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which bindings for stockli laser sx? - Page 2

post #31 of 53

Decriptions from Tyrolia:

 

 

POWERPRO PLATE 9
Height: 9 mm
Booth Sole length: 258-372 mm
SL: 261-384 mm
Features: Two-piece FlexSystem supports Freefl ex
Increased torsion stability, control and edge grip
Super Light
 
ULTRA FLEX PLATE 9
Height: 9 mm
Booth Sole length: 258 – 372 mm
SL: 261 – 384 mm
Features: Dampener
Free gliding plate - impact on ski flex greatly reduced
Increased torsion stability, control and edge grip
Oblong holes to maintain ski flexibility
Super Light
 
Not a lot in it, if you ask me. The Ultra Flex claims to have less effect on the ski's natural flex, but at the end of the day only experimentation will decide if that's a good thing for a particular ski, or if it is even noticeable. If in doubt, go with the Ultra Flex (but I'd probably put a Raceplate RDX on them).
post #32 of 53

I've used plenty of the power plates, solid carving plates, don't affect flex noticeably (the plastic isn't nearly as rigid as the ski body or the boot/binding interface laterally, so any claim of increased torsional stability is 98% b.s.; and the heel screw slots are oval, so the heel section can move when the ski flexes longitudinally; any increased longitudinal stiffness is washed out by ability to flex with ski). Weighs about 5 oz per plate. Haven't used the ultra flex, doubt it's seriously lighter since its elastomer will actually weigh a lot more per unit vol than its plastic, the elastomere will absorb jolts, so based on my experience with similar plates from Marker, damper than the power plate, not quite as instantaneous transmission to the edges, also shouldn't affect flex since it rides on the elastomer, not anything rigid. More for freestyle, far as I can tell (Tyrolia website seems to feel too much information will explode our brains).

 

IMO these plates are to enhance leverage and thus quickness edge to edge. Some may enjoy the ability to move the bindings around. But they really don't do much in the way of changing flex. For that you need to go to one of their racing plates. 


Edited by beyond - 5/6/13 at 8:19am
post #33 of 53
Thread Starter 

thanks Squaker and Beyond for your input. I might go with PowerPlate then since it sounds like it weighs less and less dampen less. I definitely want to keep the ski as lively as possible. The Stockli is a pretty stout/heavy ski and I want to keep it as versatile as possible.( given the fact that this is afterall a racing ski, but i did find it to perform all over the mountain very well as long as you worked hard and told it what to do).

I thought the ultraflex might be lighter/more flexible, also since it is red it matches better with the bindings! beercheer.gif

post #34 of 53
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by beyond View Post

IMO these plates are to enhance leverage and thus quickness edge to edge. Some may enjoy the ability to move the bindings around. But they really don't do much in the way of changing flex. For that you need to go to one of their racing plates. 

Beyond do you mean to increase flex? I thought the RDX racing plate will be stiffer than power plate? im a bit confused.

post #35 of 53

OK, by "changing flex," I mean adding to the existing ski's stiffness. Yes, a racing plate like the RDX is significantly stiffer than a carving plate. Carving plates are just that, plastic plates to elevate the boot 9 -13 mm, provide more leverage and boot clearance. 

post #36 of 53
Thread Starter 
Thanks for the clarification!
I'm still debating whether I want to put a plate on these or not...guess I have all summer to decide...
post #37 of 53

If you've actually found a place to purchase the Tyrolia plates then please share. smile.gif

post #38 of 53
Thread Starter 
They are out of the ultra flex but i talked to the guy on the phone(very informed and friendly guy) and he said he has the power plates in stock: http://www.coloradodiscountskis.com/store/product3280.html
post #39 of 53

I'm working on this one, Noodler. Far as I can tell, only Colorado Discount/Denver Wholesale ever stock Tyrolia plates in the U.S., and they tend to have them in small lots, irregularly. Last year they had both the Power Plate and the UltraFlex in stock for the late season. Level Nine stocked Power Plates for several years, but appears to have dropped them. 

 

Other than DWS, I'm investigating how to order plates; and part of the trick is finding a Tyrolia dealer to even place the order. I wonder if Tyrolia is actually phasing out some or all of its U.S. presence. When I see the company here nowadays, it's either clothing and footwear, or some bindings online (very rarely in stores). Fewer and fewer stores sell Heads, notwithstanding their racing chops. I can see this Canadian bootleg thing developing...

 

If there's a Tyrolia rep out there anywhere (already posted a thread asking about this), can I just add that your marketing strategy in the U.S. is confusing, to put it tactfully, when you don't even have a way of ordering stuff, let alone stores that stock it. Or if you're bailing, that would be nice to know since I could divert my binding and plate plans toward Look as need arises. OTOH, if they're bailing, the first guys to get let go would be the reps, so...

post #40 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by faustus View Post

also since it is red it matches better with the bindings! beercheer.gif

Color coordination is paramount. Forget about the rest--flex, mechanical advantage, dampening effect, etc
post #41 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by jzamp View Post

No offense to the poster (got some great gear tips and support from jzamp.. Thank you)...It just makes me laugh silly when I watch a demo like this. I could probably mount a 1 by 1 from homedepot on top of a ski with duct tape, and produce a similar result. The stiffer the ski, the less chatter. What I really wanna see, which the OEM won't ever show, is how much difference that gimmicky little piston makes especially with a boot on..probably little to none.
post #42 of 53

@nochaser marketing gimmick? sure, after all they need to impress the customer with something visual...
Although, I can tell you that the piston plate on their SL (no arms) does make a noticeable difference while skiing, both in feeling and in times.
Lots of manufactures used "arms" in the past 2 years... blizzard moved on in 2013 and is now producing traditional race skis, but they kept the piston... wink.gif
 

post #43 of 53
Dont get me wrong - i like gimmicks and gadgets. I don't mind having these skis at all.

When I get the wc racetiger SLs, I sure will experience the piston first handed
Edited by nochaser - 5/18/13 at 12:55pm
post #44 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by nochaser View Post


No offense to the poster (got some great gear tips and support from jzamp.. Thank you)...It just makes me laugh silly when I watch a demo like this. I could probably mount a 1 by 1 from homedepot on top of a ski with duct tape, and produce a similar result. The stiffer the ski, the less chatter. What I really wanna see, which the OEM won't ever show, is how much difference that gimmicky little piston makes especially with a boot on..probably little to none.

To be honest, you're just blowing smoke. I've owned a number of Marker piston bindings over the years, from the old nose mounted versions on 6*'s to my G-Powers with the center-mounted version off the WC plate. Have also skied the Supersonic - same ski as the G-Power sans piston plate - several times. Your basic premise(s), which are either that the piston simply stiffens the ski like a piece of wood, and/or that its impact is "little to none," are both wrong.

 

A piston does not stiffen uniformly. It progressively resists oscillations. So the deeper the bend, the more the piston "brakes" the movement. The less bend, the less effect. The old front mounted piston was obtrusive. I characterized it as "numb" in a review, with an odd flex pattern of a stiffer, damper front and a livelier middle and rear. The Blizzard iteration makes a noticeable difference in both the dampness of the ski and its grip, without altering the ski's underlying characteristics. The G-Power retains much of the snowfeel of the Supersonic, in a more muted way. It flexes as slightly stiffer, but very uniform, and the tip and tail remain fairly lively; much of the effect is underfoot. So where the Supersonic gripped really well but could feel harsh on ice, the G-Power is close to race ski in its pure grip, and smoother than the Supersonic on rough surfaces. Not as much fun in bumps, but that's the tradeoff. For another review on grip, go dig up SJ's post about skiing the G-Power on a race prepped course. Real Skiers also has some reviews of both versions that I find spot on. I also commented on the differences between the Blizzard piston models, Kastle's RX12, and some WC race skis here. Finally, Dawgcatching has reviewed both the Supersonic and the G-Power, as well as the S-Power here at Epic. He's more of a fan of the S, which I can understand. 


Edited by beyond - 5/18/13 at 2:25pm
post #45 of 53
Thread Starter 

What are people's thoughts on mounting +1 on this ski? I am going with Tyrolia FF14s with a race plate. thanks everyone!

post #46 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by faustus View Post

What are people's thoughts on mounting +1 on this ski? I am going with Tyrolia FF14s with a race plate. thanks everyone!

Depends on several things, what you like, BSL , the particular ski etc. I personally normally mount my gs skis a bit forward because I like them that way. Also I am on a 284 BSL so keeps the bof where it would be with a bigger bsl on the line. Depending on the race plate and your bsl it could be easy. If you use thepowerplate and your bsl is >300 or so. You can use a forward set of holes to try it and move back if you don't like it. If you use the RDX plate just put a couple of sets of holes in it to try the different settings. It is a pretty robust plate, I have some that look like a Swiss cheese with multiple mounts on them and not had any issues
post #47 of 53
Thread Starter 

Thanks ScotsSkier. I am using the junior version of the RDX plate which is just slighter lighter and less stand height(and is has pre-drilled positions). My BSL is 305. I am 5'8, 140lbs,fairly aggressive and fast skier.

 

i like the idea of having faster turn initiation with +1 mounting  plus i noticed that these SX s responded better when my weight/position was more forward than on most skis. It seems a lot of people mount Stocklis of all types at +1cm. I did not consider boot size, thank you for bringing that to my attention. My boot is fairly small so the factory recommended spot is most likely for a larger foot thus making the +1cm more valid for my size.

The only thing holding me back is that i do not want to sacrifice stability. What are the possible "disadvantages" of +1?

 

thanks again

post #48 of 53

Hmm, pretty much end up at +1 on most of my Stockli skis Laser SC @ 170cm, Laser SX @ 178cm and Stormrider XXL @ 178cm.  But I also have Vist Speedlock TT plates on all of them so changing the binding position isnt an issue.

post #49 of 53
Where did you get your speedlock TTs? Got my RDX plates in the mail yesterday and oh boy, they are stiff as bricks.
post #50 of 53

Well as I'm in Australia, probably different places to where you would get your; but two sets were through the Stockli importer here in Australia and two sets were through dawgcatching (when I purchased my Kastle BMX108s).

post #51 of 53
Do you know how much additional height from the top of the ski you get out of the TTs?
post #52 of 53
Got it. 16mm (may be available in 14mm also?) freeride plates.

OP: how is your RDX holding up? I see that one end of the plate actually floats while the other end towards the center of the ski is bolted down. Looks pretty fail proof.
post #53 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by faustus View Post

Thanks ScotsSkier. I am using the junior version of the RDX plate which is just slighter lighter and less stand height(and is has pre-drilled positions). My BSL is 305. I am 5'8, 140lbs,fairly aggressive and fast skier.

 

i like the idea of having faster turn initiation with +1 mounting  plus i noticed that these SX s responded better when my weight/position was more forward than on most skis. It seems a lot of people mount Stocklis of all types at +1cm. I did not consider boot size, thank you for bringing that to my attention. My boot is fairly small so the factory recommended spot is most likely for a larger foot thus making the +1cm more valid for my size.

The only thing holding me back is that i do not want to sacrifice stability. What are the possible "disadvantages" of +1?

 

thanks again

 

No disadvantages I have found personally.  I am 25# heavier and pretty competitive in Masters GS and not found any stability issues :)

 

A lot of my team mates have started doing the same thing mounting a little forward, especially on the 27m skis

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