Originally Posted by markojp
Just tossing this one out there... maybe I missed it somewhere in the thread, but with all the 'technical/mechanical', is there a 'tactical'? At higher levels of skiing, one needs to be fine tuned to the terrain beneath your feet. This is especially true for people prepping for L2/L3 exams where we all tend to over think the technical at the expense of making peace with the hill. How we think and deconstruct a transition is fine, but we have to be careful not to divorce it from the slope and relegate ourselves to being 'form' over 'function' skiers. Watch a WC skier and the transitions they make. You'll see the full spectrum during a run (including recoveries) and elements of all in many turns. The best modulate pressure, edge angle, line, etc... Which transition might best address a steep fall away turn? Which for the opposite? Video like this is the stuff that I find invaluable:
And SMJ, I'm most certainly not a know it all. Matter of fact, I'm highly suspicious of know it all's, especially those who brush off questions to their 'authority' as was done early on with Zenny. The best instructors I know welcome questioning. Hopefully you can see the difference in tone in this thread than those that Bob B authors. Bob invites you to reinvent and test. He's offering ideas and not so much in the way of hard. fast definitions and more definitions of those definitions. Those that he does put forward, he's the first to say go test in on snow. As far as anonymity goes here, if you'd like my name and personal contact information, I'd be happy to share it with you via PM. In the meantime, more slomo transitions... the hill IS the context:
Sorry, can't seem to embed the last one. So in closing, turn by turn in each vid, what is it? ILR, OLE, what was it, SAR? Cross over? Cross under? Skiing is fluid and complex. It's great to break something down and play with it in a drill, but then we have to apply it to real skiing. The skiing in the three vids above isn't 'brain off' stuff at all. Clearly the three women have deeply ingrained movement patterns that allow them to use all the tools at their disposal for a particular outcome on a particular trip down the hill. What's interesting is seeing their tactical application of those skill sets. At some point, the trees have to become a forest.
Please supply You-tube link to first video; it won't play for me.
Originally Posted by Rick
Lots of Pivots in them thar hills. ^^^
That's what anticipation does for you.
Watching those slo-mos, you know it's going to be a pivot , before the skis even release, by the amount of anticipation present.
It baffles me, why so many teach "face down the falline" as the go-to rotary strategy. Don't we have enough habitual pivoters on the slopes, without growing another crop of them? Pivots are generally the intermediate plateau skier's nemesis, their default transition anyway It's a bad habit they picked up early on, and used as a survival tool. They don't need help making their pivots better, not yet. First they need help learning to ski without them. Hold off on it, at least until the student can initiate cleanly. Help them learn to make THAT their default transition.
Stop changing the subject!
However, yes, that's the trouble with copying the best; where do you start? (obviously, to me anyway, not with the pivot).
It looks like you and Marko are talking past one another.
Marko's point that I see clearly is function dictates form, and that form often will not be cookie cutter ILE, OLR, Pivot,
If I (not a big guy) am on my SGs (very stiff) and I anticipate making a hard left on an icy surface, I will use a lot of ILE before neutral to gain altitude so that when I am subsequently pressuring that outside tip I have my mass already moving down into the snow and it will allow me to exert lots of force before I am accelerated too far up and unable to keep enough down-force to hold the edge. (Just like the stivot, this is not something to teach a barely ripe beginner).
If I'm on a nice steep slope, and on my SCs with no other complications, I will tend to use what is more like an OLR with no ILE force before neutral.
If I'm racing someone to the lodge, I will modify the amount of force to favour uphill edges versus downhill edges a lot more than I will if I'm just cruizing along by myself.
If I need to gain elevation, ILE. If I need to lose elevation, double leg retraction.
If my skis don't have enough time to come around in a clean carve, I will get them off the ground and pivot them.
In other words, the blending of movements depends on the situation and will more often than not NOT correspond with a clear definition of which transition I am using.
The individual movements during the transition are just part and parcel of my entire cm flight path, and the path of my skis. Imagine skis and boots and a portion fading into legs as a remote control toy car (or golf-cart for you instructors ) with it's own set of curves to follow, and your upper body and head as a remote control toy plane (or toy helicopter) equipped with camera, and the two are connected. You don't even need to define where transitions begin and end.
Edit: I learned very early on in my skiing that it was a lot easier to get the snow to turn my skis for me than for me to turn them, so I missed out on the intermediate pivoter's plateau.
Edited by Ghost - 12/7/14 at 7:29am