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Worth it? Flourocarbon wax on extruded base

post #1 of 15
Thread Starter 

Sintered bases were introduced years ago &  are pretty much the standard for most adult skis.  Along the way fluorocarbon waxes have also become more widespread and most believe produce a better glide than hydrocarbon waxes.

 

My situation is that I've been tuning/waxing my own skis with fluorocarbon waxes, but have 4 small kids that have started skiing the past few years & I'm questioning if I should use LF wax on their skis or just stick w/ hydrocarbon.  I feel guilty using a better wax on mine & being cheap with theirs.  I also do NEED them to have good glide as their weight & skill tend to leave them walking on catwalks, to the lift line, etc.

 

With their skis having extruded bases, is it worth waxing them w/ a LF or will it just bleed off in a few runs?

 

Zenny?  Jaques?  Any insights or experience you can share?

post #2 of 15

If it  *really* makes you feel guilty, google Holmenkol Trimaxx.     

Should work *better* on extruded bases than on sintered ones.

post #3 of 15

My opinion after raising two skiers who were also ski racers, use the inexpensive wax.  LF might make a little difference for part of the morning.  The more important issue is keeping their bases waxed regularly.    I used flouro for my kids at races, but frankly, their race skill (or lack thereof) makes up the vast majority of their race time. 

post #4 of 15

Considering how toxic fluoro is, perhaps the best way to show your love is to stop using it altogether, that is, unless you're all high-stakes racers.

post #5 of 15

@ rskornak,

 

I understand the need to have the kids gliding well and having some fluoro in the wax will, for sure, be very helpful.

 

Grease, dirt and even pollen (aka G-D-P) that accumulates on the snow can adhere to the base and make for very slow skis and having fluoro in the wax not only reduces water friction (its primary function), but also is excellent for keeping much of the GDP from sticking to the base.

 

The best performing and most economical, fluorinated wax for extruded bases would be the no-iron Momentium Waxes.

 

http://www.dominatorwax.com/products/momentium-warm

 

Momentium is simple, and quick to apply, as it does not need to be ironed in. These are competition-grade, fluorinated waxes in a jar and one

40-gram jar can prepare so many skis or boards that I am sure you will lose count. Momentium waxes are not costly at all as the price per application is just pennies. Momentium comes in warm and cold formulas; nice to have both, but if you only can choose one then the colder (harder) formula is the choice for your purpose. The key is to apply a thin coat over a clean base, let it dry, then polish to a shine and brush (you can even skip the brushing for the kids).

 

Momentium should keep the GDP away and give good glide for many runs -- maybe half a day -- and you can re-apply while having lunch, or taking a quick break from the slope.

 

Best of luck with the squadron,

 

Tom

 

 

 

 

post #6 of 15

Unless you are racing Nor-AM speed events you are wasting your money on Fluro waxes. Wax everyday before skiing with the hydrocarbon wax of choice and your skis will be faster than the guy who wax's once and a while with the high fluro $$$$ stuff. Even when racing at the u16, u18 level one bad turn will make more of a  difference than a $50 wax job will.  Fast skis come from repeated waxing, brushing and skiing not from spending $$$ on a magic wax to put on for race day. 

post #7 of 15

   I'm inclined to agree with 1skierbob--nothing replaces good prep work (read: thorough brushing/structure break in) and regular waxing. I've seen skis run faster with good prep and regular CH waxing than those that just had a spendy wax job applied and little to no structure prep work. But yes, an extruded base doesn't really absorb so.....

 

   DomTom's post is very compelling as well-- I suppose ultimately it's up to you and your level of time/financial commitment, I wouldn't sweat it too much though :).

 

   zenny


Edited by zentune - 11/26/13 at 7:29am
post #8 of 15

Unless you are racing (and not really some local races, but higher level) my opinion is, that money is better spend with other things, then on fluoro waxes, especially in alpine skiing (xc is a bit different thing). And with better spend, I mean buy extra box of beer for you, and extra box of chocolate for kids ;) Does it really matter if you are down the slope 0.5sec faster? For fun skiing, I don't think so. But that's just me... someone who is still using Swix HF waxes at the moment. But to be honest, only because I got them for free, since friend who fills my supplies didn't have any CH left. :)

post #9 of 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by cantunamunch View Post
 

If it  *really* makes you feel guilty, google Holmenkol Trimaxx.     
 

 

post #10 of 15

@ rskornak

 

Just to clarify, extruded bases do not absorb hot waxes very well, so the answer to rskornak's question concerning the kids skis, is to insure good glide and GDP abatement by applying surface waxes.

Using a non-fluorinated, hydrocarbon surface wax will help and be better than a bare base, but having fluoro in the surface wax -- especially on extruded bases -- is significantly more helpful than straight hydrocarbon waxes for both glide and help in repelling GDP.

 

So if the cost per application is just pennies, and slippery skis helps the kids have fun, then fluorinated surface waxes are well worth the low cost and easy application.

 

Go to:

 

www.dominatorwax.com

 

For more detailed information on how waxes function and the best wax selections for your needs.

 

My best


Tom

post #11 of 15

try it once, report back. not the end of the world.

post #12 of 15
Thread Starter 

Thanks for the opinions.  Looks like I'll be trying some Dominator wax this year.  I especially appreciate the GDP perspective, i would have overlooked that aspect.  Again, it's not about shaving 1/2 a second off of a race time, it's about saving them from having to walk 50 yards to the lift when their glide stops.

post #13 of 15

@ rskornak

 

The Dominator Momentium waxes are not only for the kids skis and/or extruded bases, but can also be used for your skis as an overlay, or for quick application when the snow conditions change.

Its a good idea to keep your skis running as fast as theirs.

 

Happy Gliding!

 

Tom

post #14 of 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by rskornak View Post
 

Sintered bases were introduced years ago &  are pretty much the standard for most adult skis.  Along the way fluorocarbon waxes have also become more widespread and most believe produce a better glide than hydrocarbon waxes.

 

My situation is that I've been tuning/waxing my own skis with fluorocarbon waxes, but have 4 small kids that have started skiing the past few years & I'm questioning if I should use LF wax on their skis or just stick w/ hydrocarbon.  I feel guilty using a better wax on mine & being cheap with theirs.  I also do NEED them to have good glide as their weight & skill tend to leave them walking on catwalks, to the lift line, etc.

 

With their skis having extruded bases, is it worth waxing them w/ a LF or will it just bleed off in a few runs?

 

Zenny?  Jaques?  Any insights or experience you can share?


Weight of the skier is a huge factor.  Forget about a fancy wax for the kids.  Focus on brushing out the skis well.  Use Dominator Zoom for them.  The Hyper Zoom has some fluoro.  Use that for the wetter times.  Use Graphite Zoom for the colder fresher times.  For "normal" times just use Zoom. 

Although the skis are extruded they still need wax often for good glide.  Maybe more often.  Wax just long enough to get the ski warm once. Don't use a lot of wax!   Let cool a long time.  Scrape and brush well.  Structure of the base is what you need to focus on here.  If you finish with nylon or horsehair it will be best to not remove all the wax, but rather leave a very thin highly polished layer on the extruded base.  You cannot over polish with a nylon or horsehair brush.  The more the merrier. 

post #15 of 15
Thread Starter 
Jaques - great insight thanks. I figured I'd be better leaving some wax on the extruded bases vs the intense brushing we do on sintered bases. Snow is on the way...
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