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Stenmark Youtube Find

post #1 of 22
Thread Starter 
Apologies if this has already been posted.
Some interesting footage of Stenmark from Japan in 1989. First half is career highlights then some demonstrations after the 11:00 mark. Wish I understood Japanese...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zCJmJxFerQk
post #2 of 22

No apologies necessary.  I've never seen that video.

 

Stenmark has ALWAYS been my biggest ski hero.  That was just fantastic to watch.

 

Thanks!

post #3 of 22

Ditto what Bob said, except that I do remember this video sponsored by Solomon after Stenmarks retirement.  I have been looking for it for quite sometime, thanks for posting.

post #4 of 22

My favorite quote about Stenmark was that photographers didn't like him.  He was always so smooth and balanced that he never looked very exciting in racing photos.

post #5 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by mudfoot View Post
 

My favorite quote about Stenmark was that photographers didn't like him.  He was always so smooth and balanced that he never looked very exciting in racing photos.


That's what strikes me about watching Mikaela Schiffrin ski, too.  They just look like nothing ever puts them out of that perfectly balanced position.

 

I get goose bumps watching either one of them.

post #6 of 22
Thread Starter 
As an aside, if you want to download youtube vids to your hard drive you can go here and enter the URL:

http://keepvid.com/

P.S. - I do not work for keepvid.
post #7 of 22

Nice.

post #8 of 22

 Where is he these days? Does he still ski? I was sorta captivated by both him and Bjorn Borg as a kid... then Peter Forsberg ... those Swedes.

post #9 of 22

Ditto the above; one of my all time favourites and was lucky enough to see him ski (WC Kitzbuhel) in 1981.

post #10 of 22

When I watch Stenmark I see him as very fluid, and balanced in the sense that his upper body is rock solid still for the most part. But I do see a lot of things going on down below - frequent recoveries with his footwork, occasionally skiing on the inside ski when normally he'd be on the outside, and also frequent skate steps to inject additional speed, which I guess was standard slalom technique for his era.

 

I also can't help but see both Stein and Schmidt in his skiing, but I guess that's not so surprising, as Stenmark himself had to come from somewhere, and no doubt legions of skiers, racers and otherwise, were inspired by and tried to model their own skiing after the guy who was the best of his time.

 

One question: There have been a lot of discussions here on Epic, ( not so many lately, more going back a few years), having to do with one versus two-footed skiing. Although there is a section in the video at about 20:35 where he's doing quick carved turns down the fall line that appear to be two-footed, for the most part his skiing is clearly one-footed. Typically that is explained away as a by-product of working with the equipment of the time. But if that is so, please explain this to me...

 

 

Is that not in one sense a description of how to ski like Stenmark?

 

 

Update 11/24/14: Ski Magazine has now posted the above online...

 

www.skinet.com/ski/article/clinic-where-things-happen-fast


Edited by jc-ski - 11/28/14 at 12:07pm
post #11 of 22
I think you're seeing Stenmark in Schmitt's skiing, not visa versa. I'm sure Stenmark influenced Scott's skiing when he was racing as a kid. Stenmark influenced all of us who raced in the 70's. Anyhow, no time at the moment, but if you have access to an early copy (mid 70's) of Warren Witherall's 'how the racer's ski', many of your questions would be answered.

(I'm sure Stenmark was influenced by Killy and Duvillard, maybe Karl Schranz when he was a kid, and kept a close eye in Gustavo Thoeni when he was a young WC'er. I'm sure the Maher's were doing a few things worthy of his attention as well, and visa versa. smile.gif

Most of the free skiing in the film was shot at Niseko. Interesting bits in the commentary..,Schladming world championship SL, he won by 3 seconds, etc... There's more, just no time.
Edited by markojp - 11/22/14 at 10:41pm
post #12 of 22
Thread Starter 

Man can ski...

 

 

post #13 of 22
The idea was it was stepping up hill with the ski pointed down the fall line which gave faster times as less turn was need for the ski. Simple explaination. Truth the straight ski didn't turn as tight and the boots couldn't provide the same leverage as modern equipment so it was a bit of a requirement.
post #14 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by markojp View Post

 if you have access to an early copy (mid 70's) of Warren Witherall's 'how the racer's ski', many of your questions would be answered.

Also, the pictorial book "World Cup Ski Technique" by James Major & Olle Larson, is about 80% Stenmark (the pictures in James O's article above come from it).  Along with "How the Racer's Ski" & Joubert, that book was my ski bible in the early days!

 

CREATOR: gd-jpeg v1.0 (using IJG JPEG v80), quality = 80

 

 

 

Again I am with Bob Peters with comparisons between Stenmark & Schiffrin, not so much the technique but the balance, natural ability & goosebumps bit :o .

 

JF

post #15 of 22

The only thing to apologize for is that you didn't embed it:D

Great find

post #16 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by jc-ski View Post

 

 

One question: There have been a lot of discussions here on Epic, ( not so many lately, more going back a few years), having to do with one versus two-footed skiing. Although there is a section in the video at about 20:35 where he's doing quick carved turns down the fall line that appear to be two-footed, for the most part his skiing is clearly one-footed. Typically that is explained away as a by-product of working with the equipment of the time. But if that is so, please explain this to me...

 

 

My understanding from recent lessons is that a key characteristic of good skiing is that the outside ski has more pressure than the inside; however, the exact proportion differs, and modern skiing (modern skis) encourages a *more* two-footed approach. But that doesn't mean 50/50.

post #17 of 22
As someone who only learned to ski 8 years ago, I find these old videos unpleasant. I get that people at the time were constrained by the gear. But all this stepping about wrecks the carve. It's almost like watching a different sport. (I'm sure he's a great skier and i would appreciate his turns on modern gear.)

Funnily enough, a lot of the older people I've taught are stuck in a timewarp using the technique of their 80s idols. While they can get down the hill, they've never felt a real carve.
post #18 of 22
In ski racing, it's the first 1 to the finish. Nothing else matters.
post #19 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Peters View Post
 


That's what strikes me about watching Mikaela Schiffrin ski, too.  They just look like nothing ever puts them out of that perfectly balanced position.

 

I get goose bumps watching either one of them.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by mudfoot View Post
 

My favorite quote about Stenmark was that photographers didn't like him.  He was always so smooth and balanced that he never looked very exciting in racing photos.


Great find!  He looks balanced even if he were just on the inside ski, as does Shiffren (on the rare occasion she needs to recover).   You guys are the experts in technique (certainly not me).  So, what gives these gifted athletes better balance than everyone else?  Is it strength and/or something else?  I know I have difficulties carving linked turns using only one ski.

 

Back then we often "stepped up" to get a better line.  The skis were longer and not shaped much, so stepping-up was faster than edging/bending the ski so much that it would slow you down.  Watching Ligety and others ski GS on the straighter skis reminds me of that, except they start the turns today so much earlier with tons more angulation & inclination. 


Edited by quant2325 - 11/23/14 at 10:21am
post #20 of 22

Metaphor alot of us older guys have no problem rolling our ankles on the latest equipment and doing a two ski carve but when you grow up skiing and use independent leg action and un-weighting you understand that the two ski carve type of turn doesn't really travel well on steeps/trees and bumps.For me , and I'm sure plenty would disagree , their is nothing wrong with independent leg action on the latest skis ( and we get to use 175's yea!!! )

post #21 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by 4ster View Post
 

Also, the pictorial book "World Cup Ski Technique" by James Major & Olle Larson, is about 80% Stenmark (the pictures in James O's article above come from it).  Along with "How the Racer's Ski" & Joubert, that book was my ski bible in the early days!

 

CREATOR: gd-jpeg v1.0 (using IJG JPEG v80), quality = 80

 

 

 

Again I am with Bob Peters with comparisons between Stenmark & Schiffrin, not so much the technique but the balance, natural ability & goosebumps bit :o .

 

JF

Warren Witherell's book was the first I bought because we were too poor to have decent coaching where I lived.  I shared it with all my teenage friends, and we learned a lot from it.   He was a genius for figuring out the simplicity of the turn: "Put the ski on edge, pressure it correctly, and it will take you where you want to go."  The only thing that changes throughout the years is when to put the skis on edge, and how to pressure them.  Everything else is ad nauseam commentary for the instructors (which I enjoy reading).

post #22 of 22
 
Originally Posted by markojp View Post

I think you're seeing Stenmark in Schmitt's skiing, not visa versa. I'm sure Stenmark influenced Scott's skiing when he was racing as a kid.

 

Of course Schmidt came after - I guess I wasn't clear. I simply meant that when I watch Stenmark freeskiing aggressively it reminds me of Schmidt freeskiing aggressively.

 

You're absolutely right on the second point...

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=pPZ1oLBvkAg#t=149  (2:29 into vid if link doesn't take you there)

 

Interesting that even on fatties in pow Schmidt can frequently be seen in that vid stepping hard on his outside ski and lifting the inside.

 
Originally Posted by markojp View Post
...if you have access to an early copy (mid 70's) of Warren Witherall's 'how the racer's ski', many of your questions would be answered.

 

I have that and have read it a couple times, and understand it's focus on bending the ski to edge/carve, and that one-footed skiing was required with skis of that era to make them do that. But this was really my question, which no one has addressed...

 

Is that not in one sense a description of how to ski like Stenmark?

 

That question is in reference to this...

 

www.skinet.com/ski/article/clinic-where-things-happen-fast

 

And that instructional piece, by a top level PSIA Instructor, in a national ski publication, is clearly advocating one-footed skiing (on modern skis). Also seems an awful lot like what Lito was suggesting in his "Breakthrough On Skis" books and videos twenty years ago.

 

I don't have any issue with any of that - it's all good as far as I'm concerned, and to my eye Stenmark's skiing is incredible and beautiful - but a lot of people seem to feel strongly that "we don't (teach people to) ski like that anymore".

 

Well, guess what?


Edited by jc-ski - 11/30/14 at 2:36pm
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