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Any Frankenbinding makers out there?

post #1 of 12
Thread Starter 

Hi all - Realize this is a real red flag to the engineers and retailers here, but curious if anyone has ever tried mixing and matching toes with heels. Yep, realize bindings are designed as a system, realize small differences in angles can make big differences in release, and so on. But also know that makers frequently recycle the same toe, say, with a new heel. Moreover, all bindings basically use variations on the same design. Obviously, one would need to use some judicious release tests to see if the resultant abomination was up to standards. But that seems feasible, and the creature would permit us to match a toepiece we love with a heel we love. Or not? 

 

IT'S ALIVE!! :eek

post #2 of 12


not exactly what your looking for but sort of.   rottafella/rotamat tele/rando combination.  I like to be able to lock the heel for the long narrow trails when skiing out of certain back country areas.

 

If I mounted the toes onto a Voile(besser) release I would even have lateral and vertical toe releaseability

 

 

post #3 of 12

I have but on a smaller level. There are ways to resurrect older Salomon & Look bindings to modern standards. 

 

 

The AFD from a Sth16 (Not Sth2 16 or Sth12/14) will fit older metal plated Salomon Drivers back to the 957. It is also possible to either swap the bake assembly on some or take the brakes apart and move the arms to the older platform. 

 

Similar update can be done with Look Turntables. the 180* toe from the 12/14 DIN bindings haven't changed in about 8 years, the wide AFD can be brought back to them for a more positive platform. The turntable assembly, while not inexpensive can be used with upper dildos back as far as the Z heel. 

post #4 of 12

Anyone done a Driver toe to an MRR heel?

post #5 of 12

When an old Look heel blew on these F17s I dropped a Marker step in heel on them and skied them a couple more times before retiring them.  I honestly don't see any major problems with doing stuff like that with the standards being pretty much the same but what do I know??  My biggest potential problem was that the Marker heels were even more prone to exploding than the Looks were hahahaha..

 

 

BTW, it wasn't the exact Marker heel from the CS Formula ski, bumpfreaq now has those skis.  It was a similar model in black..

post #6 of 12
Thread Starter 

There are some great ideas here! (Speaking as a man with a nearly new MRR sitting in a bag in his ski gear box. But yeah, not a model of reliability) The AFD is nice to know about. Part of what engendered this thread was ruminating on the new Marker tech binding that has a full lateral + vertical release heel, no pin attachment. Hmmm...

 

Do you guys then adjust the release on a shop tester, or just offer up a premium beer to the deity of your choice? 

post #7 of 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by beyond View Post
 

 

 

Do you guys then adjust the release on a shop tester, or just offer up a premium beer to the deity of your choice? 

Depends on the shop. First the binding will fail visual inspection. Now, if the shop will test it to see if it functions properly, that is up to them. If a shop knows that you are going to ski it if they test it or not, why not test it? At least you will know if it functions properly. If the combination fails miserably, you will at least know, it it works well, it is your call if you want to ski it or not. 

post #8 of 12

Back in the day, and we're talking BACK, elite skiers use to pair up the Look-Nevada or Salomon toes (which required no boot notches) with the Marker explodomat heel. Ski technology then was a brave new world and a mere, double backflip was avant-garde  Wish I had photos.

post #9 of 12
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Philpug View Post
 

Depends on the shop. First the binding will fail visual inspection. Now, if the shop will test it to see if it functions properly, that is up to them. If a shop knows that you are going to ski it if they test it or not, why not test it? At least you will know if it functions properly. If the combination fails miserably, you will at least know, it it works well, it is your call if you want to ski it or not. 

Need to pick your mind about binding mechanics: Does "function properly" mean just the usual lateral release at the toe using a piston?

 

For example, having a full lateral - or even MRR style partial lateral - release at the heel might well change the settings and forward pressure for a lateral release at the toe. The old MRR's had quite a bit of lateral give because of the design, but I assume if we can measure release on a modern FKS, we can handle a MRR. (Although I've never noticed any shop interest in measuring the impact of vertical + lateral at a Tyrolia FD heel, since the lateral doesn't kick in at 180 degrees.) But I'd guess techs now have to think about full lateral with KB's. Does it require one check in front and one in back? And we have plenty of vertical release toes mated with the usual vertical release heels, so I guess that's also measurable. (Although shop guys tend not to measure heel release using instruments, I've noticed.)

 

But delta might differ between the design parameters of the toe and heel pieces, as might AFD's. And AT platforms would also have different weights at the heel, which changes loads acting on the toe. I'm assuming an empirical check would cover all that. Wrong? Right? None of the above?

post #10 of 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by beyond View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Philpug View Post
 

Depends on the shop. First the binding will fail visual inspection. Now, if the shop will test it to see if it functions properly, that is up to them. If a shop knows that you are going to ski it if they test it or not, why not test it? At least you will know if it functions properly. If the combination fails miserably, you will at least know, it it works well, it is your call if you want to ski it or not. 

Need to pick your mind about binding mechanics: Does "function properly" mean just the usual lateral release at the toe using a piston?

 

For example, having a full lateral - or even MRR style partial lateral - release at the heel might well change the settings and forward pressure for a lateral release at the toe. The old MRR's had quite a bit of lateral give because of the design, but I assume if we can measure release on a modern FKS, we can handle a MRR. (Although I've never noticed any shop interest in measuring the impact of vertical + lateral at a Tyrolia FD heel, since the lateral doesn't kick in at 180 degrees.) But I'd guess techs now have to think about full lateral with KB's. Does it require one check in front and one in back? And we have plenty of vertical release toes mated with the usual vertical release heels, so I guess that's also measurable. (Although shop guys tend not to measure heel release using instruments, I've noticed.)

 

But delta might differ between the design parameters of the toe and heel pieces, as might AFD's. And AT platforms would also have different weights at the heel, which changes loads acting on the toe. I'm assuming an empirical check would cover all that. Wrong? Right? None of the above?

By "Function Properly", I mean that the test within the correct range for the particular skier. Someone mentioned a MRR heel with a Salomon Driver toe, I would first make sure there is proper ramp, 2-4MM from heel to toe, then test them. The MRR heel might be 3mm, the Salomon Driver toe can be up to 10mm, so the heel would need a lift for any chance of functioning properly. I still don't know of a way to test a KB heel laterally and what their DIN correlates to. There is no way to test vertical toe release. 

post #11 of 12
I ran Solly Toes & FKS Heels for years on a pair of Bros as the holes were already in the right place & I wanted the toes gas pedaled & the back low.
post #12 of 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by iriponsnow View Post

I ran Solly Toes & FKS Heels for years on a pair of Bros as the holes were already in the right place & I wanted the toes gas pedaled & the back low.

I would be interested how they function tested. 

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