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Review: 2011 BMW 135i M-sport vs 2002 Toyota Highlander 4WD snow performance - Page 3

post #61 of 78

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by dawgcatching View Post
 

 

It all depends on the car.  We used to have a 535xi T wagon, and my friend has an X5.  535xi T has more room in the trunk area (in terms of length) and just as much legroom.  Drives way better too, better MPG.  He couldn't find one at the time he got the X5, and wishes  he would have held out.

Totally agree. We have a an '06 BMW 530xi wagon. My wife's car andour ski sled. With studded Haks all around it is a beast in the snow. Just shy of 200k miles as well. Over the past 13 years I have put about just shy of a half million miles of three Audis - '99 A4 sedan (150k), '01 S4 (252k - still going strong) and my current ride - '09 S5 (73k). I know that Audi is supposed to have the best AWD systems, but that BMW is the match of all of them. Utterly unflappable and, more important, totally predictable. But no manual tranny, which I think is the most important equipment on a winter car (hence my S5). When it comes time to replace the BMW, I think we will go for a used Audi Allroad. The latest generation is remarkably unpopular ( Q5 out sells 10 to 1).and CPO with far less than 10k miles can be had for mid 30's.  

D1

post #62 of 78

I would like to know what the yearly cost of ownership is for that '06 BMW 530xi T Wagon with 200k miles.

post #63 of 78
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghost View Post
 

I would like to know what the yearly cost of ownership is for that '06 BMW 530xi T Wagon with 200k miles.

 

ANY high end car as it gets through 150k and headed towards 10 years old becomes a money pit.(If you're driving it any real miles per year) Cars these days are by design  built and their maintenance geared to get them through warranty. The are less inherently robust for long term ownership.

 

Just look at an e30 3 series compared to an e46 version. Diffs, bearings, gearboxes are all smaller, lighter, and have less oil capacity. We won't even talk about "lifetime fill". Next time a "bargain" comes up in a 10 year old Audi, BMW or Mercedes think long and hard before jumping in.

 

BMW dealers now are in the $125 to $140 per hour range for service (at least around these parts), independents slightly less.

post #64 of 78
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghost View Post
 

I would like to know what the yearly cost of ownership is for that '06 BMW 530xi T Wagon with 200k miles.

Not as bad as you may think.

Brakes, tires, etc as expected.

As for more major stuff, just had to replace first water pump ($1k), but that is something that typically goes, I am told, at about 50-100k miles, and ours is just under 200k. Had to replace a radiator, and the biggest bite was replacing the auto leveling system, which was about $1200. Oh, some tranny work as well that was about $1k. Again this is all over five years of ownership. The BMW dealership gets about $90ph, with independents about the same.

I bought the car in '08 with about 26k miles for $31k (new was in 50's). I think, overall, a pretty decent ownership experience.

D1

post #65 of 78

Fun thread.  A few observations:

 

I owned a 128.  Even without the 135's turbo engine, it was a stupid snow car.  Stupid fun, but still kind of stupid.  It drove great in snow, but boy, you better be paying attention every second, and making minor or not so minor corrections constantly.  Part of the fun, but I sure wouldn't want to deal with it on a long winter road trip.  Important note:  Do NOT stop on any significant incline and expect to resume forward progress!  Second important note:  DO expect to get bawled out by ski area parking lot attendants for excessive donut spinning and broadslides in the empty parts of the lot.  Just too darn much fun.  The middle setting for stability/traction makes a rally hero out of anybody.

 

Most people buy SUVs or CUVs because they have become the modern day equivalent of the full sized 70s station wagon, and most people buy vehicles as appliances, not as passionate toys.  My wife and I just give up on "fun" winter driving and buy a new Sienna AWD minivan every 6 or 7 years.  The first was a 2004 that had a default 50/50 front/rear power split, and I gotta say, it actually was a little bit of fun in the snow.  The 2012 has a default of 95/5, so is no fun whatsoever, but still rocks in snow from a transportation point of view.  And the long wheelbase of a minivan makes it so relaxing and stable on slippery roads, especially on long trips.  But no argument about being no "fun" in the snow.

 

We shopped full-sized SUVs for a year before making a business decision that (thankfully) killed the need for that.  Without even the slightest contest, the Durango R/T was the hands down winner in every category except size.  Maybe that's why it was so much fun.  I'd hate to put gas in it, but that thing was a blast to drive for such a vehicle, and has one of the sweetest exhaust notes around when you stand on it.

post #66 of 78
Quote:
Originally Posted by HRPufnStf View Post
 

Fun thread.  A few observations:

 

I owned a 128.  Even without the 135's turbo engine, it was a stupid snow car. 

 

Not as stupid, I guarantee, as a 1972 BMW 2002. Built before the advent of 4 wheel or all wheel drive, or even traction control. Perfectly balanced for dry road condition, but close to unmanageable in Maine snow. Even with 4 studded snows and sand ballast in the trunk, a trip to the local store for a 6 pack was the "ultimate driving machine" adventure.

D1

post #67 of 78
Quote:
Originally Posted by deliberate1 View Post
 

Not as stupid, I guarantee, as a 1972 BMW 2002. Built before the advent of 4 wheel or all wheel drive, or even traction control. Perfectly balanced for dry road condition, but close to unmanageable in Maine snow. Even with 4 studded snows and sand ballast in the trunk, a trip to the local store for a 6 pack was the "ultimate driving machine" adventure.

D1

 

That's interesting. I went on a number of ski trips in New England with a friend who drove a gorgeous later 2002 ti w/somewhat rare limited slip rear diff (look for an "S" stamped or painted on housing). With four snows and some gear in the boot, it was a Panzer in the snow.

 

That was also my experience with the e36 cars, again with a mechanical limited slip. Our e46, no longer available with that option, instead now relying on a FAR inferior traction control system was barely useful at all even with 4 Blizzaks. Now only M cars have mechanical limited slip. (BMW, you suck)

post #68 of 78

For a couple of years I drove to work daily during the snowy season in New England to my winter job as a ski instructor in my 1968 Chevelle SS 396 (4 speed stick, posi-traction rear). I equipped it for winter with narrow snow tires, a trunk deck ski rack, and a couple of sand bags inside the trunk along with a shovel - and I got around pretty well most of the time and only occasionally got stuck.

 

My next ski commute car was noticeably better in the snow with the same basic winter equipment - it was a 1971 small-block Firebird. Whatever happened to those trunk deck ski racks that Barrecrafters made?!?!

post #69 of 78
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tog View Post
 

Just don't get a Highlander Hybrid 4wd. 100% useless as an all wheel drive. The rear wheels have their own electric motor that shuts down when tires spin because it get too hot.

 

 

Apologies for being late to the party, but just reviewing the thread now and Tog's comment caught my eye: is this just found in the Highlander's hybrid or is it a fundamental weakness in all hybrids? 

post #70 of 78
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rossi Smash View Post
 

 

Now only M cars have mechanical limited slip. (BMW, you suck)

 

Can I get an amen on that?! Not even as a typically ridiculously overpriced option.

 

My first car was a beater 65 Dodge Dart with a slant 6 and 148,000 miles.  I put a posi rear end on that underpowered dog, threw on some snow tires (recaps, of course), a bit of weight in the trunk, and headed out to Jackson for a winter of ski bumming.  It did great in the snow, but back then, getting stuck a couple of times every winter didn't seem like a big deal.  Always had chains, shovel, and tow cable in the trunk, as well as bundles of youthful optimism and energy.

 

To this day, I remain convinced that a key element in an easy-driving snow car is not having too much power.

post #71 of 78
Quote:
Originally Posted by HRPufnStf View Post
 

 

 

My first car was a beater 65 Dodge Dart with a slant 6 and 148,000 miles.  

 

If there is no slant 6 engine in the Smithsonian there sure as hell should be. 

It is an American icon. 

D1

post #72 of 78
Quote:
Originally Posted by deliberate1 View Post
 

 

If the is no slant 6 engine in the Smithsonian there sure as hell should be. 

It is an American icon. 

D1


 The Leaning Tower Of Power...  :-)

post #73 of 78
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott43 View Post
 


 The Leaning Tower Of Power...  :-)

True that. Known as the "G" engine, it certain hit that spot as an utterly dependable engine in the US market for nearly a decade. Not too many engines that can boast such a life span.

D1

post #74 of 78
Quote:
Originally Posted by deliberate1 View Post
 

True that. Known as the "G" engine, it certain hit that spot as an utterly dependable engine in the US market for nearly a decade. Not too many engines that can boast such a life span.

D1


 The "Warranty Engine"...because it never broke...  :-)  The sound of that Dodge starter will be in my head forever..

post #75 of 78
Quote:
Originally Posted by deliberate1 View Post
 

True that. Known as the "G" engine, it certain hit that spot as an utterly dependable engine in the US market for nearly a decade. Not too many engines that can boast such a life span.

D1

 

To be fair, this was during an era of, if your American made engine went to 100k you threw a party :yahoo:

post #76 of 78
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rossi Smash View Post
 

 

To be fair, this was during an era of, if your American made engine went to 100k you threw a party :yahoo:

In Maine, the bodies typically rotted out well before the engines gave up.

I remember how exciting it was when the odometer in the old Chrysler hit 100,000. We took pictures.

I wonder when American odos were changed to six digits. Paradigm shift.

post #77 of 78
Thread Starter 

Just a follow up: the Dunlop Winter Sport 4d has to be a major component to this car rocking in slick conditions. The other day, I had a nice black ice commute (freezing rain the night before) and in 15 miles, the DSC didn't even come on.  I was rolling down the highway at 45-50, with a lot of confidence.  Pulling out in the morning, I saw 4wd trucks fishtailing all over the place, and most traffic was doing 30-35 on the highway.  I am pretty cautious in those conditions, but the tires really had a ton of grip.  

 

I also had my first deeper snow day, around 7" of new, heavier snow.  The car got through it just fine.  I continue to be very impressed with the performance of the little 135i in bad weather.  Only downside is that it too short to fit more than a pair of skis in the car.  I may need to add my ugly rack/rocket box.  The upside is that on the (many) warm days we have had so far, the car has been a blast to drive hard, which is why I got it.  The respectable slick road performance is just a nice benefit. 

post #78 of 78

^^^^ I hear you on the size of the 1ers.  Not that it would have made it any longer (a teeny bit shorter, actually), but if I could have had the practicality of the 5-door HB version sold overseas, I would never have gotten rid of my 128.  Never.  Keep having fun with the 135!

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