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anyone ski the Jak BC for AT?

post #1 of 13
Thread Starter 
Looking to add another ski to my quiver, this would be my BC setup only (for the east). Looking at the Jak BC vs. the BD Havoc. Anyone ski either of these set up for AT use? How do you like it or can you provide a comparison?
post #2 of 13
I ski the BD Havoc w/ AT setup. Haven't skied the Jak or the Jak BC, and don't know anyone who has. From what I've read in comparisons/reviews, the Jak BC would be a softer ski longitudinally. The Havoc is fairly stiff longitudinally.

The Havoc skis LONG. I have the 173cm models, and compared to my Fischer Big Stix 8.6 in 180cm, there's almost no loss of stability at high speeds on groomers or hardpack. However, the Havoc doesn't have the same damp yet powerful feel of the Fischers. I guess that's the tradeoff when the ski is designed for backcountry AT/tele use, they keep it light by losing the heavy metal or synthetic damping sheets.

I like the Havoc, but didn't ski it very well until I figured that my lack of binding delta on the Naxo AT was causing me to ski backseat relative to my alpine ski setups. Once I shimmed my heels, the skis came alive.
post #3 of 13
Thread Starter 
I am having the same problem with my Explosives - which I have mounted with Freerides right now - they put me way too far in the backseat for my liking, and I could not get comfortable (i mounted the skis boot center, per manufacturer). I might have to try that before getting rid of them, which is what I am currently inclined to do. How did you shim the heels?

Where did you mount the bindings on the Havocs? Boot center, or forward, and if so, how far?
post #4 of 13
I mounted the binding boot center, probably should have gone 1cm forward.

Right now I'm using simple wedges under my footbeds... don't laugh, it works!

Over the summer I'm going to try to fabricate some sythetic material shims to go under the Naxos.

Don't sell the skis just because they're putting you in the backseat. That's not a ski issue. It's a binding/boot/skier issue.
post #5 of 13
Thread Starter 
They are also too stiff for my liking...
post #6 of 13
I am having the same problem with my Explosives - which I have mounted with Freerides right now
Don't the Fritchi's have a small shim under the toe-piece which can be removed pretty easily to change that angle?
post #7 of 13
Originally posted by JeffW:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />I am having the same problem with my Explosives - which I have mounted with Freerides right now
Don't the Fritchi's have a small shim under the toe-piece which can be removed pretty easily to change that angle? </font>[/quote]I've talked to several people who have done just that and are much happier with their setup. You could also add something under the heel if you're concerned about removing pieces of your bindings.
post #8 of 13
Thread Starter 
hmm, i will try that out and ski on them again to see if it makes the difference, though that ski is quite stiff for my liking (i gave it a try though...)
post #9 of 13
Thread Starter 
also, just for the heck of it, i did contact BD about removing that shim. They, in turn, wrote to Fritschi. The reply, as expected, was that it should not be done because it will void the warranty on the Freeride.

Here's Fritschi's response:

"As far as bindings that are in the market are concerned, we do not recommend to make any technical changes as we can't take the
responsiblity for funtionality and safety."

So there you go...but, it may work!
post #10 of 13
I have to first start by saying I am not a fan of BD skis. Regardless of what the adds say, I don't believe foam core skis are any better than they were 10 year ago. They all seem to be unlively to me.

I use the JAK BC for AT use. I was actually involved with the designing of the ski. The difference in the JAK and JAK BC should be mentioned. The JAK used Titanium to regulate the flex pattern. Then JAK BC uses Carbon Fiber. Both are wood core skis. The tail went from a full twin tip to a raised tail this year to make it more functional in the BC. The base was changed to a harder composite. The edges are considered a micro edge to decrease the weight of the ski. The edge also has a full ski wrap, meaning there is not seam. The JAK uses a more standard width edge.

The JAK BC is lighter and softer flexing than the JAK. It is specifically designed for BC and Off-Piste skiing. It has a pretty light swing weight for a fat ski, is good in about every kind of snow conditions. The two areas it is not real good in include hard pack and bumps. Any fat ski is going to be challenged in the bumps.

I agree the center mount possition is too far to the rear. Karhu is addressing this issue. The reason why most AT skis have their center of balance rear of where they should be is a ling discussion. What I do with my skis is mount center boot 3/4 of an inch to the rear of where the manufacture recommends.

I've never heard of the recommendation for a shim in the heal. If anybody has any more information on this, I'd like to hear what people have to say.

post #11 of 13
Thread Starter 
BTW, this is the recommendation I got from the shop for mounting the Jak BCs..if you're mounting them with Randonee bindings, your boot center mark should be 932mm from the tip (36 3/4"). So you are suggesting mounting 3/4" back from that? If so, how have you found that for landing/skiing switch? My concern again is my weight being too far back since the Freeride has a near zero ramp angle...
post #12 of 13
Thanks to those who pointed out a mistake in my post.

I actually miss wrote the post. The mfr. recommended mounting position is a little too far forward in my view. The problem is that you need to weight the ski in the front heel area to carve the ski in it's natural arc. I've played around with the position and found that if you move the center boot position 3/4" rearward, the balance position will be in the arch area when carving. You may find the tip to be a little squirly on hardpack. This is not a great hardpack ski anyway. It is afterall designed for the BC. Hope this helps.
post #13 of 13
Check the below web site for mounting instructions on Karhu skis.

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