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Side edge for young racers - Page 2

post #31 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atomicman View Post

the bevelmeter is a little sketchy on certain skis when it comes to side edge bevel. If they have an aluminum or titanal layer that extends to the side edge and sits above the steel side edge, the magnetic does not stick to it and I get inaccurate readings. Ray, have you noticed this?

Yes, can drive you nuts at times!
post #32 of 54

Ok, now see, you start talking about this thing like I can't live without it and you've got me feeling like I'm being left out and I'm the only one going to the prom without a date.  I think I've got a little room on the shelf for another tool that sounded to good to be true and was. lol   How well does the SVST bevelmeter work for measuring base bevel???

 

Go easy on Ole Jacques, you start talking about modern technology and his eye starts twitching, his blood pressure goes up and he starts speaking in one of those foreign languages I can't understand.  You gotta remember, he still thinks the SnowGlide is a tool sent from the devil to steal your sole, when they're actually the greatest device since sliced bread.  So don't get him all jacked up or he'll down a couple Red Bulls and go postal. :D:D

post #33 of 54
The svst bevel meter is great for base bevel if the base is flat or concave and the tool can span the width. It is inaccurate when the ski is base high or concave and wider than the tool. Either way its a great tool, is fast and effective, but could really use some updating, especially given the price which goes up considerably every year.

You need to check many points along the edge, and you could get the same result with a trubar and feeler gauge, but slower and more awkward. You can also use a trubar and digital bevel meter, but also rather awkward. Ive seen preety accurate readings from a $10 protractor type bevel gauge also.

The magic marker and file guide is probably the least accurate of all the methods.
Edited by SmoothRides - 2/11/15 at 7:31am
post #34 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by epic View Post

Leave it at 3.


 

\

The standard for racing skis is .5 to.75 deg for the base and 3 deg for the sides.
post #35 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by tomfifield View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by epic View Post
 

Leave it at 3.

 

\

The standard for racing skis is .5 to.75 deg for the base and 3 deg for the sides.

No  .5 for Slalom

 

.5 to .75 for GS

 

1 degree for SG & DH

 

And let's not forget this is a 9 year Old............So  all of that is pretty much out the window. 1/2 or 1/3  is appropriate!

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by SmoothRides View Post

The svst bevel meter is great for base bevel if the base is flat or concave and the tool can span the width. It is inaccurate when the ski is base high or concave and wider than the tool. Either way its a great tool, is fast and effective, but could really use some updating, especially given the price which goes up considerably every year.

You need to check many points along the edge, and you could get the same result with a trubar and feeler gauge, but slower and more awkward. You can also use a trubar and digital bevel meter, but also rather awkward. Ive seen preety accurate readings from a $10 protractor type bevel gauge also.

The magic marker and file guide is probably the least accurate of all the methods.

The reality is with the SVST Bevelmeter is that you are generally only going to use it immediately after a base grind to set your initial base bevel angle when your skis should generally be flat! 

 

It is a great tool 

 

The price has never gone up. It is still $260.00 the same as when I bought mine years ago! Could be 8-10 years ago!

 

I have spoken with the designer of tool at SVST his recommendation is to measure the base bevel with the ski up on it's side base towards you.  There is something about how the tool hangs that allows it to read Base Bevel more accurately. 

 

It is excellent as SR has said for measuring base and side bevel on most skis.

 

I have found it is most important for base bevel. As long as you do not have side wall issues, You are not going to over or under bevel your side edges, unless you do something very very strange with your tools!

post #36 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by ScotsSkier View Post


Yes, can drive you nuts at times!

Exactly :D

post #37 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atomicman View Post
 

No  .5 for Slalom

 

.5 to .75 for GS

 

1 degree for SG & DH

 

And let's not forget this is a 9 year Old............So  all of that is pretty much out the window. 1/2 or 1/3  is appropriate!

 

The reality is with the SVST Bevelmeter is that you are generally only going to use it immediately after a base grind to set your initial base bevel angle when your skis should generally be flat! 

 

It is a great tool 

 

The price has never gone up. It is still $260.00 the same as when I bought mine years ago! Could be 8-10 years ago!

 

I have spoken with the designer of tool at SVST his recommendation is to measure the base bevel with the ski up on it's side base towards you.  There is something about how the tool hangs that allows it to read Base Bevel more accurately. 

 

It is excellent as SR has said for measuring base and side bevel on most skis.

 

I have found it is most important for base bevel. As long as you do not have side wall issues, You are not going to over or under bevel your side edges, unless you do something very very strange with your tools!

 

I'm not sure what retail is for the tool, however, the first one I bought wholesale was $225. Last year they were $250, currently wholesale is $265 which would put retail at $300 minimum.

 

 

As for the bevel meter needing to be hung on its side, if you recall we had a pretty detailed discussion about this very issue last summer, and it makes no difference.

If you need to recap see post #59 here http://www.epicski.com/t/128434/a-thanks-and-some-more-advice-wanted/30#post_1752905

 

Also, the most recent bevel meter I purchased included these directions, which instruct that base bevel be measured with the ski base up. I can't imagine doing it any other way when checking 5-10 points per edge, per ski with all the crouching that would be involved in order to read it if you were using the hanging method on a normal tuning bench.

 

post #38 of 54

yOU ARE GETTING SCREWED!!!!

 

They are $260.00 retail on Race-werks site which is the offical SVST retailier.

 

Same price they have been forever!

 

 

http://www.race-werks.com/svst-pro-bevel-meter/

 

 

post #39 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by SmoothRides View Post
 

 

I'm not sure what retail is for the tool, however, the first one I bought wholesale was $225. Last year they were $250, currently wholesale is $265 which would put retail at $300 minimum.

 

 

As for the bevel meter needing to be hung on its side, if you recall we had a pretty detailed discussion about this very issue last summer, and it makes no difference. I respectfully disagree AS DOES THE TOOLS DESIGNER!

If you need to recap see post #59 here http://www.epicski.com/t/128434/a-thanks-and-some-more-advice-wanted/30#post_1752905

 

Also, the most recent bevel meter I purchased included these directions, which instruct that base bevel be measured with the ski base up. I can't imagine doing it any other way when checking 5-10 points per edge, per ski with all the crouching that would be involved in order to read it if you were using the hanging method on a normal tuning bench.

 

I know what the damn instructions say. Dude, come on!!! I spoke directly with the designer of the tool by phone!!!!

post #40 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by SmoothRides View Post
 

 

I'm not sure what retail is for the tool, however, the first one I bought wholesale was $225. Last year they were $250, currently wholesale is $265 which would put retail at $300 minimum.

 

 

As for the bevel meter needing to be hung on its side, if you recall we had a pretty detailed discussion about this very issue last summer, and it makes no difference.

If you need to recap see post #59 here http://www.epicski.com/t/128434/a-thanks-and-some-more-advice-wanted/30#post_1752905

 

Also, the most recent bevel meter I purchased included these directions, which instruct that base bevel be measured with the ski base up. I can't imagine doing it any other way when checking 5-10 points per edge, per ski with all the crouching that would be involved in order to read it if you were using the hanging method on a normal tuning bench.

 

WHAT CROUCHING??? I CHECK IT NUMEROUS POINTS ALONG THE EDGE. 

 

Maybe the crouching will build up your wimpy quads! :ROTF

 

 

I am tired of arguing with you about every little point, do whatever you want, I could care less! :rolleyes 

post #41 of 54

Ok!  If you two can't learn to get along, I'm gonna have to put BOTH of you in a timeout!! :snowfight

post #42 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by MoJo23 View Post

What they claim and what there really are can, often, be two entirely different things.  Just setup a brand new set of Blizzard Cochise and the base edge was near zero in the shovel and a very healthy1 degree down the length of the ski.  The side edge bevel was pretty consistent the length of the ski but was only at 2 degrees.  

Prepped a pair a couple of weeks ago... They were quite base high through the shovel and forebody and would have skied terribly... I was pretty surprised, but then recalled what condtion my Bodascious arrived in 4 years back... Rumor was that the Blozzard factory didn't have the tooling to finish a 118 ski in the first year of production, so they were initially ground over here. Lots of machining marks, not much structure, hugely burred. I'm now firmly in the school of checking the bases very carefully before mounting. This season though, I've skied a few days on a pair of Nrgy 100's out of the wrapper except for wax and have had no issue... Structure isn't great, but I'll get to that this week.
post #43 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by MoJo23 View Post
 

Ok!  If you two can't learn to get along, I'm gonna have to put BOTH of you in a timeout!! :snowfight

:ROTF:o

post #44 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atomicman View Post
 

I know what the damn instructions say. Dude, come on!!! I spoke directly with the designer of the tool by phone!!!!

So he designed it to be hung when measuring base bevel, but decided to keep that information for only himself and other elite tuners like Atomicman, while telling the rest of the world to measure base up?? 

 

That sounds likely.

 

Either way, check any ski, any place, in any position, and I guarantee you will have the same reading no matter what unless YOU can't keep the tool steady. 

post #45 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atomicman View Post
 

WHAT CROUCHING??? I CHECK IT NUMEROUS POINTS ALONG THE EDGE. 

 

Maybe the crouching will build up your wimpy quads! :ROTF

 

 

I am tired of arguing with you about every little point, do whatever you want, I could care less! :rolleyes 

 

The point of not crouching is efficiency. When you have to tune 20-40 pairs a day, efficiency is an issue. 

post #46 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by SmoothRides View Post
 

So he designed it to be hung when measuring base bevel, but decided to keep that information for only himself and other elite tuners like Atomicman, while telling the rest of the world to measure base up?? 

 

That sounds likely.

 

Either way, check any ski, any place, in any position, and I guarantee you will have the same reading no matter what unless YOU can't keep the tool steady. 

:bs::bs::bs:    

 

Now I am going to Beast Mode you!

 

I am tired of arguing with you about every little point, do whatever you want, I could care less! :rolleyes 

I am tired of arguing with you about every little point, do whatever you want, I could care less! :rolleyes 

I am tired of arguing with you about every little point, do whatever you want, I could care less! :rolleyes 

I am tired of arguing with you about every little point, do whatever you want, I could care less! :rolleyes 

post #47 of 54
@SmoothRides & @Atomicman, get over it or get a room. Nobody cares about your thread hijack.
post #48 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atomicman View Post

 

I am tired of arguing with you about every little point, do whatever you want, I could care less! :rolleyes 

 

This is classic Atomicman, always willing to argue about every little point until you realize you're wrong, and then rather than try to learn something or concede your point, you resort to personal attacks and claim you're not willing to argue.

 

I'm here to discuss, not argue, the finer points of ski tuning, help people, and hopefully LEARN something. I don't post unless I think I actually have some useful information to convey, or I think I can learn from others in the thread. You prefer to post on just about everything no matter what. You have lots of good information, but often times you're incorrect, and you pass it off as fact with your smug, elitist attitude.

 

I was genuinely intrigued by the idea that the meter was more accurate when hanging than being used flat as I had never heard that or seen it done that way by any tuner ever, so I tried it out, and it makes no difference. Sorry this upsets you, but unfortunately for you there are people with loads more experience that are willing to call your BS.  :bs: 

post #49 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by SmoothRides View Post
 

 

This is classic Atomicman, always willing to argue about every little point until you realize you're wrong, and then rather than try to learn something or concede your point, you resort to personal attacks and claim you're not willing to argue.

 

I'm here to discuss, not argue, the finer points of ski tuning, help people, and hopefully LEARN something. I don't post unless I think I actually have some useful information to convey, or I think I can learn from others in the thread. You prefer to post on just about everything no matter what. You have lots of good information, but often times you're incorrect, and you pass it off as fact with your smug, elitist attitude.

 

I was genuinely intrigued by the idea that the meter was more accurate when hanging than being used flat as I had never heard that or seen it done that way by any tuner ever, so I tried it out, and it makes no difference. Sorry this upsets you, but unfortunately for you there are people with loads more experience that are willing to call your BS.  :bs: 

Wrong!!!!!!    WTF are you talking about.!!!

 

I SPOKE TO THE DESIGNER OF THE TOOL DIRECTLY ON THE TELEPHONE.

 

 HE TOLD ME HE FOUND IT TO BE MORE ACCURATE WHEN IT IS HUNG OFF THE SKI,  BASES TOWARD YOU SIDE EDGE UP!!!

 

I HAVE FOUND THIS TO BE TRUE!!!

 

So far you were wrong on the price., wrong on the price increasing now wrong on the facts! 

 

Are you saying I didn't speak with the designer and he didn't explain this to me and I am just making this up????  

 

You are truly looking foolish! 

 

 And one more time   I am tired of arguing with you about every little point, do whatever you want, I could care less! :rolleyes 

 

DONE!

post #50 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by litterbug View Post

@SmoothRides & @Atomicman, get over it or get a room. Nobody cares about your thread hijack.

 

Sorry Litterbug, I didn't see this post earlier, and I apologize that things got out of hand, and I'm sorry @powderhound24 for the thread jack.

post #51 of 54

Not to be the devil's advocate BUT there are times when you can learn things, even a lot, from a good debate.  So even though this thread took a bit of a turn south, it doesn't mean the last few posts weren't without merit.  Clearly, there is some amount of history with a few posters but as long as we all keep our big boy pants on and don't let things get out of control, a good dust up every now and then is ok.  So as long as nobody gets their eye poked out, it's all good....:duel:

post #52 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by MoJo23 View Post
 

Not to be the devil's advocate BUT there are times when you can learn things, even a lot, from a good debate.  So even though this thread took a bit of a turn south, it doesn't mean the last few posts weren't without merit.  Clearly, there is some amount of history with a few posters but as long as we all keep our big boy pants on and don't let things get out of control, a good dust up every now and then is ok.  So as long as nobody gets their eye poked out, it's all good....:duel:

Thumbs Up:beercheer:

post #53 of 54

That was fun!  :popcorn

post #54 of 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacques View Post
 

That was fun!  :popcorn

We aim to please!:D

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