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What to ask for when setting up a lesson [Greek Peak] - Page 2

post #31 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by BinghamtonEd View Post
 

 

Will do.  I'm a firm believer in giving feedback, positive or negative.  Too many people only open their mouths when they want to complain about the service.

 

On a related note, if I am happy with the instructor, does one tip them?  And if so, what's a normal amount?  The lesson has already been paid for ($80, which is after a $20 season pass holder discount).

 

http://www.epicski.com/t/131963/the-2015-tipping-your-instructor-thread

 

Short answer:  not mandatory, but they sure won't complain if you do.  :)

post #32 of 39

Tipping is not a city in China.

 

Tip if you have a good time.  Don't be cheap and it is good karma anyway.  A $10 tip will get bragged on in th  locker room and $20 is worth about 4 beers.    

post #33 of 39

The instructor gets very very little of that $80.00.  The pay rate may fall between $8.00-20.00 per hour.  So tip him/her if the lesson is good.

If you take a follow-up lesson and ask for this person by name, he/she may get a bit more from what you pay, but it won't be much more.  

At least that's been my experience.  Most instructors around here (east coast) get very little back in the way of pay from the mountain.  They do it for the love of doing it.

post #34 of 39

Quote:

How many L3s does it take to screw in a lightbulb?

IMHO, here is where the perception/misperception comes in...

There is a huge difference in interactions between a L3 instructor and his clients versus his "mentees". This is purely by observation of course and it's a generalisation. Yes, many L3s will strike a newby instructor (or even a L1, which basically just a cert for introductory) as being all that because they are your authority. The higher level teachers, if you will, feel that they have earned their spot to be there putting you under their wings. Often, what you're seeing is how they are as a person with their teaching hat on. Some are gentle and some are not quite so. Some are more tactful and some are not so. It's like being a parent to your kids. If one is a tough and hot temper parent, it's likely that your kids will not be babied growing up. There are many ways to raise a child correctly (and just as many or more otherwise). Also, some of that is just tough love. It's old school but it works. But, rest for sure with almost no exception, the L2/3 are there to teach you and to make you a better instructor and skier in general. Of course, some of them as just downright arrogant egotistic condescending ass-holes (I had one of those and I doubt my opinion on him will ever change). There is no better way to say it.

As far as how a L3 (or even L2 or above L3) acts around their clients, it's a completely different story. Two of the major requirements at that level are the ability to demo (at any skill level) and the ability to relate. To get the cert, the prospect must show that they can ski and think at the level they instruct. That is hard!!! Pat, that could be why your super duper racer friend failed. Take it back a notch by slowing down in the fast lane is one of the most difficult things in skiing. I am surrounded by expert skiers (sad to say, I'm not one myself), but very few will have what it takes to make L3 cert. The ability to ski at any level in any environment is what makes one an expert skier in my eyes.

post #35 of 39

Crap! I wrote a whole paragraph on my opinion on this. All gone.

Anyway, in short, to be on the safe side unless you have an inside track, go with at least a L2 if you can. You don't need a high level instructor to teach you at your level but a higher level instructor can relate to you and your skiing a lot more (as well as skiing at your level), hence it's a much better bang for the buck. Don't worry. Good high level instructors will not talk above you as a client. They only do that to their mentees (from observation of course). :)

post #36 of 39
Thread Starter 

I took my lesson Saturday and I was really pleased with how it turned out.

 

One thing I did learn was to ask for a specific instructor when setting up the lesson.  I had gotten some names after I had the lesson set up, but when I showed up at the Ski School desk to get my voucher, about an hour and a half before the lesson, it seemed that the guy at the desk had nothing to do with that, and it was already set up.  When I showed up to the meeting area, my instructor had picked me out, and we just got going.

 

We hopped on the short lift and he asked me for a summary of where my skiing was at and what I wanted to accomplish.  He said my description was probably the best one he's gotten as an instructor, and he'd been doing this for almost 30 years.  We did some initial wedge drills on the learner slope to work on the outside edge (and probably for him to see that I actually did know how to ski before he took me up), and discussed things like flexion, extension, and rotation.  He caught on that I knew the concepts and terminology, we did some turns to emphasize those, too.  We then took a lift to the top and did a green trail.  He took a video of me skiing a short length of turns, maybe the width of a cat track.  I was skidding my turns by rotating my heels out, wasn't on edge, wasn't flexing/extending, knees weren't doing much of anything.  We worked on some traverses to get the feeling of the outside ski being on edge and getting the knees to move into the turn.  Once I had that, we worked on distributing my weight properly to keep the inside ski on track as well.  Further down the hill we worked on some large radius, slow turns, also videoed.  The video showed some improvement, but their was very little angulation and we worked on that, and getting my body more separated at the waist.

 

Next run we skied a blue, and we did a drill that I forget what he called it.  I stood perpendicular to the fall line, on edge just to avoid side-slipping.  I would hop up, and turn my skis 180 degrees and land on the opposite edge, flexing as I landed and then extending to rebound into the next hop.  I did pretty well with those so we tried to see how many I could get in in a given distance.  Then we did some large radius turns across the blue, keeping on edge until I stopped uphill, then going back the other way.  The rest of the run was a nice easy blue with a good fall line, so we skied it fast with large radius carves and my goal was to keep up with him and follow his line.

 

Next run was a black diamond that's my favorite run on the hill.  Decent width, true fall line, nothing too hairy.  We did some medium radius drills on there, followed at the bottom with some free skiing down, which I used to try to do long-medium-short turns on edge.

 

I had a great time, I felt like the instructor did a great job analyzing what was keeping me from making better turns on edge, and was able to pick up on the amount of information that I needed to get it done.  If I end up taking a lesson again, I'd ask for him, and would recommend him.

 

 

I skied for another few hours after that, and I could really feel the difference in my turns.  As I skied more I could also feel myself tightening down the turn radius, and really maintaining the pressure on the skis to hold them there through the turns.

 


Thanks for all the help, guys.

 

 

 

P.S. Yes, I tipped him. ;)

post #37 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by BinghamtonEd View Post
 

I took my lesson Saturday and I was really pleased with how it turned out...

 

I had a great time, I felt like the instructor did a great job analyzing what was keeping me from making better turns on edge, and was able to pick up on the amount of information that I needed to get it done.  If I end up taking a lesson again, I'd ask for him, and would recommend him.

Glad to hear it worked out for you.  And yes, get the same guy next time. You won't have to go thru all the diagnostic stuff again and you should get even more out of your next lesson once you've digested this one. 

post #38 of 39

Looking for an instructor?   You might want to   watch instructors  ski and  teach.   As an instructor I ski with, listen to and clinic with instructors at all levels of experience and certification every day I ski.  I see  misunderstanding, poor skiing and poor teaching at all levels of experience and certification.   As a student of skiing myself,  I have always had my vision of the kind of skiing I wanted to master.   Therefore when I was looking for my own training I chose very carefully the instructors or coaches I chose to listen to and the methods of training I thought would get me where I wanted to get to.  Just today I listened to a friend complain about instruction at my mountain, for her children,  through a school outreach program.   Too much talk and not enough action.  Ask instructors who they think is good.   Once you find someone who you connect with and think can get YOU where you want to go, stick with that instructor.   Use that instructor regularly and create a plan for improvement.  Practice fundamentals regularly.   Most skiers approach improvement very haphazardly.   If you are serious about improvement, create a plan.  YM

post #39 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by yogaman View Post
 

  As an instructor I ski with, listen to and clinic with instructors at all levels of experience and certification every day I ski.  I see  misunderstanding, poor skiing and poor teaching at all levels of experience and certification.   

Ain't that the truth. 

 

When you get into certification levels, particularly L3's the skiing is usually pretty solid. It' usually the understanding that is often missing, particularly in those newly minted at their certification level. And I find it quite interesting that those I see who are the most naturally gifted skiers are often the ones who understand the least as they didn't have to struggle and suffer and figure stuff out.  

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