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Looking for that 18 radis easy to ski, high preformance GS ski - Page 4

post #91 of 104

does this mean buying another ski? :nono:

post #92 of 104
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by markojp View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by levy1 View Post
 


OK I am hearing you. PM Sent

 

 

Finally!!!!!    :beercheer:   (and we're only on the 3rd page!)

Hey! Work with the newbie here! You know, I was just thinking that I can short swing, or GS turn my Kendos and they are 22 radi!

post #93 of 104
So how did you make short turns in the straight ski era? You bent them. Some things don't change. In that regard you're anything but a 'newbie'.smile.gif
post #94 of 104
Thread Starter 
Yes but I had stiffer boots and stronger legs I wonder what my volkl p9rs 210 would have been radius wise?
post #95 of 104

It makes no difference what radius they were, as they were skied entirely differently. If you felt like you were carving them, it's because you were able to stand on that downhill ski with force, bend it, and get some serious rebound from the tail as you transitioned to a new turn. I spent a lot of time racing through the 70's and coaching in the early 80's. It's interesting to watch video from that era.  You bent the ski into the shape to pull off the size turn you needed. I actually have a pair of 210 P10's in the basement, bent with force many a time. 

 

My dad would be 98 if he were alive. I recall skiing with him back in the early 60's, when his set up was either a wooden pair of 207cm Kastle SL's, or a 210cm Head Vecrtor GS……with Molitor lace race boots, and Marker turntables with the long thongs. He was a very strong skier, and "stand on that downhill ski" became a way of life for quite a while as a youngster. He actually had me on the front of the boot a lot more than I realized at the time.  

 

My son's a coach in this era. I just watched some summer video of some highly skilled U-16 boys, skiing in drills, and in a timed course on 188cm 30M GS skis. These kids generate enormous edge angles, and that is absolutely key. The skis have a flex pattern that enables them to really get a lot out of the skis, but getting them up on edge, quickly, and getting that tip engaged is critical. They also are SO fundamentally sound that every turn looks perfect. Their turns look nothing like ours did in the day. Many of these boys are making equipment changes, as while every company has put resources into developing these skis, they are not all alike, and some work much better for some kids than other. They're all different. 

 

I would listen to SS. He will be invaluable in his help. This can be confusing. My daughter is a former NCAA racer, and in her quiver are a pair of 177cm non-rockered Kendo's. She skis them rail to rail, and there's no "short-swinging". If she wanted little turns, it would be on a 157cm SL ski. If you have them on edge, with the technique of today, they do not like to be skidded. They carve 22M radius turns. She also skis a 180cm Bonafide, and a 185cm Patron…..and those skis will smear, skid, etc., and carve bigger turns, which hers normally do. 

 

I'll share one more story. SS and I are friends. I bought  pair of 180cm 18M Head iSpeeds from him this fall, He told me that they sucked as a Masters GS ski, and that they were pretty beefy. {So am I}. I explained that I had no intention of getting near a race course. I wanted them to be able to rip, at a decent speed, in a decent sized turn shape, on my pretty big, often rock hard, and buffed home hill. Closer to 3000 vertical feet. 

 

I've long ago adapted to today's skis. I bought my first 188 K2 4's literally an hour after Bode won the JO's SG on the ski, and had the first production pair of 193 Volkl Race Carvers sold in the US { Iwas pretty connected with their race group}, in a then "short" 193cm.  For my purpose, under my feet, SS thought the Heads would be great. And they are. 

 

He's put a lot of time into his passion, and he really "gets it." Tremendous resource, smart, and great guy. He'll steer you to a ski that you'll enjoy, and that you'll likely change your technique a bit with….getting them up more on edge, getting a bit more rail to rail, and not skidding much. 

 

I think your most recent list is a good one, thought you've mentioned budget and that's a tough one with Stockli. I'm contemplating a couple of pairs {I have some aging ones that have been GREAT skis} and I just choke on the price. Not seeing a lot of "deals" on them!

 

Best of luck. Enjoy the summer. 

post #96 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by markojp View Post

So how did you make short turns in the straight ski era? You bent them. 

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Muleski View Post
 

It makes no difference what radius they were, as they were skied entirely differently. If you felt like you were carving them, it's because you were able to stand on that downhill ski with force, bend it, and get some serious rebound from the tail as you transitioned to a new turn. 

 

Didn't race on my straight 207's-210's, but still have a pair. My impression is that "felt like you were carving them" is the key concept. Pressure the H out of the outside ski, feel the edges dig in, ride that rebound. But the initiation and the end of the turn didn't have much to do with carving. Or start to finish bending. Bending occurred once you were in the turn. The start and finish were stivots or pivots or whatever you want to call a rotation of the ski achieved by unweighting. 

post #97 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by beyond View Post
 

 

 

 

Didn't race on my straight 207's-210's, but still have a pair. My impression is that "felt like you were carving them" is the key concept. Pressure the H out of the outside ski, feel the edges dig in, ride that rebound. But the initiation and the end of the turn didn't have much to do with carving. Or start to finish bending. Bending occurred once you were in the turn. The start and finish were stivots or pivots or whatever you want to call a rotation of the ski achieved by unweighting. 

Or a step uphill onto the new outside ski!

post #98 of 104

Yep. ^^^^^ Lot of that, very dramatic feeling. 

post #99 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by Muleski View Post
....I wanted them to be able to rip, at a decent speed, in a decent sized turn shape, on my pretty big, often rock hard, and buffed home hill. Closer to 3000 vertical feet. 

....

 

Mule, mind telling which one of our NE rock hard buffed home hills is yours?

post #100 of 104

Sugarloafer since 1960. One ten year hiatus to Stowe. 

post #101 of 104
Levy, if ScottSkier doesn't have any 23m skis, try these guys. I was up there last week and they had a boatload of skis. You'd have to call though since they havent updated their list. Skis come in for consignment every day.

http://www.edgewiseskiservice.com/
post #102 of 104

levy1, posted pic's of his turns and himself skiing in another thread, don't let him fool you, he is better than he lets on :D.

 

Best comment I can make is ski one of the longer radius and one of the shortest radius both in the same manner, grasping the differences will make a you better skier.

 

levy1, hill time and enjoy.

 

Cheers,

post #103 of 104
One on each foot? Like trying on boots? Cool.
post #104 of 104
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Muleski View Post
 

Sugarloafer since 1960. One ten year hiatus to Stowe. 

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tog View Post

Levy, if ScottSkier doesn't have any 23m skis, try these guys. I was up there last week and they had a boatload of skis. You'd have to call though since they haven't updated their list. Skis come in for consignment every day.

http://www.edgewiseskiservice.com/

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by oldschoolskier View Post
 

levy1, posted pic's of his turns and himself skiing in another thread, don't let him fool you, he is better than he lets on :D.

 

Best comment I can make is ski one of the longer radius and one of the shortest radius both in the same manner, grasping the differences will make a you better skier.

 

levy1, hill time and enjoy.

 

Cheers,

Muleski, I enjoyed reading your article and especially about your Dad. I hope to meet you on your hill this year.

Thanks Tog, I will try them.

Oldschool, I will not be able to demo before I buy.

As far as SS goes, he has been invaluable through this process. While  others have given up,  the poor guy has stayed with me and consistently will PM me with help. I really appreciate you guys and many others who have helped me. 

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