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Hard charging carver for east coast

post #1 of 22
Thread Starter 

I'm looking to add add a hard-charging carver to my quiver for fast turns on hard east coast snow. My current hard pack ski is Dynastar Outland 80 Pro 172cm, which is a decent all-rounder and copes with carving groomers, bumps, and occasional tree runs. I have Line Prophet 98s for deeper snow or crud.


Only problem with the Dynastars are that they get jittery at high speed, and I'm looking to get a more specialized carver for boilerplate days when I just want to hammer the mountain. 


Have demoed a couple GS cheater skis (Dynastar Course Ti, Volkl Racetiger), and these are great at high speed, but only like to be driven fast. I tried the Volkl RTM84, which was a great carver and very stable at speed, so that's a candidate. I've also heard good things about the Kendo.


So my question is: what else should I be looking at? Is the RTM too wide at 84mm? Should I write off all the cheater GS skis, or are there others I should try? 


Me: 6' 2" 200lbs 

Terrain: Mainly east coast (Stowe) with one trip out west each year. Ski mostly groomers, some trees, some bumps

# Days: 35-40 days/year

Level: Advanced

post #2 of 22

Nordica Firearrow 84 EDT or something of that ilk.

post #3 of 22

^^^ Agree it would work for your size, but IMO kinda major overlap. You're also going two ways at once.  You want a "charger," and a "carver for boilerplate days," but you don't skis that want to be driven fast, and you keep suggesting skis in the 80's that are not optimized for ice.


Why not drop down to a ski that will concentrate more force on the edge with less fuss, eg, a real carver, not an all-mountain, but will still be happy at speeds below 35 mph? Say a Stockli CX, or a Blizzard G-Power (coming back next year), or a Doberman EDT GSR Pro, or a Kastle RX12? The 68-74 mm range is your sweet spot for what you call for, IMO. 

post #4 of 22
Agree with beyond. Needs to be sub 72mm. Have not skied the EDT, but have been on the nordica dovy pro cheater for years and can't say enough. I want to say its 66-68 underfoot.
post #5 of 22
Thread Starter 

I'm looking for a ski that is rock solid carving at high speed, but is also comfortable at slower speeds. Somewhere like Stowe there isn't room on the slopes to be going flat out all the time. The RTM84 felt good going fast and slow, whereas the GS skis only felt good going fast. So if there's a ski with the same fast/slow characteristics as the RTM but is a better carver with a narrower waste, that sounds ideal. 

post #6 of 22

Consider the Fischer Progressor series. My several year old Progessors 10+ (think the current equivalent is 950) seem to meet your needs.


I used to use Volkl Superspeeds for my hard snow go-fast ski. The Progessors are almost as good for speed and a lot easier to turn, especially at lower speeds.

post #7 of 22

Yep, if you want a carver that doesn't need to be on ludicrous speed all the time then get a slalom-esque short radius (13m) carver.  They'll handle faster speeds as well, and you won't need to be charging every second.

post #8 of 22
Thread Starter 

Sounds like we're zeroing in on some great recommendations for me to try. How would the Dobermanns or the Progressors compare to the GS skis I demoed (Course Ti, Racetiger)? The specs don't look that different - are they just softer skis? Thanks

post #9 of 22

The GS skis you tried weren't. They were beer league cheaters that are hybrids, part SL, part GS, softer than either. Gunnerbob is suggesting something that's more SL-ish, but also more forgiving. Eg, if your ski can be happy with tighter turns, and you can make them turn more rapidly, finishing each turn, you slow down. A good skier can get down to a slow jog pace. Pretty good idea. In my list that would foreground the CX, or something like a Blizzard or Nordie SLR. The G-Force or RX would work in shorter lengths, where cheaters take on more Sl-ish qualities. For you, that'd be 174 and 176 respectively. 


There also are skis like above but with a bit more flex, so also don't take the force to bend. The Rossi 8Sl Slantnose is a good example; also the Progressor series. 


Winners all. 

post #10 of 22

I have a couple days on my Pursuit HPs, at Stowe, and they fit the bill very well for the conditions you described. 

post #11 of 22
Originally Posted by east or bust View Post

I have a couple days on my Pursuit HPs, at Stowe, and they fit the bill very well for the conditions you described. 

Agree. I have it in a 170cm/16m TR, so around 50mph is all I like. Could vary for others.  Good all around ski.

post #12 of 22

My size/weight is very different from yours (5'7", currently ~160#), but I'd suggest looking at the Heads -- what you describe seems to be their forte.  I found the iSuperShape Titan (78mm) offered great versatility with respect to carved turn radius, and entered the turn very easily (they also make narrower iSuperShapes, the Magnum [71mm] and the Speed [66mm], which I've not tried).   I  found the Titan to be more powerful on edge than the RTM84, with better short-turn versatility (though it doesn't turn as "automatically" as the Volkl, which you may or may not like).   Unfortunately, I did not get to try either of these on ice.  I've also heard good things about the Stocklis (Laser SX) and Kastles (RX12, MX78), but can't speak from personal experience.  In addition (perhaps someone else can chime in here), it's possible the Atomic Doubledeck D2 GS might offer more short turn versatility than the other GS cheaters you tried.  Another one you might like is the K2 Bolt, though I didn't find it as versatile for turn radius as the Titan (the former felt more SL-like to me, though the longer length that you'd be on might feel different).  


One problem with the Titan is the170 felt fine for me, and I would think you'd want to be two steps up in size from me, but the largest they make is only one step up, a 177. 

post #13 of 22

You will have to define what you mean by hard charging a little better.  From my understanding of the term, any ski that is stiff enough for secure comfortable and effective "hard charging", i.e. able to get the force to the tip when push comes to shove, would not be happy going slowly. 


The closest thing would be a SL race ski or one step down (like Fischer WC SC).  It is comfortable going fast, but it's design turn is less than 13 m, so the ski is happiest at about 25 to 35 mph.  It is no problem skiing them slowly, they just don' t seem to be anything special at slow speeds.  They do longer turns at speed on demand, only they are not "cleanly carved."  If your hill has more than 500' vertical and you like to ski fast, you will enjoy the longer turn radius of a gs ski more.  (obviously you need a SL ski for the afternoon and a GS ski for early morningsbiggrin.gif)

post #14 of 22

^^^^ I love the smell of burning corduroy in the morning. biggrin.gif

post #15 of 22
Thread Starter 

I guess I'm looking for something with a roughly comparable radius to my Outlanders (15m) or a little bit more, but which is more secure carving fast turns. The Outlanders are more of an all-rounder - they carve well but get a bit jittery over 25-30 mph.


The RTM84s I tried seemed to fit the bill, and were also comfortable skidding slower turns when there wasn't enough room to open them up - e.g. because of traffic. The Racetigers were also great carving at speed, but really didn't like skidding slower turns at all. Don't know if this is just because the Racetigers are a narrower ski, and that I'll run into the same issue with any narrow carver, or that a different model would work better.


The idea of getting a shorter radius SL-type ski appeals - and I might add that to the list also - but I still want something I can open up and carve GS turns when there's room. My favorite run at home is probably 1,500 vertical feet, so definitely room to get some decent speed up.

post #16 of 22

get some dh skis.

post #17 of 22
Originally Posted by Gunnerbob View Post

Yep, if you want a carver that doesn't need to be on ludicrous speed all the time then get a slalom-esque short radius (13m) carver.  They'll handle faster speeds as well, and you won't need to be charging every second.


I don't think that's the direction I'd go. I'd want to be in the 16m+ range and not too short. I think if you get the very short-radius ones, you are forced into carving everything. I really enjoyed free-skiing this season on my Nordica GSR EDT Evos (20.5m at 186cm). I almost feel like I'd like to have a pair in 182 to just freeski on as these are my race skis and I don't want to burn them out or murder them on rocks skiing them all day. The other skis I use taht fit your bill are the Kastle MX83 in 173, Kastle MX78 in 176 and (no longer with us) Kastle RX in 176.

post #18 of 22

 I think the Fischer Progressors (900, 950, or 1000) or the WC SC C-Line would all be possibilities.  All are recreational skis, not race skis, so will work at normal speeds by mere mortals.  The Progressors are wider all mountain carvers and thus more versatile in exch - ange for giving up a bit of grip on pure ice.  The SC is basically a recreational SL ski.  If I was picking, it would be the Progressor 900.  Its the most versatile of the bunch - firm groomers, bumps, trees and a bit of crud and powder - the sort of ski I could be happy on for 90% of the days we see in New England. 

post #19 of 22

The RTMs aren't exactly stable pocket rockets with their rocker profile, which is likely why the OP feels they're sketchy at higher speeds.  So if not an SL, then a more GS-ish ski.  But something with a more camber profile and stiffer.


If stability at higher speeds is desired, get a stiffer GS-type ski and you're finished.  If you want to go slower and have fun charging, get an SL ski.  Done.

post #20 of 22

Stockli SX is a stable ski with great edge hold, and goes much faster than my SL skis - though it's not as turny as my SL skis. It's 70mm underfoot.

post #21 of 22

atomic or fischer dh skis.


in all seriousness, atomic d2 gs comsumer is a great freeski if u want to go fast.

post #22 of 22

This might be an unpopular suggestion, but one of the better east coast "charger" skis (not to be confused with the K2 Charger which was actually pretty good, but more all mountainy) that I got the chance to try out and really enjoyed was the Armada Triumph. Super stable, great in the turns and seemed really quick edge to edge. It does have a bit of all mountain-ness to it but its pretty quick and feels really solid at high speeds.


I'm not sure how people feel about Armada beyond "its a park ski!", I was pretty sure that was basically all they made, but this one really didn't feel like it. Might be worth a demo.

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