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Question about deburring

post #1 of 10
Thread Starter 

Hey Guys:

 

I searched the forums and could not find an answer to my question.  When I tune my skis I go through the stones from medium, to fine to extra fine.  If the skis are in rough shape I use the coarse stone.  I file once to twice a year.  Always after using the stones I take a gummi stone and run it on a 45 degree angle along the edge to remove the burr.  I read somewhere that you are supposed to do that after using all your stones.  A friend of mine says that is wrong and you should never use the gummi stone like I am using, but I read if you do not do that the ski becomes grabby.  Who is correct? Should I ever run the gummi along the edge?

 

Claude

post #2 of 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigK75 View Post
 

Hey Guys:

 

I searched the forums and could not find an answer to my question.  When I tune my skis I go through the stones from medium, to fine to extra fine.  If the skis are in rough shape I use the coarse stone.  I file once to twice a year.  Always after using the stones I take a gummi stone and run it on a 45 degree angle along the edge to remove the burr.  I read somewhere that you are supposed to do that after using all your stones.  A friend of mine says that is wrong and you should never use the gummi stone like I am using, but I read if you do not do that the ski becomes grabby.  Who is correct? Should I ever run the gummi along the edge?

 

Claude

I use mine flat against the edge side then bottom. Running it flat against the base edge will remove the burr.  Running it at 45* will dull your ski depending on how much pressure you apply doing it.

post #3 of 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigK75 View Post

Always after using the stones I take a gummi stone and run it on a 45 degree angle along the edge to remove the burr.  I read somewhere that you are supposed to do that after using all your stones.

 

Diamond stones wielded by hand don't really make hanging burrs.   Files do.
 

Quote:

 

Quote:Originally Posted by BigK75 View Post

  Always after using the stones I take a gummi stone and run it on a 45 degree angle along the edge to remove the burr. 

 

What crgildart said - run the gummi flat.

post #4 of 10
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by cantunamunch View Post
 

 

Diamond stones wielded by hand don't really make hanging burrs.   Files do.
 

 

What crgildart said - run the gummi flat.


What about diamond stones in a guide like the Swix file guide (like the one below)? I just want to make sure I do everything by the book.  So basically I should not run the gummi unless I use the file and even when I run the gummi I should run it flat along the base edge.  Is that right?  Can you guys tell me how often I should be filing?  I try and keep it to one or twice per year. 

http://www.amazon.com/Swix-Side-Edge-File-Guide-Racing/dp/B005XCO4E8


Edited by BigK75 - 1/25/15 at 4:31am
post #5 of 10

I'd run teh gummi at a 45 if the ski felt too sharp. I might do it if I just filed, but not after using diamonds alone.

post #6 of 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by epic View Post
 

I'd run teh gummi at a 45 if the ski felt too sharp. I might do it if I just filed, but not after using diamonds alone.


Thumbs Up

OK if done VERY lightly, just the weight of the stone alone unless you are going for an old school detune of the tip and tail sections. 

post #7 of 10
Opinions vary, BigK75, what does “grabby” mean? The point to tuning I think is to have a sharp edge that holds and does not slip …which might be considered grabby! A dull edge won’t hold and slips …which might be considered as slippery and possibly the opposite of grabby? It could simply be the base bevel is too aggressive and the ski hooks up too quickly when moving into the new turn i.e. before the skier is ready. Basic guidleline is base bevel determines how quickly the edge engages and the side bevel determines the tenacity of the edge hold. If the case is too aggressive a base bevel, in my opinion the solution is to increase that bevel a (very, very, small) bit and maintain a sharp edge vs dulling the edge. Then again, it could be a hanging burr as you’ve touched on, don’t have those! It can also be the indian and not the arrow, some “styles” are not rewarded by a tuned ski…

Lots of good information in the forums here and everyone sorts out what is their best solution.

In general you set the geometry/angles with the file and sharpen with the stones. Diligent maintenance with your stones to keep the edges sharp will reduce the frequency you need to file. I would say return to the file when you need to change your geometry or reset it when the edge is too beat up. That said, some use files every tuning, and there are different files - very course to extremely fine. Difficult to say how many times per year as it is based on wear vs time.

I maintain my skis after every day of skiing with diamond stones and can evaluate if it is time to file as appropriate. Some feel this is excessive and then others consider it a badge of honor to never have any maintenance performed on their skis.

I do not subscribe to the 45* gummi as it seems pointless to put the effort into sharpening to then dull the edge you just worked to sharpen. A quick search of this forum will reveal the opinion of others telling you that last sentence is utter blasphemy.

Stones in a guide = hand tuning vs powered machines doing the work.

Experiment and come to your own conclusions!!
post #8 of 10

DO NOT USE A GUMMI STONE TO REMOVE THE HANGING BURR ON THE BASE EDGE CREATED FROM SHARPENING THE SIDE EDGE!!!!

 

#1. Gummi is not hard enough to remove the hanging burr!

 

#2. Because of the soft characteristics of gummis, it hangs over the edge point even when you think you have it flat against the base edge and will just dull your newly sharpened edges. 

 

#3. Use a true hard-stone, Arkansas, Ceramic, Surgical stone with medium pressure  to remove the hanging burr by placing stone flat against the base edge. ski, side edge up, bases away from you. 1/3 of stone above above 2/3 below edge, use your thumb as a guide on the sidewall. You can hear when the edge is clean!

 

#4.  All of the above is different from the final step of using a X-tra Hard Blue gummi with Absolutely NO PRESSURE at a 45 degree angle down the edge point in one ultra ultra light pass and you are done!! THIS WILL NOT AND DOES NOT DULL THE EDGE! ON THE CONTRARY IT REMOVES FINAL MICRO-BURR AND MAKES THE EDGE EXTREMELY SMOOTH AND SHARP!


Edited by Atomicman - 1/25/15 at 11:09am
post #9 of 10
can you use a diamond file to remove the hanging burr?
post #10 of 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by rod9301 View Post

can you use a diamond file to remove the hanging burr?

You can,  but it is not the best option. You don't really want a cutting a stone.  So if you were to use one, the finer the better, but an Arkansas stone or Surgical stone is CHEAP and THEY LAST FOREVER.  Diamonds on the other hand are spendy and have a finite life! Why would you want to wear out your $20-30 diamond stones?


Edited by Atomicman - 1/25/15 at 12:40pm
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