or Connect
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

To Rent a 4x4 or not.... - Page 2

post #31 of 47

FYI, I don't know if you have already made reservations someplace, but today I noticed that this place in Pagosa was advertising that they are 420 friendly.

 

http://www.firstinn.com/

post #32 of 47
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by crgildart View Post
 

 

 

Serious or infallible??

RAAAAT FARTS!!!!!

post #33 of 47
Thread Starter 

So we had to cut the trip short, no SLC this time, I just got a new job and cant take 2 weeks :(

 

We're going to rent a full size sedan and buy a set of snow cables just incase.  We plan on doing 3 days at Wolf Creek, dropping 1 buddy off at the Denver airport and then going to Winter Park, A-Basin or Loveland Thursday and Friday before we fly back to NYC at 11pm

 

Once again thanks for all of the help guys!!!

post #34 of 47
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by anachronism View Post
 

FYI, I don't know if you have already made reservations someplace, but today I noticed that this place in Pagosa was advertising that they are 420 friendly.

 

http://www.firstinn.com/


Dude, you f'n rock!!!

 

That place is cheap, 420 friendly, and has ski and stay deals.  If you're free during the week I gotta get you a beer, we're spoiled and only ski midweek

post #35 of 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kase-1 View Post


Dude, you f'n rock!!!

That place is cheap, 420 friendly, and has ski and stay deals.  If you're free during the week I gotta get you a beer, we're spoiled and only ski midweek

I won't be on the mountain- weekend warrior. I certainly hope you have fun- looks like there is a few inches in the forecast. It is not skiing terrible, but I'm used to better.

As far as tree skiing, the best trees on the mountain are skiers right of the Alberta chair. Be wary of the Numbered Chutes- because snowfall has been light and temps high, they cliff out a lot more than normal. If you don't want to air it out, and some don't really have landings, traverse away from anything too steep to see snow below. I'm not saying to skip this part of the mountain, but just be ginger around the cliff band. Above and below, open it up.

For good steep trees, go in Waterfall gate 5 off of Navajo Trail and go skiers right inside the gate. Skiers left leads to a gully that is nasty with the low base.

The Jaybird area is another good one. Head in waterfall gates 3 or 4, ski through the mild trees, and you will find a ropeline. Follow this ropeline to the right, and turn downhill where the rope ends. Warning- if you head into the gates in this ropeline, you hit the most technical terrain on the mountain. 50' booters, very tight gullied chutes, and the patch called 52* Trees, which is exactly what it sounds like. I was in that area last week and it was doable, but sketchy.

Go hike out to Dog Chutes. The trees under Step Bowl are pretty good but short.
post #36 of 47
One more thing. You can't go to Pagosa and miss Riff Raff brewery. The beer is great, and the food is ridivulous. The lamb and goat (cabrito) burgers are amazing, and the bbq chivken is one of the best I've had.

Breakfast burritos at Peak Deli are also very, very worth it.
post #37 of 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kase-1 View Post
 

  We plan on going to Wolf Creek, Solitude and Powder Mtn (in Utah). 

 

In three weeks Ms. D1 and I will be returning to Pow Mou for the third consecutive year. We stay at the Wolf Creek condos that are 5 miles down the road from the hill. But it may as well be in a different universe on a snowy day. The access road to the lodge is reported to be the steepest in Utah. While I have little other driving time in the state, I believe it. The grade is steep, twisty and repeat with double fall lines in the worst spots. I did the drive on 7 consecutive days the first year in a 2wd vehicle that was not at all up to the task. From my trip report:

 

 

 

 

I am no stranger to the dynamics of snow driving. Every day I drive 105 miles round trip from my home on the coast of Maine to my office in Bangor, notwithstanding snow nor rain nor heat nor gloom of night. But we got nothing that rates a DD for steepness. The descent from the lodge was white knuckle for about four miles. Worse yet, I encountered what we in Maine call “greasy” snow. I went as slow as I could. But in many places, the force of gravity would propel me forward even with locked brakes. The anti-lock function did not slow the vehicle down enough to maintain control. At 5 mph you have time to study the road. I read tire tracks like tea leaves. It all went rather well until I hit the dreaded S turn. It is, I suspect, the steepest part of the road. And it is banked, creating a double fall line. Even 5 mph was too fast but I could go no slower. It was a delicate dance. Tapping the brakes would cause the ass end of the Gutless to swing in a counter-clockwise rotation down the second fall line. Part of the turn became a “drift” competition – going forwards and sideways at the same time. I would drift, then let up on the brake and the ass end would swing back into line. I made it through that turn and another. The guy in the 4 wd Jeep Grand Cherokee ahead of me pulled over onto a very thin shoulder, either waiting for the plow or to change his pants, or both. The maneuver around him just added to the excitement. Eventually, with the drop in elevation, the road straightened and lost pitch. I became unpuckered. Before our trip, I read about this road. I knew it was steep and serpentine. And when I finally arrived at the condo, I went on the PM website and saw the “red” road designation which mandates snow tires and chains on 2 wd vehicles, with “no exceptions.” I had neither. It would have been a good day to take the shuttle.

 

----------------------------------------------------------------

 

So last year I rented a vehicle with 4wd and felt considerably more secure, especially with 4 wheel braking capacity. Rented one for this year as well and discovered that it is cheaper by hundreds to rent in SLC rather than at the airport where you get nailed with all sorts of taxes. I got a mid-size suv for $44 pd plus significantly fewer taxes than an airport deal. We get in very late to SLC so we will catch  a hotel shuttle into SLC and pick up the vehicle in town the next day, do our provisioning, and head to Eden. The vehicle can be dropped off at the airport on the way back, which is a great convenience. When I fly to Denver next time to ski, I will check out rental locations in the city rather than from the airport. Could be big savings as in Utah.

BTW, there is a shuttle from the condos at the bottom of the access road to the PM lodge. Well worth the $5 on a bad day.

If you are interested in my thoughts of PM, feel free to check out my trip report. 

Happy trails.

D1 

 

 

post #38 of 47

Good story D1.  I've been on that Powder Mtn road one day.  It was dry arriving and a little snowy departing.  It got my attention when departing:-)  

Sorry for thread hijack...down here in the mid-Atlantic/Southeast we have several "upside down" ski areas;  i. e. the day lodge, parking lot and lodging is at the summit of the mtn. Your Powder Mtn story illustrates why that design approach is not so good in a place like Utah or New Enland.  Upside down ski areas can be a scenic and feasible way to build a resort in milder climates, but makes for a hellish access road situation when a truly deep natural snowstorm blankets the region.  Many of us long time southern skiers have horror stories about driving to upside down ski areas in rare storm situations where we had to climb or descend 1000-2000 very steep vertical feet on what is normally a benign, dry pavement access road GONE BAD :-)  Blue Knob, PA is a prime example, others include Snowshoe, WV, Wintergreen, VA, and several of the NC areas.  The roads to these places have much longer and steeper climbs than Powder Mtn and very few of us Southerners are prepared for them with chains or snow tires and you can imagine how that has potential for insane snow snafus on rare occasions.  

 

To add a little value to my post for the OP:  try to buy your chains at a place that has a full money refund policy if you don't use them, maybe Pep Boys in Denver?  Once you get into the mtns it may be harder to pick up a returnable set.  Also, maybe don't bother if forecast is for a clear week when you arrive.

post #39 of 47
post #40 of 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamesj View Post
 

Good story D1.  I've been on that Powder Mtn road one day.  It was dry arriving and a little snowy departing.  It got my attention when departing:-)  

Sorry for thread hijack...down here in the mid-Atlantic/Southeast we have several "upside down" ski areas;  i. e. the day lodge, parking lot and lodging is at the summit of the mtn. Your Powder Mtn story illustrates why that design approach is not so good in a place like Utah or New Enland.  Upside down ski areas can be a scenic and feasible way to build a resort in milder climates, but makes for a hellish access road situation when a truly deep natural snowstorm blankets the region.  Many of us long time southern skiers have horror stories about driving to upside down ski areas in rare storm situations where we had to climb or descend 1000-2000 very steep vertical feet on what is normally a benign, dry pavement access road GONE BAD :-)  Blue Knob, PA is a prime example, others include Snowshoe, WV, Wintergreen, VA, and several of the NC areas.  The roads to these places have much longer and steeper climbs than Powder Mtn and very few of us Southerners are prepared for them with chains or snow tires and you can imagine how that has potential for insane snow snafus on rare occasions.  

 

To add a little value to my post for the OP:  try to buy your chains at a place that has a full money refund policy if you don't use them, maybe Pep Boys in Denver?  Once you get into the mtns it may be harder to pick up a returnable set.  Also, maybe don't bother if forecast is for a clear week when you arrive.

There used to be an upside down area in the Sierra--Iron Mountain--with the base area located on Mormon-Emigrant Trail, just off State Route 88 (Carson Pass). Closed years ago. 

The main road in the Tahoe Donner subdivision of Truckee is so steep that it has to be closed occasionally during and after storms. While I would guess at least 90% of the residents have 4WD, no one has chains and the 4WD doesn't help you slow or stop on a steep downgrade.

And never buy or build a house in snow country where the driveway goes downhill from the street to the garage. (And why do architects continue to design houses where the roof sheds onto the deck, driveway, front door, etc.?)

post #41 of 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by deliberate1 View Post
 The descent from the lodge was white knuckle for about four miles. Worse yet, I encountered what we in Maine call “greasy” snow. I went as slow as I could. But in many places, the force of gravity would propel me forward even with locked brakes.

Reminds me of the time I decided to keep the rented chains as "extra weight for traction" on the floor of the back seat (RWD) instead of putting them on in the parking lot.  Snow was about a foot deep.  The decent was basically locked brakes until switch back, followed by 4 wheel drift around switch back - repeat.  I had given a lift down to someone, who probably hasn't hitch hiked down from the mountain since.:D 

post #42 of 47
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by anachronism View Post


I won't be on the mountain- weekend warrior. I certainly hope you have fun- looks like there is a few inches in the forecast. It is not skiing terrible, but I'm used to better.

As far as tree skiing, the best trees on the mountain are skiers right of the Alberta chair. Be wary of the Numbered Chutes- because snowfall has been light and temps high, they cliff out a lot more than normal. If you don't want to air it out, and some don't really have landings, traverse away from anything too steep to see snow below. I'm not saying to skip this part of the mountain, but just be ginger around the cliff band. Above and below, open it up.

For good steep trees, go in Waterfall gate 5 off of Navajo Trail and go skiers right inside the gate. Skiers left leads to a gully that is nasty with the low base.

The Jaybird area is another good one. Head in waterfall gates 3 or 4, ski through the mild trees, and you will find a ropeline. Follow this ropeline to the right, and turn downhill where the rope ends. Warning- if you head into the gates in this ropeline, you hit the most technical terrain on the mountain. 50' booters, very tight gullied chutes, and the patch called 52* Trees, which is exactly what it sounds like. I was in that area last week and it was doable, but sketchy.

Go hike out to Dog Chutes. The trees under Step Bowl are pretty good but short.


Dude, I cant thank you enough!!!

post #43 of 47
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by anachronism View Post

One more thing. You can't go to Pagosa and miss Riff Raff brewery. The beer is great, and the food is ridivulous. The lamb and goat (cabrito) burgers are amazing, and the bbq chivken is one of the best I've had.

Breakfast burritos at Peak Deli are also very, very worth it.


Im def going to try the Riff Raff brewery.  And how can you go wrong with a good breakfast burrito?!!?!

 

Oh BTW that facebook pic was great and right up our alley, LOL

post #44 of 47
I don't know how flexible you are with your schedule, but this weekend is starting to look pretty good for Wolf.  Joel (the opensnow guy) tends to be conservative.
 

 

I wouldn't worry about weekend crowds. It won't be midweek deserted, but you will get untracked lines for as long as you want to ski.  These sleeper storms are usually the best too- The only times it starts to feel more on the crowded side is when the forecast is pretty firm ten days in advance for a monster storm to hit down here.

 

In any case, it looks like you will have opportunity to ski some pow either here or in Utah. Don't waste it driving!

post #45 of 47

Sundance says, "Butch, I got to tell you something.  I can't swim" 

Butch " Hell the fall will kill you"

 

I wouldn't worry about 4WD or AWD, its being able to stop that is important. 

 

Drove from Salt Lake City airport to Jackson Hole and back about 10 times over the years  with front wheel drive cars equipped with a snow package.  The snow package just means they have better tires and a ski rack.  Went up and over Teton Pass in a few light snow storms.  No problem most of the time.  :eek 

 

The shuttle from Salt Lake City airport to Jackson Hole is a rear wheel drive van with a large crack in the windshield of course.

 

If you ski double diamonds at Jackson Hole your can rent and drive a 2WD no problem.  Besides where is your sense of adventure. I mean really how bad can it be. 

 

I strongly recommend buying extra windshield insurance if its available.  ;)

post #46 of 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by catskills View Post
 

I wouldn't worry about 4WD or AWD, its being able to stop that is important. 

 

It is also important to be able to quickly get out of the way of the semi truck that CAN'T stop and is about to smash in to you.

post #47 of 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by raspritz View Post
 

Wow! 18 posts in 18 hours.  I'm up in Frisco right now. Today you don't need a 4x4.  Tuesday if I hadn't had one I wouldn't even have gotten out of my garage.  I'd rent the 4x4.

 You wouldn't have been able to get out of a garage without 4wheel drive? How ever would that be possible? Do you work for Avis? Have you heard of a device called a shovel? 

 

Seriously you do not NEED a 4 wheel drive vehicle in rocky mountain ski country! If you plan accordingly and are even borderline intelligent you would never drive when you actually would NEED one. The times when you would crash or get stuck without a 4 wheel drive are times when you should actually be skiing or sitting in your condo or waiting stuck in the airport etc. I can not think in my 20+ years in ski country ever a time that a tourist would HAVE TO HAVE a 4 wheel drive vehicle. The plowing is pretty good out here, we do not freak out about a few feet of snow, we actually clear it off he roads, you will be fine. 

New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: General Skiing Discussion