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Exam costs - Page 2

post #31 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by markojp View Post

Sometimes in the the examinees head. smile.gif

I'm  not sure that this is the case most of the time.       Back to the flying world, I believe overall passing rates for aviation check rides are somewhere around the 85% mark.   There is at least as much opportunity for performance anxiety in an aviation check ride as in a skiing cert exam.  If someone that isn't qualified, were to pass a check ride, then peoples lives are at stake.  YM

post #32 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by yogaman View Post

If SSD and trainers can't get examinees up to speed for a cert exam,  how good are we at being effective teachers and coaches for our students?  After all, we may only have 1 or 2 or several hours with our student but an examinee has multiple clinics, training hours and opportunities for being coached.    YM 

We had pretty good exam success rates for both L2 and L3 this year. Part of it was a change in required training that got a very nice training vibe and broader participation by people not specifically planning on doing an exam. That said, it's nearly impossible to train someone for the real mental deal of exam day. I choked completely on an L3 try and nearly everyone I knew and had skied with on our staff was suprized. In the end, you have to be able to pass on your worst day. I had my worst days. I sucked. My goal the following year was to 'suck less', and by that I mean mentally. I did all the off the home hill prep and did the exam checkpoint a month before the exam at the area i was planning to test. The examiner/trainer asked what we were working on. I was honest and said 'my head'. I'd the Friday pre-exam day as well and skied with one of my L2 examiners. Had a great day. I knew the hill, gear was dialed, i was rested, fed, and ready. He helped me get mentally dialed in, told me what to showcase in my skiing, and generally got me into the 'focused but relaxed' game face I needed for the rest of the weekend and usually have no teouble with when out free skiing. I felt calm, prepare, and confident. I felt like I owned it. The exam was successful and indeed felt pretty easy compared to the previous attempt. It's rare in any sport that one coach/mentor can reach into the minds of his/her charges. My trainers did a great job, but I was the one who had to deal with my worst enemy. I met him, and he was me.
post #33 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by yogaman View Post

I'm  not sure that this is the case most of the time.       Back to the flying world, I believe overall passing rates for aviation check rides are somewhere around the 85% mark.   There is at least as much opportunity for performance anxiety in an aviation check ride as in a skiing cert exam.  If someone that isn't qualified, were to pass a check ride, then peoples lives are at stake.  YM

I don't know that comparing flying is the way to go... Nor would or should L3 be compared to medical school. Skiing isn't rocket science. In the end, I think there'd be different pass rates, greater overall professionalism, and yes, intensity if top levels of certification commanded a rate of pay commensurate with the effort spent on passing. Most of us are weekend warriors, and it's tough to pass L3 if you're not teaching full time and aren't at an area with good training and support systems. The 'well move then' argument losses steam as most of us make our livings in other fields of work and ski for fun and recreation and aren't willing to put our families in financial jeopardy to pursue the 'ski dream'. All the above is IMHO of course. YMMV.
post #34 of 41

Can't think of many circumstances that yield such poor passing rates for any sort of professional certifications as is found in  PSIA cert exams.   Why are the candidates not better screened at prep events?    What's the motivation of the organization to administer exams to unlikely candidates?  YM

post #35 of 41

PSIA West is more expensive. They just posted the tentative calendar of events.

 

Ski module for L2 and L3 are two day events. and if you take it at most resorts it's 200.00  (100.00 per day)

Mammoth Mountain the lift ticket is NOT included but they offer a 15.00 per day ticket for PSIA event attendees. Their own employees of course have their employee passes.

Most other mountains include the lift ticket in the event cost.

 

The Alpine Teach module is a 3 day event and again 100.00 per day at most resorts. 115.00 at alpine for a total of 300 (345) for the teach module.

 

You MUST pass the ski module before being allowed to take the teach.

 

It does look like there are more opportunities this year than last.. It made it very hard training wise for some of us that signed up for exams last year and had them canceled, then moved and changed a couple of times.

post #36 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by yogaman View Post

Can't think of many circumstances that yield such poor passing rates for any sort of professional certifications as is found in  PSIA cert exams.   Why are the candidates not better screened at prep events?    What's the motivation of the organization to administer exams to unlikely candidates?  YM

It's better perhaps to compare to other sports rather than knowledge professions (medicine, law, architecture, etc... ) As a 9 year old, i was pretty sure I'd be both starting tight end for the Detroit Lions AND an Olympic skier when I grew up. smile.gif

Maybe something like a martial arts instructor is a better comparison.
post #37 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by markojp View Post


It's better perhaps to compare to other sports rather than knowledge professions (medicine, law, architecture, etc... ) As a 9 year old, i was pretty sure I'd be both starting tight end for the Detroit Lions AND an Olympic skier when I grew up. smile.gif

Maybe something like a martial arts instructor is a better comparison.

The chances of getting to Olympics as a skier or the NFL as a TE  is pretty remote for anybody.  As for martial arts,  I have a little experience there having earned  black belts in 4 arts.   Took lots of tests but never failed one.   When my instructors thought I was prepared,  any testing was just a formality.   Still trying to figure out why the failure rates are    so  high  with PSIA.   I know many folks that have attempted levels II and III and failed.  In some cases I don't think they were even remotely ready IMO,   so,  why were they given the OK  to attempt the exam?   In other cases,  multiple examiner/trainers  felt they were ready, only to fail the test.     My thought with most testing   is that you train to the point that the test  is easy.   If the standards were clear,  then everyone should be on the same page.   YM

post #38 of 41
I've seen people get pretty sore about not being signed off to test. Seems no one wants to hurt anyone's feelings. That said, I'm sure every mountain has different pass rates. Those more involved in PSIA I'm guessing are higher, but I have no statistics on the matter
post #39 of 41

The mountain where I currently teach has as it's SSD a PSIA  examiner who is a transplant from another PSIA division.  Although he did a great job joining our ski school 2 years ago, I don't see his presence on the mountain as a force in developing  strong skiers or creating strong candidates for certification.   In his defense,  ski area management   keeps him pretty busy off the snow.    As has been mentioned before,  until ski area management gets behind the process of supporting the development of capable instructors with strong training programs,  I think we will limp along with the status quo.  YM

post #40 of 41
Thread Starter 

I started skiing in 2000 and have had the good fortune to be part of the Breck unlimited lesson program, have  many Level 3 and examiner level mentors and the ability to attend cert clinics at Breck.   What I have observed is that there are some people who don't take the demos, the prep work and the substantive stuff seriously.  They may be good all mountain skiers but to pass the test, you have to do what PSIA wants and the way they want.

 

I think some of the cert prep clinics at Breck could be harsher in the sense that people need to be told if they are not meeting the standard.  Some clinicians do that and some don't.

I want honest feedback and coaching so that I can make an informed decision about whether to go the exam.  I now teach at Snowmass. I was not able to go to cert clinics at Snowmass last year but have rearranged my schedule this year so that can happen. It will be interesting to see the difference between Breck and Snomwass  with regard to training.

 

I have been told to go to Level 2 for a couple of years. However, I knew my bump skiing would not pass.  It might pass on my best day but I want to be able to pass on my worst day.  New boots and other training has definitely been a boost for me.   

 

In my opinion, RM has made the requirements very clear.  I am not sure some people take the requirements very seriously.

post #41 of 41
PSIA exam cost is remarkably good value. BASI ( British ) is more expensive.
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