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Praxis Ullr- anyone??? or feel free to suggest deep day skis..

post #1 of 82
Thread Starter 

I have been thinking about a deep snow ski. I have a DPS112 and an unleashed hell (I will sell one of these) but want something for deep days and cat skiing in light, low moisture snow.  Something maneuverable and not too stiff, not a hugely splayed tail (DPS is fine) and something that tends to reward a drifted rounded turn shape skiing style. I like that surfy loose feel (not a soft mushy ski feel!) in deep. I am not hucking anything. Primary use will be in trees; not a lot of open steeps (Except in cat skiing)  This is just a ski for those foot plus days (yes, I get many).  I don't want anything over 125 and prefer ski's in the 184-186 length. 



I do like to try different skis so when I ran across these, they look very interesting.  I don't want anything over 125 and prefer ski's in the 184-186 length. 


some others on the list


sali rocker 122

Moment New bibby pro

Rossi Super 7

Line sick day 125


Just food for thought.....




List away please! 

Edited by Finndog - 10/24/13 at 5:39am
post #2 of 82

I just bought 185 Ullr's; Keith is pressing it in a week or so, he says. Will report back when we get a serious dump in New England. ;)


But we seem to have a lot of the same criteria, I looked at a slew of skis, came down to these.

post #3 of 82

4FRNT Renegade 186cm

post #4 of 82
Thread Starter 

I should throw the Shiro in there too.  

post #5 of 82

Unleashed Hell is too small? Damn, I wish I had that problem - I'd probably solve it with a Radict - which I think has been renamed BushyWayne or something like that.

post #6 of 82
Thread Starter 

no, not too small really but there are several days where is knee to waist deep and a bunch of fun short but low angle pow areas where a wider ski will kill it  

post #7 of 82
Thread Starter 

Hmm, radict was on the original "list" I cut it due to underfoot but it does have a nice 18m tr....  Anyone have any time on these? 

Edited by Finndog - 10/24/13 at 7:48am
post #8 of 82

I picked up a pair of 185 medium stiff carbon's Ullar's this summer.  Very few reviews on this ski.  They sure are pretty though. 

I'm hoping this will be my single pair travel quiver for soft snow, heli/cat trips with a couple of days resort thrown in.

Debating buying Dukes or mounting w/P-18's, which I already have, right now.

post #9 of 82
Thread Starter 

Cool. I wish there were some on the snow tests. 


In the mean time, a couple of skis to add to the list  K2 pettitor 120 and maybe a return to the Bentchetlers.  I like that ski a lot but I was skiing it too far forward and its not as good as the DPS112 in less than deep snow.  


Anyone ski the pettitor?  

post #10 of 82
Originally Posted by Finndog View Post

Cool. I wish there were some on the snow tests. 


In the mean time, a couple of skis to add to the list  K2 pettitor 120 and maybe a return to the Bentchetlers.  I like that ski a lot but I was skiing it too far forward and its not as good as the DPS112 in less than deep snow.  


Anyone ski the pettitor?  

I loved the few runs I took on the Bent Chetler last April in Alta... Amazing ski! It has lot of tip and tail rocker and it's 1cm wider than the DPS112, not a fair comparison for the poor Atomic in "less than deep snow" :rolleyes


Will take the chance and suggest Protest, I'm really curious about this ski... I like the flatter tail on them, never had a chance to try though, also wider than what you want 128mm underfoot! Wish they had a Protest in the low 180s... :(

post #11 of 82
Thread Starter 

yeah, short list now: (no order)


Armada Bubba (yeah, wider than spec'd but looks like a blast)- Looks like a fun deep snow and low angle pow ski. 188 measures in at 185.5ish. A ARG ski that can be surviable on soft groomers on the way to freshies.....


Atomic Benny- fun, fun fun. A prime contender. 


Praxis Ullr- a risk but I love the dims.  Looks like Keith may have nailed this one.


Sali 120- hmm, looks good...


K2 Pettitor - again, looks good, fantastic reviews everywhere. 

post #12 of 82

I was on the Ullr last year and it did not work for me (although I continue to be a fan of Praxis and what they do). Our powder skiing gets tracked out quickly and bumps form with powder in the troughs so I needed a ski that could do both. My terrain/skiing preference is steeper, technical terrain at moderate speeds with many turns and I had been on the 195 Super 7 for a few years and loved that ski but wanted a bit more float (6', 220 lbs). I went with the Ullr with carbon and in the medium flex (actually the soft side of medium based on Keith's flexing of my Super 7's; Praxis version of medium is pretty stiff). In generally untracked snow like under the Red Dog chair into Poulson's they were very nice but on West Face as the bumps started to form I was getting tossed around big time. I took a flyer on a pair of Icelantic Keepers and that ski works perfect for me. The best way I can describe them is as a slightly larger pair of Super 7's that are almost as easy to ski as the 7's but do everything better. They are happy to charge but are basically quite turny. Outstanding in the spring corn.

post #13 of 82
Thread Starter 

hmm, maybe a size thing?  Both Beyond and I are 6' 165 (Im 167/8) more finesse skiers. Are these large firm bumps. I am not familiar at all where you are describing. I want a powder ski for deep days not just a pow ski that also doubles as an all mountain ski. I have the DPS and Unleashed Hells for that (and the unleashed is probably better) 



Still open to ideas. I also like that Protest. Gonna add that to the list.  


I keep coming back to the Benny though especially with the added carbon in the tips and tails.  I REALLY want to like the bubba for that surfy floaty kind of ski. My concern is how they do once it gets a little tracked and bumped in the trees. I think they would be fun on low angle stuff and just kill it on cat trips. - not much info on that ski either but reviews I have found are good. Super pivoty, easy to drift out but decent enough to ski on a soft groomer to the lift. Also can be skied on cat tracks. 


new list


Bubbas- 188


Bentchetlers- 183


Praxis Ullr and Protest  185/187

post #14 of 82
just seen a psa on tgr, 12/13 bent chetlers on artfire (I have no idea what that is) for $319+$10 both sizes available... this might make your decision easier :-)

btw, I thought you'd go for the longer bent chetlers, specially as a cat, deep pow ski
post #15 of 82

I only have a little time on Ullrs - couple mornings in less than perfect conditions - found a few good pockets, but ran into lots of wind scrubbed hardpack. I need to fool with Ullrs more to have a more in depth sense of them.  That said, a few initial observations. Typical crazy good Praxis build. Keith's designs are IMO always well thought out for their specific design point. It is a surfy powder ski with  sidecut w/ relatively long edge contact that'll carve on edge. While I have not put them up against one another - I suspect you'd see some parallels between the Ullr and the more recently released Rossi Super 7 - with the Ullr being a bit wider (and hence presumably surfier), and having what I think is a better soft snow camber profile. 


That said, IMO the Praxis Protest is a truly sick ski for the kind of skiing you are talking about (see an assortment of reviews and discussions at Blister). Out of four active skiers in my family, every one of us has a Protest for big or really soft mushy days. Most of the family was skeptical when they first saw mine - but one by one they converted. To the point where one remarked on the phone last night - unprovoked - that in his opinion the Protest is the single best thought out ski ever made (for its mission). Just reporting that. 


Regarding the Renegade - great in soft snow, but crazily demanding on firm snow IMO. I've skied them a couple days and found them truly punishing on firm snow.


There's a euro crew that has posted a ton of videos of themselves on a range of Praxis skis. No idea who they are in real life. Protests in action (first half anyway)...



If you want to see them on the feet of a less capable skier, dredge up my Stevens and Iceland videos...


Oh - I assume you are aware of this, but the October Praxis 20% off deal makes those skis beyond a sick value IMO.

post #16 of 82

Ski I have really liked on big snow days.




DPS 138


ski I have yet to try


Praxis Protest

Praxis GPO

DPS Spoon 120


Not a big fan of the RP112


Big fan of the 115mm under foot sizing

6'1" 190#   (188cm/196cm generally)

But also found I really like some of the same skis in 178/182cm with lwt TLT boots.


DPS RPC 192cm is one of my all time favorite soft snow skis..knowing full well just how much fun the 138 can be in the right conditions.  RPC doens't need perfect conditions to be a really fun ski.  I does everything a RP112 does just does it a whole lot better and faster.  And it does 90% of what a DPS138 does imo and does 75% more than the 138 can't even think about doing.


Curious for this season to get started to find out for myself  just how good the Protest and GPOs really are.  Hard to beat that 20% off coupon!


For what you have described..soft snow ski that will also get you around the mountain, the Huascaran will do this and more, "That surfy floaty kind of ski.  Good once it gets a little tracked and bumped in the trees. Way fun on low angle stuff and should be a weapon on Cat and Heli trips."


Huascaran is old school trad skiing that surfs and smears with ease.  RPC is new school and more of it.

post #17 of 82
Thread Starter 

Hey guys thanks for the input.  Dane yeah for 80% of my pow skiing, totally agree the 112-15 is dialed.  But, no, I don't need to get me around the mountain.  for inbound deep days, I want it to be able to be skied on broken or soft groomed but its not where I will be skiing.


Gonna take a more serious look at the Protest and yeah, with the 20% off becomes really enticing. All good points and yes, I want a ski like that; and something that deliver more floatiness than my 112 or unleashed especilly given that I do a week of cat skiing in British Columbia (BC) plus a couple of days at steamboat powdercats in addition to some of the truly deep days we get,  



FWIW- I skied the Bentchetler in knee to waist deep in BC and never had an issue with the 183 plus is turned on a dime in tight trees.  So given my prior experience on the Benny, any thoughts on the comparison between the Benny and the Protest. There's some big differences in construction of course but the 187 vs 183 lengths are actually less than 4cms in reality. 



i have always been shy of skis with large tr's like the protest but I do tend drift my pow turns and make turns more like in my Icon and upright 2 tooted and balanced over the ski. Do you think this is a good match for my style regardless of the TR.  I honestly haven't skied a large TR powder ski. I wold think that that becomes much less of an issue. 


Inboutnds, here's a good idea of the trees and terrain. Its not crazy or other, its just fun






Edited by Finndog - 10/25/13 at 5:35am
post #18 of 82

Icelantic Gypsy-180cm


At the very edge of your waist width limits, but still quite dynamic for this kind of ski.

post #19 of 82
Thread Starter 

so if I now reduce the list to 3 fun pow boards....


Praxis Ullr


Praxis Protest 



post #20 of 82

I replaced my 192cm 138 Pure with a 187cm carbon Protest.  Knowing that I'd had some of the best powder days in my life on the 138s.  It was also the only ski that ever hurt my knees.


Hoping the Protest will give a similar ride.  Reviews seem to think so.    TR on that ski hasn't seemed to be an issue when so many have compared it to a dbl rocker, reverse side cut  138.  Blister reviews commented on the comparison iirc.  Spindrift can off more thoughts on that as well I suspect.

post #21 of 82
Thread Starter 

Hey Dane, I just heard back from Keith, the Ullr is not what I am looking for. The Protest would make a much better match. I really am looking for a different kind of ski than the 112 or Unleashed. I love that slury drifty ski feel. I do want to be able to ski it on a cat track and get around the mountain without burning out my ankles or knees though.  Thats where the 138 doesn't make it and I think the Bubba will put me in the same place too.  Fun though on a cat day of course. I think the Protest or the Benny is where I'm going to. The benny isn't really the same ski as the Protest though. 

post #22 of 82

Sorry man wish I had more to offer you for opinions/experience.  Have yet to ski my Protest or GPOs.


I do have some heli and cat experience.  And know what it takes me to get through a really big day there.  I've not tried the 120+/- skis yet.  But I don't like the feeling of being on the wrong ski in what are really  perfect conditions.  138 was a perfect example of that.  When they were good they were amazing.  When they weren't they really sucked.   Never had perfect conditions on every run,  anywhere.  I want the added versitility of doing "everything" with as little as effort as possible.  Some trade offs on both ends of the spectrum generally.


All that is why I suggested the 115+/- skis.  RP112 isn't one of them how ever.  I like much less rocker tip and tail.  Hoping the GPO will do it all much better.


Wish I could read all the reviews now that will be written this winter:D  Including my own on the GPO and the Protest!


Either way you are looking at some nice skis.

post #23 of 82
Originally Posted by Finndog View Post

so if I now reduce the list to 3 fun pow boards....


Praxis Ullr


Praxis Protest 




First, to address the turn radius thing. As noted by McConkey back when... sidecut is not your friend in powder. The only reason a modern "dedicated" powder ski has sidecut is as a concession to when it has to be out of 3D powder, slush, etc. The better designed modern powder skis will give you a choice of smeared/skidded turns and  rather "arced" turns in powder and soft snow - despite often having negative, or large turn radius specifications. Often allowing tighter and more controlled "arced" soft snow turns than their more sidecut kin.


For comparison, the skier in the family I mentioned above normally skis a 2 ski inbounds quiver. Bent Chetler and Protest. Bent Chetler for day to day messing about and when he wants to focus on playing switch & spinny in powder. Protests for most of the big days & the kinds of soft snow skiing it seems you are interested in. (not that the Protests can't ski switch or that the Bent Chetlers can't ski powder in general - but they do seem to have their personalities).


FWIW, I like the Protest mounted on the mark and skied pretty centered. It'll definitely handle cat tracks, crud, etc. when you need it to. But obviously it was designed to excel in softer snow. It rolls narrower than the waist might make it seem it would because the wide points are not that wide for a "fat" ski. And while far from a traditional carver, it'll let you use the edge under many conditions.

post #24 of 82
Thread Starter 

thanks Spin!, yeah, its a 2-horse race now with the Benny and Protest, I wish I knew how the Protest would handle tighter trees as I pictured above. Thats the only thing holding me back on them now, The Bennys handle those with aplomb and with the stiffer tips/tails (then the prior version I owned; still not stiff though) seem like a very hard ski to beat. THe other issue is stiffness; you just don't need a stiff ski for this kind of terrain, not skiing at mach looney speeds so that is a concern to me and I don't want to build out a custom ski on the protest.    

post #25 of 82

easy! buy both... Protest when you want to charge deep pow and the bent chetler when you want to jib deep pow! :-)

post #26 of 82
Thread Starter 

great idea, just Pm me with your CC info  :D 


Thinking of Benny's,  

post #27 of 82

Are the Bent Chetlers really $700?  If so the Full on custom Praxis in carbon, your choice of top sheet and flex..is $856 with the current coupon.  $428 now and the other half in 30 days.


:devil:You could have some of them  ellusive one of a kind "Findog" skis that turn on a dime in tight fluffy trees :D.


This is the line that sold me on a pair of custom Protests.

"The Protests love going fast down the fall line, but they aren’t beasts to turn at slower speeds. (The DPS Lotus 138 Pure is probably even better at executing quick turns at slow speeds in very tight trees, but the Protest isn’t far behind.)"


and the two reviews that got me thinking Praxis a couple of years ago



Concept review....pre Protest



Bent has way more rocker than the Protest...looks and I bet skis a lot like a fat RP112





Looks to me like you found your bone, Dog:yahoo:


Thanks for the education on some new ski it was fun!

Edited by Dane - 10/26/13 at 1:31pm
post #28 of 82
Thread Starter 

bennys are $430.00 


Again, if I had the opportunity to demo the protest, it would be a different game.  not fully decided and you are making it more difficult!  :D  I am not ripping down the fall line though; that's a ski I don't want. Also, I don't think the BC has too much rocker; for deep days, its a good thing. That rocker allows quick ,effortless turns in areas where the trees are 5-8' apart (not that that's crazy tight, its just where we ski). I don't see the protest doing that. I haven't seen one review or claim that it can. that's the real issue. My workhorse pow ski will either the the 112 or the Unleashed hell which for 70% of the time is the right width (112/113) for storms up to about a foot.  I have skied the dps112 in knee-to waist-deep several times but a wider ski for those days is better. I skied the BC in those conditions cat skiing and they are better. My prior issue with the BC was hooky tips and I may have had them too far forward. (team line is good but I think going just a touch back from there would be better) but someone else must have thought that too as they added carbon stringers in the tips and tails making them a bit stiffer and more damp. I am also a better skier now than 3 seasons ago.  


I still need to do a "ski-off" between the two (112 vs Unleashed). For the days where it's marginal 4-6" you really want a ski that can handle chop and piled. This is where I think the Unleashed will prove to be a better ski. But I also want a wider ski (120 and up) to access low angle pow areas that get overlooked. I don't really care if its mellow, if its fresh or settled untracked I'll ski it. The 112/113 isn't enough float to really get into it.  The RPC112 is probably a ski I would love BTW. 

Edited by Finndog - 10/27/13 at 4:42am
post #29 of 82

FWIW if i did not ski in the PNW I would probably still be on the Bentchetler. Crazy fun ski in soft snow. I took issue with it when things got a little more manky. That's why I ended up on Billygoats. That you might consider.


The waist width is decieving. The RES from boot center forward gives the ski AMAZING float, and maneuverability. And if you need to charge....it charges.

post #30 of 82

How dare they charge a fair market price for a real popular ski with the exceptional Atomic build quality.



Originally Posted by Dane View Post

Are the Bent Chetlers really $700?

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