely be on a Blizzard GS ski.

post #52 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by Karlsson View Post


You're stating the obvious. Off course equipment matters, but ski brands really do not on a WC-level. But obviously it has a great marketing effect since lots of people seem to believe Head makes the best skis because they're ranked #1 and say stupid things like "why bother with the other brands?"

Over and out


 FYI  (  for people that believe in " stupid things " ) . Blizzard is still there (somewhere....)

 

OverAll

Ladies

Rank Brand Points
1 Head 3465.00
2 Rossignol 1960.00
3 Stoeckli 1855.00
4 Atomic 1800.00
5 Voelkl 1065.00
6 Fischer 750.00
7 Dynastar 710.00
8 Salomon 445.00

Ladies and Men

Rank Brand Points
1 Head 7645.00
2 Atomic 4310.00
3 Rossignol 3595.00
4 Fischer 2330.00
5 Nordica 2095.00
6 Stoeckli 1855.00
7 Salomon 1650.00
8 Voelkl 1575.00
9 Dynastar 710.00
10 Blizzard 180.00

Men

Rank Brand Points
1 Head 4180.00
2 Atomic 2510.00
3 Nordica 2095.00
4 Rossignol 1635.00
5 Fischer 1580.00
6 Salomon 1205.00
7 Voelkl 510.00
8 Blizzard 180.00
post #53 of 66
Nobody, give the 188/30 a shot. Scotsskier raves about those. Flex is good. You could always sell them over here. Don't know about there.

Otherwise, dude stop with the Head stuff it's embarassing.
Edited by Tog - 4/11/15 at 3:30pm
post #54 of 66

I shouldn't but.....

 

 

Probably an accurate reflection of each company's budget. Head make a great product AND has very deep pockets.  In the US or Canada. Blizzard, Head, Nordica, Rossi* are highly visible at all levels of FIS racing. Ted, Julia, Lindsey, Bode, have won on every product they're skied on. One could argue Julia would be better off in  a Lange boot, but whatever. Head contracts the best athletes and gives them unparalled support. Pinauralt was arguably the best male up and comer when he signed with Head this year. I don't think the gear changed his trajectory a bit, but the funding sure will help. So who's the winner? Per dollar spent, Stockli. Best product? Don't know. It isn't really germane.

 

 

post #55 of 66
I heard there was some disguising going on with Hirscher's boots.
Remember Jonny Mosley who had his Langes painted orange in '98?
post #56 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tog View Post

I heard there was some disguising going on with Hirscher's boots.
Remember Jonny Mosley who had his Langes painted orange in '98?

Not to mention the binding set up. smile.gif
post #57 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tog View Post

Nobody, give the 188/30 a shot. Scotsskier raves about those. Flex is good. You could always sell them over here. Don't know about there.

Otherwise, dude stop with the Head stuff it's embarassing.

Nobody, go for it. The 188/30 is a great ski (especially in the blizzard! ). Everyone gets hung up on the radius but it is the flex that is the real key. There is a LOT of R&D that has gon into the se skis and it shows. They have a really nice flex and they turn in really well if you roll them up on edge like they should be skied. I have racedGS on them all season and, despite having kept my 23m skis from last season, never felt the need to go back to them. The bigger ski has also helped me improve my line in the course (and times) so I am a big fan. I have the Blizz WC gs 30m in both the 183 and 188. The Volkl is very close behond as well.
post #58 of 66
Has the 183/30? Does it have a good flex or is it not as optimized as the longer? I've heard that about the shorter men's 35 m. The 190/35.
post #59 of 66


It is good!  I have been racing on it.  To be honest quite hard to tell the difference.  i think the difference is more pronounced on the mens GS skis

post #60 of 66

Guys, I think you are missing the point of this thread. Blizzard sucks, and Head is the greatest thing to ever happen to the sport of skiing.

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